Easy bot game with 4 bot accounts on my own team, please deal with them

LaMalditaRosita·Feb 27, 2018·1 votes·373 views

They'd run down middle lane right off the bat of the game, die, rinse and repeat. I think the scoreboard at the end is enough evidence as to them being bots but I included screenshots of them randomly disconnecting at the exact same times then reconnecting later on at roughly the same times, then continuing along the very same paths they did prior, then some other screenshots of the opposing team getting multi-kills early on in the game. I hope they're permanently banned.

9 Comments

AeroWaffleFeb 27, 20183 votes

I believe riot does the bot bans in waves.

Banning an individual bot is next to worthless, since they'll just create another one at almost no time investment cost.

Better to flag the bots and then ban them some time later. The people who buy said bots will have their accounts banned and their money wasted. The more that this happens the less people buy bots (because they don't want to throw their money away), which decreases the demand for bots.

Awf MetaFeb 27, 20181 votes

{quoted}

I believe riot does the bot bans in waves.

Banning an individual bot is next to worthless, since they'll just create another one at almost no time investment cost.

Bots still consist of a time investment. There is the actual time the bot uses to level. There is the time the programmer takes to fine tune the bot.

Better to flag the bots and then ban them some time later. The people who buy said bots will have their accounts banned and their money wasted.

Taking too long to ban a bot is severely detrimental. Hundreds of games are ruined while the bot levels. After the botted account has been sold, the longer the account remains active, the more valuable the botting service becomes.

The more that this happens the less people buy bots (because they don't want to throw their money away), which decreases the demand for bots.

Bans do nothing against the demand for bots. If anything, it increases demand for "undetected" bots. Bots exist because of bans, bans cause the demand for bots.

Banning a bot reduces supply.

AeroWaffleFeb 27, 20181 votes

Bots still consist of a time investment. There is the actual time the bot uses to level. There is the time the programmer takes to fine tune the bot.

The only noticeable time investment is programming the bot. By banning the bot as soon as you detect it you're doing the programmer a favor. You're showing that the program was flawed. You're helping the programmer fix it faster. The time it takes to level is practically non-existent since a bot will level the account 24/7 with no downtime and many hundreds can be done at once with no human involvement.

Taking too long to ban a bot is severely detrimental. Hundreds of games are ruined while the bot levels. After the botted account has been sold, the longer the account remains active, the more valuable the botting service becomes.

Bots will ruin more games if Riot can no longer tell the difference between a bot and a player. If Riot bans early they help the programmers improve the bots, which will increase the reliability of the accounts sold, which will decrease the caution of the buyers.

Bans do nothing against the demand for bots. If anything, it increases demand for "undetected" bots. Bots exist because of bans, bans cause the demand for bots.

Which is why banning bots in waves is important. It makes the buyer unsure that the account that they bought was undetected or not. If they buy a detected account they're sitting on a ticking time bomb that they can't prevent from being banned.

But if Riot just bans bots as soon as they spot them, the buyer can be sure that the account that they bought is undetected since it wasn't banned yet.

Banning a bot reduces supply.

Bot leveled accounts can be supplied endlessly in a F2P game.

Awf MetaFeb 27, 20181 votes

The only noticeable time investment is programming the bot.

The bot still has to level. That is a time investment. What happens is, bots are more efficient with time than humans. Bots can do things like level 24/7 and use multiple accounts like you said. However, those things still require a time investment.

If Riot bans early they help the programmers improve the bots, which will increase the reliability of the accounts sold, which will decrease the caution of the buyers.

The same is true if Riot "delays" the ban. No matter what, banning tells the programmer they were caught.

Which is why banning bots in waves is important. It makes the buyer unsure that the account that they bought was undetected or not. If they buy a detected account they're sitting on a ticking time bomb that they can't prevent from being banned.

Banning bots in waves is not important at all. The important part is to conceal detection methods. That is done by introducing a random delay between detection and punishment. Ban waves can actually back fire. It allows cooperation between the bots. "Hey we all got banned at the same time but that one guy didn't. Let's compare code."

Some account buyers assume impermanence. They think, "buy a new account every year". Also, like I said, the longer the bought account remains active, the more valuable the botting service becomes. Riot would have to ban accounts very quickly after being bought in order to discourage account buyers.

But if Riot just bans bots as soon as they spot them, the buyer can be sure that the account that they bought is undetected since it wasn't banned yet.

That is why a random delayed ban is useful. Detection can be immediate. Punishment has to be delayed. The problem is the longer the punishment is delayed, the more harm has been caused. There is a fine balance to be had.

Bot leveled accounts can be supplied endlessly in a F2P game.

