Why do I usually lose even though I consistenly win my lane? (as support)

MorrisseyMarr·4/16/2015, 5:09:00 PM·1 votes·1,077 views

Playing at support in bronze ranked play and I would say I dominate in the lane 95% of the time. I land my bindings and shield my adc who then picks up easy kills. We snowball into me getting my ult which often leads into a double kill and us taking the tower.

I buy sightstone first back and I'm able to keep my lane warded to where in combination with bindings we almost never die to a gank and I vision ward Dragon and river.

But everything after that point seems to go down hill. The bot lane roams to our weakest lane and we start losing team fights and things get messy. I'm not sure how to effectively roam or exactly where I should be or how I can get in an ult without instantly dying.

Any advice?

16 Comments

BerserkGoldfish4/16/2015, 5:13:38 PM4 votes

zhonyas for the ult bud.she still ults through it, like fidds or kennen.

ElysMustache4/16/2015, 6:51:41 PM4 votes

From your match history:

I don't understand building Rylai's on Morgana. You usually only have your Q and your W, both of which have long cooldowns, and one of which stops the target in its tracks anyway. It just doesn't make sense.

You built a sightstone but kept your yellow trinket. You do this literally every support game. You should be swapping that for a Sweeping Lens as soon as you have sightstone. Removing enemy vision will help your team.

You seem to hate boots. Movement speed is valuable. Some games you have more than 4000 gold in items and no boots. Another game you have boots, but didn't get them until 28 minutes into the game. I would think that by the time you have upgraded your support item once and bought a sighstone, it is definitely time for at least Tier 1 boots.

I would say I dominate in the lane 95% of the time.

This is false. People like to say things like this, and they are almost always wrong. Let's look at your ranked game history. We'll use the 15 minute mark of the game as a metric.

Sivir/Morgana vs. Graves/Annie You are 600g behind Annie. Your ADC is 700g ahead of theirs.
Vayne/Morgana vs. Twitch/Thresh You are 1500g ahead of Thresh due to somehow managing a triple kill before four minutes. Your ADC is 1200 ahead. You have a HUGE advantage at this point. Sadly your ADC is an idiot and rushes Stattik Shiv as a first item. By 34 minutes Vayne has a reasonable build, but Ryze ends up facerolling your team. Looking at the team comps, and the number of times Vayne died, it seems like Vayne could have single-handedly thrown this one. However, Heimerdinger nearly outwarded you with just an upgraded trinket.
MF/Morg vs. Draven/Zyra You are 1600g behind. Your ADC is 2600g behind.
Kalista/Morg vs. Jinx/Thresh You are 300g ahead and your ADC is 1500g behind.
Varus/Morg vs. Vayne/Blitz You are 400g behind, and your ADC is 300 ahead.
Ezreal/Morg vs. Sivir/Sona You are 300g ahead, and your ADC is 500 ahead.
Sivir/Morg vs. MF/Thresh You are 400g behind, and your ADC is 2900g behind.
Graves/Annie vs. Caitlyn/Lux You are 600g behind and your ADC is 2400g ahead.
Jinx/Morg vs. Ashe/Soraka You are 800g behind, and your ADC is 1500 behind.

So here we have a 9-game sample size, with the claim that you "dominate in the lane 95% of the time". You are fooling yourself. You (y'all) dominated in games #2 and #8. That is not 95%. That is 22%. Your are only even AHEAD in four of the nine games.

Normals don't count. Don't even think that they do.

You have lost 19 of your 24 ranked games. Four of your five wins came on Amumu jungle. You might want to try that some more, because it is the only thing that has worked for you. The common factor in these games is you. And you are causing your team to lose. And it is not because the game is turning around after laning phase.

That's a dose of truth for you and I'm sorry, but man I hope it helps you assess things more realistically.

BigBenClockTower4/16/2015, 5:34:51 PM2 votes

Speaking as a fellow Bronze player, and as a Support main for 4 seasons, when you and your Marksman decide to start roaming, make sure you not only have a item 2049 (if you insist on building it), but also some kind of early defense increasing item, such as a item 3024 or item 3028 , with the idea being that extra HP alone will only get you so far. This is primarily a recommendation since chances are, other lanes may not have had as easy a time as you did, and some opponents may have a bit more under their belt as a result. Whether it's a 3/2/2 Fizz , a 0/2/1 Jax , or a 6/0/0 Yasuo , all of them can be incredibly scary to a squishier group like you and your Marksmen, so having some survivability is key.

