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How can I carry to Gold as a Support currently in Silver 2?

3lue·11/4/2014, 3:37:37 AM·5 votes·5,226 views

I have no trouble closing out games when I am ahead in my main roles (Mid/Jungle/Top), but I do have trouble when I am forced to support.

TL;DR at bottom.

I arguably just had my best Support game in the ~1 year I have been playing league.

http://i59.tinypic.com/2e3wpxl.png

http://i59.tinypic.com/de8yva.jpg

We had a **huge **lead and the win was basically available 15 minutes in, but I just cant close out a game as Support (relying on other, unskilled, teammates (refrained from using "noob") and I want to learn how (if its even possible) to close games out.

Some of the things that I want to know is while playing Support:

What do you do after you get your ADC fed? I assume you roam and ward when you know your ADC is safe, correct?

What do you do when 3 wards of your SS have already been placed?

What can you do when your tanks allow assassins and other carries get through your back line? For example, the game I posted, the Pantheon and Sion kept trying to slow down the already-in-ultimate Olaf, thus leaving Trist vulnerable. I did my best to peel for her and sometimes disengaged with coin, but its not like we could 2 v 5 because the Syndra kept dying instantly since she missed her Q E combos all game (shes Gold V 0 LP - Go figure), the Pantheon and Sion chased the GA'd Lucian to oblivion through Lux and Leona, and of course Trist eventually died to Kha'Zix (who killed me later as well).

What do you do when Dragon and Baron is available and your Jungler goes and smites wraiths? (Tristana and I duo'd 2 dragons and 2 barons - when we could have had at least 5 dragons all game.

Do you build offensively when you know you have to pick up your team's slack (when you know there is zero hope of them finishing out the game) or do you keep building defensively?

It seems like every time I am forced to Support (my ADC and I do great) other lanes just do horribly even if we roam and help them get things going a bit.

I don't want to be a jerk every time I am last pick and insta-lock another lane, but it seems like I am going to have to do that because people rather farm than grab objectives...

What do you do when people do not listen to you when you try to guide them and ask them to buy at least 1 ward/pink ward?

Are some games just totally impossible to win after one, or two lanes feed like nobody's business?

TL;DR How do you carry as a Support when you know you're going to do alright, but have a **brainless **team?

If there are any guides you all could give a link to, or just any tips in general, that'd be great.

EDIT : Meant for the poll to be "... out of Silver"

18 Comments

OhBoyItsaMegaman11/4/2014, 4:42:12 AM5 votes

I'm a little confused about how you think Support makes you poorly-equipped to close out the game when your team's not cooperating. If you were the Syndra in this game, or the Pantheon, would you solo push a lane to close out the game? That wouldn't really work. The whole team needs to be on board with focusing on objectives in the late game, and it doesn't matter that much who you're playing if you can't get them all working together. If anything, Support is the best role because of the vision you can grant. Switching over to building offensively is a terrible idea because your team doesn't need a 5th damage dealer as much as they need vision and utility.

There are some games that are impossible to win but you should not be focusing on "was my team too bad to win this?" after a loss, you should be focusing on "what could I have done differently?" And I do notice a couple of things from your screenshot.

Though you have a very high number of wards placed, it looks like you sold your Sightstone at some point to work on a different 6th item. Major mistake. The miniscule amount of extra damage/shield/heal you will get from the item that item 1026 was turning into is nowhere near as useful as 3 extra wards on the map in the late game. You also didn't have a red trinket (possibly because you switched back to yellow after selling SS), which further reduces your ability to participate in the vision war. It looks like you were heavily focused on MR rather than armor, which is strange because Lux isn't contributing a large amount of their damage. The item 3174 and item 3157 are what I'd call selfish items on a support. They're granting stats that help you but not your team so much. A different build including item 3110 item 3222 and perhaps item 3504 might have given your team the edge they needed. Freeing up someone from Leona's stun while granting bonus attack speed and slowing the enemies' attack speed is way more useful than being able to Zhonya's as Janna.

tau4311/4/2014, 3:28:39 PM3 votes

Play-making supports (Thresh, Blitz, Braum, etc.) and carry supports (Zyra, Karma, etc.) are pretty good ways to get moving.

Dunderflump11/4/2014, 5:22:16 AM2 votes

What do you do after you get your ADC fed? I assume you roam and ward when you know your ADC is safe, correct?

