Here's a pro tip for you. Never ever insult your teammates.

Pythagorean Thm·Nov 28, 2014·114 votes·6,866 views

It never makes them play better. In fact, it does the opposite. It makes them play worse. They lose confidence and moral all in one shot. Once you begin to insult your teammates and start arguments you destroy your chances of coming back. It's like a more painful version of surrendering.

Did your jungler mistime smite allowing the other team to get dragon? Don't say "wtf dude how could you miss that", say "That's alright we'll get the next one."

Did someone push too far without wards and get caught out? Don't say "DUDE YOU MORON WHY DIDN'T YOU WARD?", say "Don't worry about it, just remember to ward next time"

Etc etc.

70 Comments

Cale017Nov 28, 201435 votes

Problem with that is that most people I've come across don't know the difference between constructive criticism and insulting. If someone is messing something up, just patting their back and saying it's all okay isn't going to help them learn what they're doing wrong. But the moment you try and guide someone in this game, nine times out of ten they get overly defensive and decide that they no longer have to avoid walking into enemy turrets.

The ChinNov 28, 201413 votes

problem is there's not really a point in trying to fix people's mistakes because you're never going to play with them again, if they improve or not it doesn't change the mistake they already made in the current game.

Also if it's a mistake that caused them to die, they probably know what they did wrong and they don't need you to point it out.

ModWulf HelhammerNov 28, 20145 votes

Well the difference is when someone makes a mistake multiple times, then you begin to think that maybe they don't really know what they're doing. And maybe they are playing a champ you are really good at, and you try to offer them some helpful advice (build, strategies, etc). The player then gets all offended because they thought you were flaming them, when you were just trying to be a helpful human being. Also, even though highly unlikely, there is still a chance to meet a player again, as long as neither of you have changed servers. One time, when the Ascension mode was on, I started a game, and during the champ select lobby, one of the players asked if they had seen me before. I wasn't sure, so after the match, I looked up my match history, and what do you know, I played with that same guy a few days earlier. Completely random encounter, happened twice in a short amount of time (1-2 days). Now I know that this stat may have been off due to the featured game mode, but the point still stands: as long as two people exist in the same environment, there is a chance they will meet again. So if I want to offer some friendly advice to a player who doesn't know a champ as well as I do, I will give it, if not for the reason of protecting myself if we ever meet again in the same situation, then for all the other players that he will meet in his future games.

The ChinNov 28, 20144 votes

I see where you're coming from, especially when someone plays a champ that you're very experienced with, but no matter what your intention is, giving someone helpful advice 9 times out of 10 will make them get defensive and potentially go on tilt. In my experience it's better to just let them do their thing and focus on what I'm doing.

And yeah there's always a chance you meet the same player again, it's slim but definitely possible. But there's equal odds that he'll be on the other team, so maybe you'd have been better off not giving him any advice? :p

It just seems kind of pointless in solo queue, ranked 5s is totally different though

I Main SwainNov 28, 20146 votes

well, if they get defensive for you giving them a friendly tip or a personal preference on how you do something, as long as you aren't doing it in a way where it sounds like youre saying that's the only way and they have to do it that way, taking it offensively is their problem. I'd rather possibly make someone a much better player and risk someone I'm never going to meet again being mad at me for giving advice than not do so and lose the game AND not help them to become a better player just because I don't want them to be offended. not saying you should try to offend people, just saying as long as you aren't saying it in a potentially offensive way you shouldn't worry about it.

Cro003Nov 29, 20145 votes

Could use statements such as "I think that _____ . . . " Positive criticism is much more effective than negative criticism.

My students respond better to me when I help them learn how and why to be better; its unethical for me to do otherwise.

FuryofThornsRedoApr 11, 20151 votes

Agree, "I" language in helping to own responsibility inside of communication conflicts or discussions is helpful. FuryofThornsRedo

Cale017Nov 29, 20143 votes

"In my experience it's better to just let them do their thing and focus on what I'm doing."

Sure, if you're playing a twitch shooter like CoD. But LoL is a team game. If you just let them do their own thing while you focus on yourself, you aren't playing like a team. If they're doing badly, you're going to have to deal with it eventually when that fed ADC comes to bear down on you at some point, or when you start losing teamfights because of the gold advantage granted to the enemy.