Now that we have this down, focus your Marksman on roaming where the enemy bot lane does, since they will want to try and capitalize on your weaker teammates to get caught up. Especially if they have an Assassin running in the middle lane, since it's almost a sure thing that he will roam to the weak lane too. Early detection and mitigation solves the largest part of the problem here. Additionally, if your team is a bit behind in kills, gold, etc., don't force the teamfights. I cannot stress this enough. Repeated early teamfights when you are behind seems like a good idea (kills means gold means evening out), but more often than not, being behind to begin with means that it's easy to lose further ground in poorly chosen fights, making it even harder to start mounting a comeback.

Lastly, consistent ultimates as Morgana , even without a item 3157 , is possible if you wait for the enemy's opening disrupt and poke to be expended. If you are running it, SAVE summoner 4 . In fact, + summoner 21 and a Black Shield on yourself all but guarantees you'll pull off a full ultimate even without a ( summoner 7 could still work, but is better for the flat damage absorption and immunity to summoner 14 's effects in that absorption). Rushing a item 3069 might also be a nice idea, so you can abuse the movement speed bonus and active to keep up with people who try and flee the tether (since it does have a short range). item 3009 could be an option too, although item 3047 or item 3117 generally will prove a bit more useful thanks to their great passives.

Of course, this all applies to Bronze and Silver level play. Some of these tactics will not be as effective once out of Bronze and Silver (as some of my Diamond friends routinely showcase to me :P ), but it is a good catch all to start some experimentation.

I hope this helps a bit. I started practicing Top and Jungle this season (and last season), so I may be a bit rusty as a Support, but I still play it often enough. ;]

-BigBenClockTower

EvilScotsman19744/16/2015, 5:35:48 PM1 votes

Just because you took first tower it isnt the sign to roam and help a weak lane.

A good way to help the weak lane is to keep on pushing your own lane as what will generally happen is one of the other lanes or jungler will have to come help the bot lane.

This allows your own jungle to help the weak lane or the weak lane gets to push because it will generally be the lane that is doing well will roam to help.

If no help Comes for the bot lane you should be able to push the inner turret, so you then have to make the choice if you roam then as you will be even stronger but the global gold will help everyone.

Sometimes i feel that after the inner turret is taken its time to roam and yes i have been in this situation many times that it all goes pear shaped from this point like when you roam after taking the outer turret.

I feel if you are still going strong push the base turret and i am pretty sure someone will come help bot lane but then again (sorry to say) Bronze mentality often happens and they dont want to care or help and you can keep pushing and take inhib turret and inhib thus giving even more gold to your team thus helping your weaker lanes.

If you ever manage to get to this point your lane should be so strong that you can go to other lanes and help push them as the bot lane will be having to deal with supers and if they come to help the lane you are pushing they are letting supers push.

This does not always work but generally when i have kept pushing the lane with my adc and not roaming after taking outer things generally go well for the team.

Sonasaurous4/16/2015, 5:47:59 PM1 votes

Make sure you have plenty of vision and keep securing objectives. At the end of the game, its the team that gets the enemy nexus that wins, not the team with the most kills. I've won games where the score was dramatically skewed in favor of the enemy team, but my team still won because we were on top of the objectives, like the turrets and dragon.

When I'm supporting, I'm usually either with my team during teamfights, especially if I'm a utility or disengage support (like Sona or Janna) or I'm with the splitpusher taking down the towers.

What I've noticed especially in the few ranked games I've played is that bronzies care way more about kills then they should. I see them running into teamfight after teamfight, leaving the minions to push towers. By all means, as support, stay with your team in the fights, but try communicating with your teams splitpusher (usually the top, or ADCs like Jinx or Tristana) to push the lanes. A good strategy I found is getting all of you to push either top or bottom pretty hard so that the enemy team goes to that lane, then sending off the split pusher to the opposite side of the map (so if you're pushing bot, send them top, and vice versa) to push that lane. Especially if your team can win 4v5 teamfights, you can easily win. But of course, not all team compositions work out like that.

FedAsFuk4/16/2015, 9:50:51 PM1 votes

I would say it comes down to team fights, most likely you lose focus on protecting the carries, as support your job is to either initiate depending on champ (not morg) but regardless of champ you can always focus on saving the carries

AwesomeChad4/16/2015, 7:20:17 PM1 votes

Sure if you win lane, then look to use your advantage to make an impact on the game elsewhere on the map. As the support, u have the option of roaming to mid to help your teammate pick up a kill or at least poke the enemy out of lane ur mid laner gets a CS lead. Winning lane is a good thing but are you able to translate that lead into taking objectives for your team? Take the dragon if you kill your bot lane. Push the minion wave out and take the turret. Set up wards in the enemy bot jungle. Also, u have to learn how to teamfight better. Building hourglass on morgana will allow you to engage into the enemy team and safely land your ult off.

Only Play Darius4/16/2015, 7:49:41 PM1 votes

Because you're playing support.

In Bronze.

Sorry but being a support main in low elo is not how you climb.