You ward the reasonable paths it would take for them to reach your ADC and you roam mid and take the tower.

What do you do when 3 wards of your SS have already been placed?

Update them in new spots if any of your 3 wards becomes irrelevant.

What can you do when your tanks allow assassins and other carries get through your back line? For example, the game I posted, the Pantheon and Sion kept trying to slow down the already-in-ultimate Olaf, thus leaving Trist vulnerable. I did my best to peel for her and sometimes disengaged with coin, but its not like we could 2 v 5 because the Syndra kept dying instantly since she missed her Q E combos all game (shes Gold V 0 LP - Go figure), the Pantheon and Sion chased the GA'd Lucian to oblivion through Lux and Leona, and of course Trist eventually died to Kha'Zix (who killed me later as well).

Sometimes there's nothing you can do. You can't control what your teammates do.

What do you do when Dragon and Baron is available and your Jungler goes and smites wraiths? (Tristana and I duo'd 2 dragons and 2 barons - when we could have had at least 5 dragons all game.

Try to catch their jungler out.

Do you build offensively when you know you have to pick up your team's slack (when you know there is zero hope of them finishing out the game) or do you keep building defensively?

Always build offensively if you can get away with it. Unless you're the tank.

I don't want to be a jerk every time I am last pick and insta-lock another lane, but it seems like I am going to have to do that because people rather farm than grab objectives...

You can pick supports that are more carry-oriented. Zyra/Lux/Xerath/Annie are all very strong, especially in low elo.

What do you do when people do not listen to you when you try to guide them and ask them to buy at least 1 ward/pink ward?

Because people are stupid. Don't depend on them.

Are some games just totally impossible to win after one, or two lanes feed like nobody's business?

Some. Most are winnable even with feeders.

TL;DR How do you carry as a Support when you know you're going to do alright, but have a **brainless **team?

Play carry mages.

Venompaw11/4/2014, 4:48:20 AM2 votes

more wards =/= better.

In fact. saving gold might be better than pointlessly buying more wards just for "visions".

What do you do after you get your ADC fed? I assume you roam and ward when you know your ADC is safe, correct?

Go interfere with other lanes if your adc doesn't need you at all

In fact once the first tower falls, go mid or something. (mid is where all the clueless people go)

What can you do when your tanks allow assassins and other carries get through your back line?

Either peel, or engage on their carries. The adc is NOT valuable. also accept not all games can be won.

What do you do when Dragon and Baron is available and your Jungler goes and smites wraiths? (Tristana and I duo'd 2 dragons and 2 barons - when we could have had at least 5 dragons all game.

are you calling for objectives, or do you hope for everyone to suddenly get the idea - hey let's fight baron/dragon? If smite is needed to get dragon/baron odds are you shouldn't be taking it to begin with.

Do you build offensively when you know you have to pick up your team's slack (when you know there is zero hope of them finishing out the game) or do you keep building defensively?

Offense > defense, the only defensive item that affects other people is aegis. Everything else can be dedicated towards offense (or defense if you're a tank). It's also easier to win with glass cannons than tanks that do no damage, so keep that in mind.

What do you do when people do not listen to you when you try to guide them and ask them to buy at least 1 ward/pink ward?

more wards =/= better, by buying wards, you're throwing away your advantage.

In fact 5 trinkets should be all the vision you need, thus you don't even need sightstone.

Are some games just totally impossible to win after one, or two lanes feed like nobody's business?

some games are lost causes, some champs do badly at start but well later on (veigar, nasus, karthus).

The easiest way to climb for me at least - play solo bot lane, exile the support/adc to another lane.

Sammystorm11/4/2014, 7:59:05 AM1 votes

this might be out of your comfort zone but start maining champs that can make things happen. Leona is a good example. Generally when people see someone go in, even if it is a bad idea, they will follow. SO if you force your team mates to "save" you then you will have a easier time in my experience

Lord OwlBear11/4/2014, 8:33:48 AM1 votes

Okay my comment is going to be a cheap one, low elo Blitzcrank is king. Braum when he is available. One of my favs is a sheen rush on Sona, make sure you get that item 2049 after though but that early damage is ridiculous

Vauren11/4/2014, 6:31:45 PM1 votes

Support/jungle main here, in Silver V after completely skipping bronze promos from like 56ish LP in Bronze I. I don't play a whole lot so I'm not any higher :( Not the most credible, I know, but hoping to help regardless.