You're essentially slitting your own throat when you choose to ignore a player who could fix a mistake with a bit of critique. Selfishness costs in this game.

Woook3rNov 29, 20141 votes

I see where you're coming from, especially when someone plays a champ that you're very experienced with, but no matter what your intention is, giving someone helpful advice 9 times out of 10 will make them get defensive and potentially go on tilt. In my experience it's better to just let them do their thing and focus on what I'm doing.

And yeah there's always a chance you meet the same player again, it's slim but definitely possible. But there's equal odds that he'll be on the other team, so maybe you'd have been better off not giving him any advice? :p

I can probably infer that your experience is that when you try to 'help someone' you see it hurts them and when you see others 'help someone' it also hurts someone. but I see that people are helped by helpfulness every day. You seem to suggest that helping is unhelpful. Thats gotta be flawed reasoning.

I wonder if you should take a look at your execution. You sounded pretty selfish in most of this post.. Just fyi. >maybe you'd have been better off not giving him any advice? :p> That would generally indicate a selfish spirit. Not saying you have one, but if you didnt mean to come off this way, then the reasonable interpretation of your comments could reasonably be taken as evidence that when you 'help people' you dont always come off like you wanted to either. You come off as an ass in other words. Its just poor execution in my opinion. The fact that you were motivated to try says good things about you.

Its actually more likely that you go about "helping people" in an counterproductive manner. The idea that helping people is always or even generally counterproductive is really flawed. If helping people generally did the opposite of helping people, as you seem to suggest, we wouldn't call it helping people.

The ChinNov 29, 20141 votes

Yeah I think I'm being misinterpreted here, because I agree with you completely.

I was referring to how I see other people communicate in solo queue, people "giving advice" is more like pointing out mistakes and starting a flame war. It's ridiculous but it's fairly common.

But on the flip side there is a right way to do it, just be nice about it and it'll usually work out fine.

Pandemic PunchNov 28, 20143 votes

The large majority of the time, people are trying to be helpful with a side of ridicule and sarcasm. Also, most people that are pointing out mistakes are also wrong in their advice. Sometimes both sides are wrong and both sides are right. The problem is that this just leads to extended arguments. One person says something, the other person then has to defend themselves by explaining why everything happened the way it did. The accuser usually ignores that and keeps the argument going because they think they know exactly what went wrong even though the defender's story contradicts it.

People are stubborn and they will learn their way whether you give them good advice or not.

The ChinNov 29, 20142 votes

^exactly

It's not that giving advice is bad, it's just the WAY people usually go about it is counterproductive.

CaesarFlickermanNov 29, 20141 votes

And using this same psychology, there's no reason to be nice to them, pat their back and tell them that everything's going to be okay.

Woook3rNov 29, 20141 votes

Fixing things is a universal good. However, if you are a really selfish person, you probably dont have the instincts to go about fixing problems like this.

Do you have a good reason to express to others that making this attempt is not worthwhile? It seems like if its not worthwhile, then people would know that it wasnt worthwhile and "they dont need you to point it out".

The ChinNov 29, 20141 votes

Have you ever misplayed a situation, and you think "wow I fucked up, I coulda just done (fill in the blank)" and then one of your teammates gets mad and tells you what you should have done.

It kinda sucks, but it's effectively useless for your teammate to point it out because you already know what you did wrong. It's not like he's presenting you new ideas, he's just putting you on the spot and sometimes it can make people start tilting or start a flame war. It's fairly common.

That's what I had in mind when I said they don't need you to point it out.

Woook3rNov 29, 20141 votes

yea sometimes

FuryofThornsRedoApr 11, 20151 votes

I like your stance in most of these, though I am not stating this as such to evolve your thoughts into thinking otherwise. Pertaining to the first two paragraphs, no mistakes as I try to reflect towards myself.