Theoretically. In reality, law suites happen. Power and internet bills need to be paid. Programmers have to adapt. The general thought within the security community is "99% of cheaters can be prevented/caught. The remaining 1% can only be slowed down".

AeroWaffleFeb 28, 20181 votes

The bot still has to level. That is a time investment. What happens is, bots are more efficient with time than humans. Bots can do things like level 24/7 and use multiple accounts like you said. However, those things still require a time investment.

You're likely looking at only a day to get a bot to the point where they sell it.

The same is true if Riot "delays" the ban. No matter what, banning tells the programmer they were caught.

Banning after the buyer has control introduces elements of unknown to the programmer. For one, they are only aware of the ban if the customer informs them. Second, they can't be sure it wasn't some action of the customer that got the ban or the fact it was leveled by a bot. Third, they wont know for sure if it was some behavior on a specific game that flagged the system, if it was a judgement based on the overall behavior, or if it was because the IP address drastically changed when the account changed hands.

Some account buyers assume impermanence. They think, "buy a new account every year". Also, like I said, the longer the bought account remains active, the more valuable the botting service becomes. Riot would have to ban accounts very quickly after being bought in order to discourage account buyers.

Nothing will stop those players since they hold no value in the account. But people who actually hold value in their progress will at least attempt to avoid actions that will lose all of it.

That is why a random delayed ban is useful. Detection can be immediate. Punishment has to be delayed. The problem is the longer the punishment is delayed, the more harm has been caused. There is a fine balance to be had.

Who's to say that a random delay doesn't happen along with the wave ban?

Awf MetaFeb 28, 20181 votes

You're likely looking at only a day to get a bot to the point where they sell it.

More than a day. I have actual proof and easy math supports. Even then, a day is a time investment. 24 hours of time. That is 24 hours internet. 24 hours electricity. 24 hours hardware stress. 24 hours a human needs to be alive to supervise. 24 hours that are PERMANENTLY wasted if banned. Plus, the extra time now needed to improve the bot and the extra time wasted running a script that has been detected.

Banning after the buyer has control introduces elements of unknown to the programmer. For one, they are only aware of the ban if the customer informs them. Second, they can't be sure it wasn't some action of the customer that got the ban or the fact it was leveled by a bot. Third, they wont know for sure if it was some behavior on a specific game that flagged the system, if it was a judgement based on the overall behavior, or if it was because the IP address drastically changed when the account changed hands.

Bot programmers do not care about those things. Once the account has been sold, the programmer loses interest.

Those things are important for the account buyer. This is where an immediate punishment is useful. The longer a bought account remains active, the more valuable the botting service becomes.

Nothing will stop those players since they hold no value in the account. But people who actually hold value in their progress will at least attempt to avoid actions that will lose all of it.

The time it takes to detect the bought account is the issue.

Who's to say that a random delay doesn't happen along with the wave ban?

Could be. I haven't heard anything from Riot though. Have you?

AeroWaffleFeb 28, 20181 votes

More than a day. I have actual proof and easy math supports. Even then, a day is a time investment. 24 hours of time. That is 24 hours internet. 24 hours electricity. 24 hours hardware stress. 24 hours a human needs to be alive to supervise. 24 hours that are PERMANENTLY wasted if banned. Plus, the extra time now needed to improve the bot and the extra time wasted running a script that has been detected.

Given that they likely have several accounts per machine going at once, it's still an extremely small time investment.

Bot programmers do not care about those things. Once the account has been sold, the programmer loses interest. Those things are important for the account buyer. This is where an immediate punishment is useful. The longer a bought account remains active, the more valuable the botting service becomes.

If you ban an account before it reaches the buyer the buyer never sees the problem. If buyers rarely see their bought accounts banned the demand remains high.

The time it takes to detect the bought account is the issue.

Do you have a solution?

Could be. I haven't heard anything from Riot though. Have you?

I thought you said that it was important for Riot to conceal information?

Awf MetaFeb 28, 20181 votes

Given that they likely have several accounts per machine going at once, it's still an extremely small time investment.

The time investment remains the same. All those accounts have to level up. "Multi-boxing" does not reduce the amount of time needed to level 1-30.

If you ban an account before it reaches the buyer the buyer never sees the problem.

The buyer has a problem though. Supply. If bots are banned before they can be sold, that means there is no supply.

If buyers rarely see their bought accounts banned the demand remains high.

Demand goes down. No need to buy another account.

The time it takes to detect the bought account is the issue.

Do you have a solution?

Ban them faster?

I thought you said that it was important for Riot to conceal information?

I'm not Riot.

Whether a bot is banned instantly or eventually, does not matter in the end. As soon as punishment is handed out, the programmer knows they have work to do.