"What do you do after you get your ADC fed? I assume you roam and ward when you know your ADC is safe, correct?"

Short answer, yes. I roam and place wards provided my adc and turret are safe. I deny vision where I can safely too.

**"What do you do when 3 wards of your SS have already been placed?" **

Then I place a pink ward that I bought last time I went back hoping to get vision on a key jungle route or objective or deny enemy vision. If you have 3 wards placed already, then you have 3 wards out already. There isn't anything else you can do with it really. You could go back and refill, but you'll still have one or two wards left once 3 minutes have gone by to place. While the wards are up you should be helping your team and supporting them to help secure kills and objectives.

"What can you do when your tanks allow assassins and other carries get through your back line?"

It depends on which support you are playing really. Tank supports should peel, damaging supports should deal damage and try to out kill the assassin, passive supports should heal or use other abilities to hinder their goals. Try to not separate from your team too much if you can help it, then you will have 0 chance of help from teammates if they have a sudden change of heart.

Items can be used as well for situations just like this. Face of the Mountain, Locket of the Iron Solari, and Mikael's Crucible can all be used to help deal with damage; while Talisman of Ascension, Randuin's Omen, and Twin Shadows can be used to try and disengage, dodge skills (Talisman only), and create breathing room to work with.

Your job in lane is to make sure your adc is on par with the other people in the game who are fed/ahead by making them ahead or fed through your awesome support prowess :D So whenever things like this happen, the edge an ability or item can give will let them come out on top.

"What do you do when Dragon and Baron is available and your Jungler goes and smites wraiths? (Tristana and I duo'd 2 dragons and 2 barons - when we could have had at least 5 dragons all game."

The reality of it is, you can't do every single job as support. If you try and do other roles than support, than the support role on the team is lacking which is no good either. Going off and getting Baron and Dragon by yourselves is just fine provided you have the vision to do it safely, or their jungle is dead at least. You could ask them to save smite for Baron/Dragon by pinging and saying it'll be up in a minute. Otherwise, nothing you can do.

Do you build offensively when you know you have to pick up your team's slack (when you know there is zero hope of them finishing out the game) or do you keep building defensively?

Again, depends on which support you are. For tanky supports, I might build a hybrid item if we really need more damage. For Damaging/passive supports, I will absolutely build some damage if needed once core support items have been built (SS at the very least.) Most supports scale with ap, which will increase support capabilities and damage so no real loss here.

What do you do when people do not listen to you when you try to guide them and ask them to buy at least 1 ward/pink ward?

Nothing to be done. If they don't listen they don't listen. Don't rage at them for sure or blame them, that'll just make things worse. You could try to carry extra wards so you can place them as needed (don't need a drag ward when pushing for inner turret).

Are some games just totally impossible to win after one, or two lanes feed like nobody's business?

Possibly, but don't give up. Keep trying and learn how to work in a bad situation.

It is a team game after all; enable your allies and hinder your opponents, if you do that well enough, you can carry your team.

The Chin11/4/2014, 7:52:40 PM1 votes

What do you do when your ADC is fed? And what do you do when your frontline lets assassins through to the backline?

You have to peel. With Janna you have tornado's, ult, a shield, and a slow to help keep your squishies safe. That's you're job in a teamfight, keep the squishies safe.

When do you build offensively?

ONLY if you're playing an AP poke support eg:Morgana Annie Sona Karma etc. and YOU get kills in lane. So if you're like 3/0 on your first back, buy the biggest AP item you can afford item 1058 + a couple wards item 2044 item 2044

If you get fed early, you want to press the advantage by becoming another damage threat. But again, ONLY if YOU get fed early.

Otherwise just build normally. Gold item > Sighstone > w/e

Are some games impossible to win?

Yes, but probably only like 5-10% of them. Most games there's always things you could have done better that might not have thrown the game. Playing a teamfight differently, putting wards in optimal positions so people aren't getting caught out / denying vision so your team can set up picks... things like that can be the difference between winning and losing.

What do you do when drag/ baron are available?

Ping it, ward it, make the call.

What do you do when 3 wards are already placed?

Ask yourself if they're in optimal positions, and adjust accordingly. If you think they're in good spots then you've got 3 minutes of good vision.

TBH the biggest thing you probably need to work on is your communication.