I am maybe less skilled as the majority in this game, but I love the Artistry of this game and the Mythologies, which are the persuasive welcoming me to return, regardless of the waves and tides of communication conflicts and discussions with constructive criticism. Inside of the communication process my higher educational credentials and area of expertise, the aspect of feedback, which is the objective of my comment from your post is the goal of my post. When having made a mistake and maybe not liking a concern to be pointed out.

I own some of the not best habits when I play video games. Why? I would go out there into the enemy territory in the games when battles would get closer to offer the distraction to assist my older brother with beating the Gauntlet in the arcades. Of course I was popping in more coin because I was making my dying look and appear as if I own an addiction with the video game action of death. Funny memories, he also told me to do so. Maybe then I run out of money and he would not have to share the game with me any longer because I would run out of my money.? Really some of his logic always had me asking questions and smiling.

Then earlier this week a person actually took the time to chat with me and tell me they could offer me some pointer or tips. I welcomed this feedback. Have to tell you, in reading some of their tips, there is some logic or some perspectives I might not have thought about, and I found More than helpful. This is more of an example against the majority of other maybe not so favorable communication feedback experiences in a game. Not to one side or another, only as an example. Game On! From FuryofThornsRedo

FuryofThornsRedoApr 11, 20151 votes

...persuasive components or aspects of League of Legends

FluppetsNov 28, 20141 votes

You dont get it, even constructive critisism is bad

Cale017Nov 29, 20143 votes

No, that's why it's called "constructive" criticism. It's aimed at helping.

FluppetsNov 29, 20141 votes

Im not saying the intentions are bad, im saying it wont hit the mark and have a negative influence.

Cale017Nov 29, 20141 votes

Then you're essentially agreeing with my original statement which makes me wonder why you would say I don't get it and proceed to say the exact same thing I did.

FluppetsDec 4, 20142 votes

then I misinterpreted your original statement, my bad.

In my experience not saying anything is usually best when somebody fucks up, the only times I offer advise is when they say something apologetic or self-criticising in chat like "oops mb", implying theyre open-minded enough to hear me out.

Woook3rNov 29, 20141 votes

Whenever I try and show someone that I have experience it helps. Also, when I make it clear that this is just experience that I HAPPEN to have and that they HAPPEN not to have, for instance I can lie and say "I tried doing it cause so and so told me and it friggin worked", then I come off as a helpful peer than as a wannabe authority figure.

You try to show them that you know what you are talking about first. Just telling them what to do as if they know you are better has not worked for me.
I don't talk as if there is only one way and I know what that way is because of my infinite experience. BTW i know how tempting it is to come off like this--->"You need to x if you want y and I know because I am better/have been playing longer...friggin noob...stop sucking"
Instead I try---->"Whenever I do X, I get Y to happen and I think thats what you were trying to do. BTW Watch out if he does Z, Ill have to help by doing ect. ect."

There is a big difference between 2) and 3). One works. The other has not worked.

FuryofThornsRedoApr 11, 20151 votes

I am more than positive there are mountains piling beyond the definitions of mountains in referencing insults, constructive criticism mistimed and shortened so the constructive is absent inside of the inconsiderate comment. I agree, once a comment is made, Team Moral is Compromised and Affected.

As far as those could be classified mistakes towards better chances of winning game etiquette; just yesterday I was capable in chatting about a middle laner and his game time decisions. He owns enough class to state a sorry I was not looking for. I told I am caring not so much on either side of this concern, though as you game with other people be careful with that, Or Gold Monopolizing Everywhere! Mentioned at least when they thought the concern could be a potential concern elsewhere in other games, at least he is capable of knowing when to start rebuilding encouragement with a sorry. FuryofThornsRedo

FuryofThornsRedoApr 11, 20151 votes

Beginner Bots/ was practicing with a new reacquainting Champion or mastering a main. Needed a break from intense intermediate. FuryofThornsRedo

FuryofThornsRedoApr 18, 20151 votes

I agree at times with your comment. Though at other times when I am told, that what I am doing is correct, helpful or right, but there would be more of a gain for you in this area, or there might be improvement with this aspect if from going along with the norm rather than following the pattern, or the item build set, or a rune build set suggestion as examples in our game.

