How to play against auto attack based champions

TehNACHO·Oct 15, 2014·1 votes·3,211 views

Hey guys.

Long story short, after discovering that it's actually incredibly easy to play stupid melee midlaners like Master Yi if you're incredibly consistent about abusing the hell out of the opponent's cool downs, I ended up spamming that sort of match up. A lot. I feel like the king of the world being able to abuse Ability Based champions simply by hitting them during their weak points like when their abilities are on cool down.

Aaaaand then I went back to top lane and ran into a Tryndamere . Rarely uses his E as an actual offensive attack but a gap closer, and getting all of his power from flat AD+Crits so his Auto Attacks are the main concern, not his abilities. Well, that match up ended very badly for me.

So, how do you play against auto-attack based champions? Is there any particular trick that encompasses a large majority of them like the Cooldown Abusing trick you can use against most ability-based champions? Or are there very specific tricks for very specific champions?

29 Comments

exiledFromBadmenOct 15, 20144 votes

item 3075 item 3143 item 3110 Rammus :)

CritkeeperOct 15, 20143 votes

They pay for their ability to punish people between their important nuke / cc cooldowns by not actually having any nuke or cc. In other words, melee carries are largely reactive. They wait for a weakness then strike, very much like an assassin. Except an assassin can generally make a play happen even if you have your rotation up because they do it so quickly, while yi and tryndamere and the likes need time.

The counterplay is to think about using your abilities before you use them, and never be in a position where you could be within range of their gapcloser with no abilities up-- even if that means withholding harass. Its better to have a safety net than to end up dead to yi or tryndamere because you were impatient or greedy.

TehNACHOOct 15, 20141 votes

Huh, this is a rather useful way to think about it, thanks.

GavranOct 16, 20141 votes

Indeed, I think this is the best advice in the thread. Just like you can be careful to exploit those windows of opportunity when fighting a caster, you can be careful to not create those openings when you are one.

A very simplified example: When you're playing Syndra, you should never use your E to farm or harass, because if you do you are very easy to all-in not only from the enemy laner but from the enemy jungle too.

ZeroAnarchyOct 15, 20143 votes

item 3075

NovemberrRoseOct 15, 20142 votes

are you actually saying you win lane as master yi vs a mid lol

TehNACHOOct 15, 20141 votes

Sadly, be it for me or for mid laners I play against, yes.

Alpha Strike op, especially when the enemy Ziggs/Ryze/whatever literally can't use their abilities to fight back if you time yourself.

BrandNameZombieOct 15, 20142 votes

Ability based champions scale more with level than AA champions do. So a good idea is to try and avoid engages if they have just bought items, as they power-spike much harder after backing than you do.

GamersEyeOct 15, 20141 votes

Early armor tends to help. Also neither of them have much poke. If you poke them you should be good. Against both of those early thornmails/randuins are pretty useful. If they go all in disengage, and just poke them as they try to catch up or run away.

NovemberrRoseOct 15, 20141 votes

lol you must be playing against VERY bad opponents dude...

TehNACHOOct 15, 20141 votes

Try to reply, much cleaner and less cluttery.

That's debatable, really. Let's say Master Yi is standing on top of you hacking away while you have no abilities to fight back. Like, you literally have no access to your main battle ability. Exactly what would be the key difference between what a 'good' player will do and a 'very bad' player will do.

DarkwindOct 15, 20142 votes

That's debatable, really. Let's say Master Yi is standing on top of you hacking away while you have no abilities to fight back. Like, you literally have no access to your main battle ability. Exactly what would be the key difference between what a 'good' player will do and a 'very bad' player will do.

A good player would never get in range of your Q when their abilities were on cd.

TehNACHOOct 15, 20143 votes

People have to CS~

NovemberrRoseOct 15, 20141 votes

against trynd, dont let him auto minions to build rage. if he does spin, time your alpha strike to avoid the damage. meditate through his ult, or kite with your ult/alpha striking minions/etc.

TehNACHOOct 15, 20141 votes

Thnx man, I'll keep this in mind.

DaejinTyeOct 15, 20141 votes

It's easy to lane against AA focused champions, especially if they're melee. (Compounded if you have CC.)

Simply stay among your minions and keep 1 spell off CD at all times. The moment they AA you, combo and back off. Your minions will deal enough damage to win the trades.