It sounds like your main issue is people don't listen to you. If you're really trolly and negative, people won't do what you say. You should ALWAYS be encouraging when talking to your teammates and they'll almost always listen to your calls.

Jackedup8611/4/2014, 9:03:40 PM1 votes

In my opinion the best way to carry a game with support is to be as positive as you possibly can. Never rage at other players, always praise your team mates for good plays and communicate objectives and opportunities in a friendly and positive manner. You will be surprised how much a friendly player can reduce stress and prevent further mistakes when a player knows they made a mistake. Of course this will not prevent players from purposely feeding.

If you are doing well in your lane then take the tower and extend your warding to cover not only dragon but the enemy blue/red (depending on the starting positions). This will allow you to pressure the Jungle and mid safely while simultaneously allowing you to push bottom and contest Dragon.

If you can force the Jungler or enemy Mid to pay attention to what you are doing it opens up a lot of opportunities for your Jungler to make plays top and Mid and really open up the map for plays.

There are also supports that can build damage to replace a carry it the opportunity or need arises. Sona can be a beast when built pure AP as well as Morgana, Annie and arguably the new Soraka kit. Other supports can also have a huge impact in fights without having a lot of damage to take objectives, such as Leona, Blitz and Thresh can set up ganks really well or land clutch ults to entirely turn a fight around.

Warding for the correct circumstances is very important as well. If you are slightly ahead early in the game a little bit of aggressive warding in the enemy jungle can give you the opportunity to isolate a jungle champ at an objective and get a kill putting their jungler behind while simultaneously providing your ADC with a buff in lane. If you are behind you can freeze your lane by your turret and use the extra wards you would use to ward your lane to defensively ward your jungle to provide protection for your jungler from invades.

Basically supports are all about the small changes that will help your entire team "carry" the game rather than assuming direct control of the outcome.

There will of course be games in which you will lose but if you can tip the scales just a little bit you can win more game than you lose and advance.

Dark Topline11/4/2014, 4:17:42 AM1 votes

I personally main adc, and I can't really help you with all the specifics you're looking for as you're a more skillful player than myself, although I do have a friend who was in a similar situation as your own, who duo queued with a friend to get into the higher ranks.

Because a good support should be able to carry a mediocre adc, if you're really as good of a support as you claim, but you're losing games partially to other lanes failing, having a friend whom perhaps mains another solo lane play with you could help you move up, especially if, like you, deserve to be in a higher elo.

Sorry for not being able to hit on all the specifics you were probably looking for, thought I'd just point out my opinion/a potential idea to help you move up and on out of gold.

Best of luck!

Edit: I voted for you to main support, assuming you're able to find somebody to queue up with you. If not, I'd suggest trying to move up by playing a solo lane!

StOrmysLIVE11/4/2014, 9:53:43 PM1 votes

I've had plenty of low elo support games where people would just not listen- all I can do in those situations is stay around to try and help them survive, and abandon them when it inevitably fails.

Now if it was a cohesive listening team, I would suicide myself in that situation to help others escape.

Diljic11/4/2014, 5:50:50 AM1 votes

Why are you trying to carry out of Silver as support if you can close out games as Mid/Jungle/Top? Just get one of those roles and you know how to win on and get Gold. After you hit Gold learn to support as you no longer have the end of the season looming over you.

If you are determined to main support to get to Gold start leading your team once the objective battles start. Lead your fed ADC around by the nose and point them at towers. If you want to be a carry support I suggest Annie as you also Mid. Just build her like you would mid lane but with a sightstone and start being a third carry on your team.

UPfreely11/4/2014, 6:05:24 AM1 votes

Play a carry support like Annie/fiddle/zyra/vel'koz. Janna is great if your adc is fairly good.

Sukishoo11/4/2014, 6:14:35 AM1 votes

The fact that you're supporting without a item 2045 already has issues. Need the power of the wards in every game, especially as the support. That will not only give you wards but it gives the extra health boost which for Janna is great since she's very squishy.

Janna's case, you should focus a lot of movement speed items because of who she is. The more mobile she is the better she can maneuver in combat.

Definitely get rid of item 3157, I've only built that in extreme cases and well most of the time you don't need it. Replace item 3174 with item 3222 only if the team needs the cc removal. Last, if you are to build anything else with AP in it make sure it's a support item such as item 3023, item 3060 item 3056 those can give lots of extra utility. item 3504 is another good one for Janna as it will let her shield give attack speed.