With most of the information I might welcome as feedback, there are times I might state to people, I welcome your feedback could you please help me to understand inside of a comparison. Example: If I were to continue to perform as I decide then I might only reach so far, but if I were to perform in adding this aspect then I might reach this much farther. From FuryofThornsRedo

Viro MelchiorNov 28, 201411 votes

It boils down to one thing: Are you antagonizing your teammate?

If you are purposefully trying to do any of the following, you're automatically lowering your chances of victory.

Make them feel bad
Irritate/troll them
Get them to go afk, quit the game, uninstall LoL, or "just go die"

If you have noble intentions (helping them improve), but poor wording, you can also be a net negative.

A few key ideas when offering criticism in-game to strangers:

a) Use positive messages, such as "When we respawn, can you keep a ward in the tri-brush?" instead of "No ward in tri-brush makes you a bad support." b) Don't tell them things they already know, such as "You need to stop dying." (if they're 0/6, they already realize that they're feeding). c) Offer to help (in-game). Things like "you're way behind, and not much use right now. do you want to farm top to try to catch up?" works much better than "you might as well afk, you're useless", or saying "its usually better to gank the winning lane, not try to save a losing lane. but if you want, you can farm my jungle camp for a bit extra gold/xp." is much more positive then "no, you suck".

Of course, this all goes out the window when someone ELSE on your team starts provoking whoever is doing poorly. In that case, my only advice is to come to the harassed player's defense ("hey, bad games happen, lets stay positive") and encourage the other player to use Mute. Silence implies consent of the bad behavior, and many times simply knowing that the rest of the team are all "cool guys" is enough to keep a player from raging under the abuse of a single negative teammate.

SîcarîusNov 28, 20146 votes

I think Caleo17 hit the nail on the coffin. This issue stems deeper than just the league community, though. The issue of not being able to understand the difference between constructive criticism and insulting is a worldwide problem atm, and I can't see us solving it via league of legends if we can't even solve it in real life. It's very sad, but perhaps our brains will function better in the future.

MarhsallLee67Nov 28, 20141 votes

perhaps our brains will function better in the future.

The way things are going now, I highly doubt this will happen, but we can always cross our fingers and hope for the best, I guess.

Mr chiral centerNov 29, 20142 votes

Hope wont save humanity.
Brains wont magically function better in the future. We need to constantly strive with consistent effort to educate people on what it means to support community, and eachother. It's the loss of social capital that leads to these kinds of mis-communications.

Dr JarjarbinksNov 29, 20144 votes

Nice post I totally agree. You will NEVER(idc what anyone says) have a more positive result after insulting someone than if you hadn't. You MIGHT have a positive result in spite of the insult but that's not normal. Basically if you flame someone you take credit for all their stupid crap after cus chances are they will play worse.

ModWulf HelhammerNov 28, 20143 votes

sad head shake for all the players who somehow don't realize this fact

KonidiasNov 29, 20143 votes

When you yell at teammates their usual thought process is:

"Do I try really hard to win this game and show my teammate he is mistaken, or do I take the easy route and stop trying to win... therefore making this rager even more mad, and costing him a game because he doesn't deserve it with his attitude?"

I think the decision is easy for most people. Once you're behind in a game it's hard enough to make a comeback without having some a-hole on your team yelling at everyone. It's much easier to just give up and lose the match. At least that way the a-hole doesn't win.

You create a situation where your teammates would rather take a loss just so you also lose, instead of trying hard to get you a win.

Think about it... I mean really... would you want to win a game for someone who was giving you s*** non-stop?

Cro003Nov 29, 20143 votes

**Empathy **

People need to learn to have and live it.

Until the day comes when many more people have it as a skill, we'll have to have a thick skin to play online games.

AxerumNov 28, 20142 votes

WHAT?! Well that's flash news.

Anyways, I couldn't agree more. Recently in LAS we had this promotional video made by Riot called "Teammates OP" or something like that. The whole idea was flushed down the toilet.

Gray FanchonNov 28, 20142 votes

Teamwork OP. People got mad. Even though it's true, really. :P

AxerumNov 28, 20142 votes

Teamwork OP. People got mad. Even though it's true, really. :P

That, Teamwork OP.