Also, you should be able to last hit with AA's alone, even as a mage... No reason for you to keep blowing spells and burning mana to the point a melee can simple go up to you and go all-in without the risk of blowing up.

TehNACHOOct 15, 20141 votes

To be fair, I am one of those players who will jump on you as early as level 1 if you misplay, so early on that many players find themselves casting abilities to assist their last hits.

And even the most skilled mage players need at least some assistance early. Not saying they will always use their abilities on minions, but all it takes is literally click for Master Yi and some other melees with gap closers to capitalize the moment the mage does.

DaejinTyeOct 15, 20141 votes

To be fair, I am one of those players who will jump on you as early as level 1 if you misplay, so early on that many players find themselves casting abilities to assist their last hits.

And even the most skilled mage players need at least some assistance early. Not saying they will always use their abilities on minions, but all it takes is literally click for Master Yi and some other melees with gap closers to capitalize the moment the mage does.

I'm sorry but... Looking at your stats... It's basically "This cheese works vs these low level players." It wouldn't work anywhere above where you're at.

NovemberrRoseOct 15, 20141 votes

a good player wouldnt blow their abilities all willy nilly like youre suggesting? i mean honestly lol. yi should have a VERY bad time in mid lane.

TehNACHOOct 15, 20142 votes

Ahh, did it come off like that? Sorry, that's not what I meant.

Have you ever seen, for example, a Ryze throw his Q at a minion? Ever. Even just once during the laning phase.

Even the tiniest moments like these can be capitalized upon, especially earlier on in the game.

VicvictorwOct 15, 20141 votes

My favorite choices for toplane are Teemo and Nasus.

Of course you'd take exhaust on both.

Blind/exhaust or wither/exhaust should see you winning your trades.

TehNACHOOct 15, 20141 votes

-> Teemo

Hold on there satan, lol.

Good match ups, I agree. It would certainly help for draft pick, but I tend to blind pick or team builder more. Do you have any more general tips for these situations?

VicvictorwOct 15, 20141 votes

If they're melee and dependent on autoattacks, the best thing you can do is keep your distance.

If you have a way to hit them while they can't hit you, abuse it. Ranged toplanes are excellent at this.

Just don't take that ranged champ and then try to stand on his toes to fight him. Work that kite.

IceKingChernobogOct 15, 20141 votes

this guy: Rammus or get armor items such as thornsmail(which really fucks them up) or randuins, or randuins

Tooth BurglarOct 15, 20141 votes

Volibear top shits all over Tryndamere. It's pretty funny how easy that lane is.

HeroSaitamaOct 15, 20141 votes

Experience is really important when playing roles and it comes with time. Also playing certain summoners spells help u when the time is right. Even though ranked games can be trolled is still the best environment to get better at the game. If you play a normal 5s without draft you leave yourself with less counter play. Drafts is better so you can see what match up your going against. If your team does bad ignore it and just keep playing as long as possible unless every lane got stomped pretty hard.

Now handling master yi or tryndamere don't fall behind in farm and try to deny them as much as possible. i can go 0-3 tryndamere but if i get 200+ cs i will come back in the game.

Critmaster GarenOct 16, 20141 votes

you rush thornmail.

no, thats literally all you have to do. every time im facing off a tryn in top lane, im rushing the item. and as soon as i complete it, hes unable to trade with me, no matter how much ad he has stacked, or what advantage he had on me.

i trade auto attacks with him, and he drops to 30% hp, before i even drop to half.

try it, it works. and just a reminder. the total cost of a thornmail is a mere 2200 gold.

be careful, when he tries to counter with a shiv though. you need to squeeze some mr and possibly lifesteal in. otherwise youre golden.

ForMyNextTrickOct 17, 20141 votes

To be honest, yi shouldn't really win most mid lane matchups, anyone with strong haras, like ziggs, strong early game like leblanc, or hard cc will shut him down completely. You can haras him to no end before he gets strong enough to all in you, or don't use your cc or gap closer until he goes on you

As for trynd top just get armour and don't let him snowball you and cc him

TehNACHOOct 17, 20141 votes

It's almost as if you didn't read how I pulled it off and started making assumptions just because I mention Yi in mid lane~