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If I don't like finishing support (income) items, what should I do with my build?

FistOfSharkiesha·4/29/2015, 4:08:02 PM·3 votes·1,890 views

On all of the mage supports I play, a fully built spellthief's edge is redundant. I usually buy frostfang, get some poke and gold, and sell it when lategame comes around. On tanky supports, I prefer being disruptive as fuck and just stacking tons of armor (drawing the aggro of low elo noobs who only attack whatever is close to them), especially if the other team is very AP or AD heavy where I counter counter their entire team with a few defensive items. Face of the mountain is decent because of the hp and shield, but I still prefer gauntlet, thornmail, etc. I just feel like I do more with non-income items. The talisman is the only build I consider finishing because of the built in MS and the active, but even then item 3800 is way better for that.

So on someone like for example Taric, should I still start with an income item? Is it even worth it if I just sell it or don't finish it?

33 Comments

Deep Terror Nami4/29/2015, 4:20:20 PM3 votes

There's no reason to not have both Talisman and Righteous Glory; just stagger the actives.

pE4CbxDPQO4/29/2015, 5:57:49 PM3 votes

Dont get spellthiefs. Coin is def the way to go. As someone that only plays Morgana or Zyra when supporting, I have found a lot of success going coin>stone>talisman>xyz>abc>def

PepeOnDemand4/30/2015, 4:07:14 AM3 votes

To answer your question about starting with an income item, yes.

Even if it ends up as being useless (not coin , all hail coin) later in the game (Or maybe the item you complete very early or late), it helps to have something that starts you getting gold from the early to mid game and some early stats. Especially if you start with Targon as Taric since mini heal + health is nice (execute more or less depending on situation).

For the matter about whether you should finish or sell your gold income item is highly situational. (Although, coin is love, coin is life.) If you started targon, you dont have to keep it unless you think that you would need the extra cdr and active. (I say extra because I always take locket unless something tells me to not get it).

The only thing that I will stress about your gold gen item is Do not sell it until very late or you are in the way of replacing it with a better 6th item . Stats are important and it will be silly if you just sold that when you have 3 items left to build.

crazymage4/29/2015, 6:15:31 PM2 votes

Frost fang can be really useful if used correctly it help to secure kills or kite the enemy. While Righteous glory is really good on initiation supports it only really works if your ahead since it doesn't give any speed if your running away. Face of the Mountain is great fortank supports since it scales with health and gives you a shield you can put on anyone like a free heal from thresh or leona. It also gives you Cd which is nice since tanky items don't always help with that. Talisman is pretty much the well rounded good in any situation item, though i think a person who understand how to use Face of the Mountain/Frost Fang can be even more effective then the Talisman.

junglerboy165/1/2015, 3:00:55 PM2 votes

if you aren't going to complete it, it is actually more gold efficient to just sit on spellthief's the whole match, since most of Frostfang's increased gp/10 goes to waste paying for the higher cost if you plan on selling it (basically, it is easier to get your money back with spellthief than frostfang, and spellthief gets your money back sooner).

The Chin4/29/2015, 5:24:32 PM1 votes

I don't ever upgrade spellthiefs even to frostfang. In a 30 minute game it usually just breaks even from it's 500g upgrade cost.

Targons I do upgrade not because of the active, but the hp and the hp regen are extremely gold efficient, it's like a mini warmogs that gives CDR and it's super cheap (for the stats it gives). If you're playing a tanky support I consider this core, it should be the first item you build after sighstone and boots.

And of course finish talisman for the active. Again I do it after sighstone and boots.

Nucleophilic atk4/29/2015, 5:26:34 PM1 votes

{quoted}

drawing the aggro of low elo noobs who only attack whatever is close to them

And you are low elo for this reason.

Drunk Rummate4/29/2015, 5:29:25 PM1 votes

Face is extremely good on tanky champs. It lets you help with waveclear in later stages of the game when your damage is nil and the active is really helpful for your carries. I'd always finish face.

Frost queen is very sellable though. Honestly the only reason I'd recommend upgrading past frostfang is if you really want the active, which isn't all that great to begin wtih. I generally recommend going straight into Zhonyas or Mikaels or Aegis on frost fang champs and selling it late game for a better item.