Keeblers ElfNov 28, 20142 votes

Its not even about moral or confidence. Insulting teammates makes a lot of people say fuck it and start hard core trolling you.

LiveYiOrDieHardNov 28, 20142 votes

Everytime I see my teammate pushing so hard without ward and too long, Rarely I say anything. I just ping them to be careful and they dont take that advice so mid, top or jg disappears and gank them hard and even though you warned them and in some cases you couldn't follow your lane, you get blamed because they can't play like idiot freely :) At this point, I make sure I point out what they did wrong withouth raging and put them on mute. About 1/3 or half of my games I either mute one or all of my teammates because I ain't got them for their stupidity. sorry for the harsh words but if I waste my time arguing with them, I would be stuck in "Used Toilet Paper" 5.

Don't spam your caution ping at teammates for no reason. If you think they are in IMMEDIATE danger, sure, but it's a warning ping for a reason. If someone pings me and I back off and then check my map and see everyone on the enemy team visible and nowhere near my lane, I will pointedly ignore any more caution pings for the rest of the game. Especially if it cost me a kill, all because somebody thinks they need to play my lane for me.

The large majority of the time, people are trying to be helpful with a side of ridicule and sarcasm. Also, most people that are pointing out mistakes are also wrong in their advice. Sometimes both sides are wrong and both sides are right. The problem is that this just leads to extended arguments. One person says something, the other person then has to defend themselves by explaining why everything happened the way it did. The accuser usually ignores that and keeps the argument going because they think they know exactly what went wrong even though the defender's story contradicts it.

True. The best lesson I learned from when I used to smurf a lot is to never take advice from solo queue. 99% of the time they're HORRIBLY wrong no matter how much they think they're right.

RyvakuNov 28, 20142 votes

This is true. I intend not to work well if insulted by the slightest. I would even let that person die in general who insulted.

ArcaneMusicNov 29, 20141 votes

Oh gosh, I've had a game with both of those people in it before. A flaming ADC, and a Touchy Rammus. ADC felt like everyone was shit, and was giving really flaming advice to Rammus. On the other hand, the Rammus was building SUPER inefficiently (First Item being item 3075 , then item 3207 . It's really hard to give constructive criticism when one person is telling you to uninstall and the other is AGREEING with the actual advice they're giving, making them report you too. T_T (I recall saying that Thornmail would be more efficient if he built his health up to about 3000 or more, and he responded with a STFU Amumu )

TexicantNov 30, 20141 votes

Caitlyn "Land your bubble Nami!#!" Nami bubble to vayne Vayne rolls out of the way Caitlyn "OMG SCRUB N0oB Nami needs to gtfo" Nami item 3070

Just saying about criticism. telling a person to land a skillshot isn't advice, but rather an annoyance. also makes creates a desire to leave lane or just straight out troll the criticizer

Leblancs BoobNov 30, 20141 votes

It doesn't just make the person being insulted play worse.. it makes EVERYONE play worse. Toxicity severely lowers team moral and makes everyone play worse. Not to mention everyone is typing to each other and insulting each other instead of actually playing the game. Don't be that guy that insults your teammates and throws the game because you just have to call everyone out on their mistakes.

Demonsolder21Dec 28, 20141 votes

Your mom insults teammates.

TrubbleCleffJan 24, 20151 votes

There is no problem with this. Bottom line, no matter what their response is , it's just a game and that's the right thing to do.

CrettApr 7, 20151 votes

Garen crett is this your first time jungle Trundle no Garen HAHAHAHAHAHA liar Garen rubbish trundle

BroLaneApr 11, 20151 votes

I'm still gonna flame.

TalllMay 31, 20151 votes

My teammates play worse when I call them a "Fucking Peice of shitty dicks that even Jesus would take a shit on and laugh at" makes them play worse?!! But no in all seriousness this post couldn't be more right. 90% of the people you play with are so stubborn that ragging at them would make them consider feeding just to make you lose, Don't rage at teammates, help them out.** !!AND DON'T SAY SOMETHING YOU WOULDN'T HAVE THE BALLS TO SAY TO THEIR FACE IN REAL LIFE!!**