Wolfess5/9/2015, 5:19:43 PM1 votes

I'd say it's a good idea to start with the tier 1 support/income item because the sustain is really good, and personally I dump mine later on when I have maybe 1 or 2 completed items (aside from sightstones) if i need the space. IMO there are better items to get than t3 support items for the late-game defending/sieging.

AwesomeChad4/29/2015, 8:53:22 PM1 votes

{quoted}

On all of the mage supports I play, a fully built spellthief's edge is redundant. I usually buy frostfang, get some poke and gold, and sell it when lategame comes around. On tanky supports, I prefer being disruptive as fuck and just stacking tons of armor (drawing the aggro of low elo noobs who only attack whatever is close to them), especially if the other team is very AP or AD heavy where I counter counter their entire team with a few defensive items. Face of the mountain is decent because of the hp and shield, but I still prefer gauntlet, thornmail, etc. I just feel like I do more with non-income items. The talisman is the only build I consider finishing because of the built in MS and the active, but even then item 3800 is way better for that.

So on someone like for example Taric, should I still start with an income item? Is it even worth it if I just sell it or don't finish it?

If you choose not to finish your gold income item, then hold onto it as long as possible before selling them. In my opinion, item 3303 and item 3302 are the two items supports should ever consider not upgrading if they plan on spending their gold on other items because 1. the upgrades for spellthief's edge are a waste of gold 2. relic shield's "gold income" is unaffected by whether you upgrade this item or not . On the other hand, item 3301 builds into item 3069 which offers a great active for your team.

Regardless of what support you pick, you should build a gold income item at the beginning of the game because you need that item to give you gold income.

Sirsir4/30/2015, 1:59:31 AM1 votes

I get not finishing Spellthiefs (I don't either 9/10 times) but the other 2 are too good to pass up. Face is amazing for peeling or protecting a diver and Talisman can make or break teamfights/games. And you can use both, Glory in, Talisman out, or continue pursuit.

Krigjer5/9/2015, 5:25:20 PM1 votes

I think Frostfang is useless and never build it to completion anymore. I buy it early for poke, keep it around for the gold income and then sell it once my build is almost done and buy my last item. Talisman is really useful for my playstyle so if I'm playing a non-ap support I rush it and keep it.

For Runic Shield, it depends. If I keep seeing opportunities where the shield would be helpful, I finish it. If the shield wouldn't really do anything, I just sell it past laning phase and buy a different tank item. (Besides, as soon as your adc gets even a pickaxe, they stop letting you take minions with RS's passive, and it doesn't generate gold that way. Sometimes I even replace it with the coin if we're still laning and I have enough armour/health regen to make up for it )

Nick Valentine4/30/2015, 7:58:51 PM1 votes

Frost Fang is a good small mana item for caster supports. It allows you to skip a heavier mana item in favor of a Morello for hyper spammy (Lux). When I tend to sell it I notice a lack of mana often.

Frost Queen is a cheap upgrade with mediocre stats but because selling your support item is often very inefficient for gold I always leave it for the absolute last pick or if I need to base and I don't have money for anything else. I pick it up so I can go back to fight with at least something in hand.

ChexMex4/29/2015, 4:26:25 PM1 votes

OR STACK FOR MASSIVE BOOST FOR DAYS

ZergReap4/29/2015, 4:35:21 PM1 votes

Always become the aura bitch: item 3190 item 3110 . Get item 3001 if carrying on AP support (except on the healers). item 3222 if your actually going to use it to save someone.

You ks'd all the kills on Thresh orLeona ? Then getitem 3068

Space Bum4/29/2015, 4:33:07 PM1 votes

Just depends on your play style or who you are playing. On Zyra I finish the game as a full mage with the exception of Sightstone. With Lulu I go full on utility all items with actives aside from maybe a frozen heart.

Duke Anax4/29/2015, 4:42:19 PM1 votes

There is no reason nmot to start with gold income item, they are cheap with goog stats and pay themselves really fast.

Gettimng Tier 2 is more situational, it takes more to pay for itself when you sell it later.

I only ever get Tier 3 if my inventory is otherwise full, because it continues the gold income, but has better stats than Tier 2.