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Need Jungle advice

Scramrail·1/18/2015, 10:41:07 AM·2 votes·1,244 views

I haven't played since about October/November of last year in any real capacity as other games and the holidays ate up my time. But im back now to a degree and im looking to get back in the swing of things for the upcoming season, but this new jungle is just putting me through the meatgrinder to say the least.

I just cant really seem to get the hang of it. No matter what I start on it seems I have to go back to base to heal after clearing the second buff camp, which leaves me with very little in the way of spending money for my second clear, which I usually end up having to go back again after as well. I just feel like im so far behind everyone else in the game with this new jungle, and the new monsters hit so hard I typically choose to play it safe and go back even if there might be potential to clear another camp just because id rather not risk dying to jungle monsters.

My most comfortable jungler by far is Vi, and I can usually do decent with her on ganks and whatnot as well so she's my "go-to" when I can, but before I stopped playing she was banned fairly regularly so I need to learn someone else as well.

My other options for junglers that I own are: Maokai, Amumu, Wukong, Rammus, Lee Sin, Warwick, Nasus, Master Yi, Pantheon, Tryndamere and Jax.

Im not fond of Jax, Yi, Tryn or Nasus personally, but im willing to learn them if theyre the best options.

I guess im pretty much looking for a short guide on how to handle this new jungle. The new jungler items are a bit of a mystery to me as well. Is there a dedicated option for each champion/role you plan on playing, or are the choices suppose to be made on the fly during games?

9 Comments

King Lagii1/18/2015, 11:21:32 AM1 votes

Well, I'm not a jungler main, but I do enjoy playing it when I am given the chance. Not saying that my advice will be bad, just warning you that my advice will be given from my personal experience, and where that experience lies.

This new jungle really has taken a lot of us by surprise, and as far as I can say, most jungler options won't be able to make it to the 2nd buff in their 1st run. Generally speaking, no jungler gets the leash on their buffs anymore. Instead they get the leash on one of two small camps: starting the frog between blue and top lane, or going with the golems, located between red and bot lane. The mid laner doesn't really leash anymore, since the location of the starting camp is further away from their lanes, but since these camps are smaller camps, and still offer you level 2 upon clearing, the difference of one less person isn't particularly impactful. A key point to make, and the main purpose that junglers no longer start on their buffs is the new smite bonuses: you get a small buff depending on the monster you smite. Frog offers a poison that acts similar to Annie E. The wolves release a specter that will roam around the that side of the jungle for a time offering vision. The birds that now take place of the Wraiths give you a buff that recognizes wards in close proximity to you. The golems give a buff that will stun monsters or minions every 5 basic attacks. The red and blue buffs give you health or mana respectively. As far as runes, I found that going with runes you would find more commonly during lanes works better. I use magic pen marks and move speed quint on Maokai , and use attack damage while using Vi . In the old jungle, it was generally effective to just use attack speed for the runes since the creatures aren't strong, so damage wasn't really necessary, but being able to trigger the red buff more often during ganks had a lot of value. Now with the monsters in the jungle posing a huge threat, having something more champion specific or something scaling better later is more prefered. The only real difference between my lane runes and my jungle runes is that for the seals, i find it extremely crucial to be running a full 9x of flat armor. Your route choice, other than having started on the frog or golems, remains unchanged.

The new jungle items were to offer some clarity to playing the jungle a specific way. Each of the new jungle items alters the smite in a specific way. Stalkers Blade: Smite is castable on champions, dealing damage and slowing down the target by 20% for 2 seconds. This is the ideal choice for if you like to gank a lot, or play a champion that may have difficulties when it comes to ganks. Poacher's Knife: Smiting a monster in the enemies jungle will give you a decaying speed boost after killing the said monster. This is ideally for if you prefer counter jungling. Skirmisher's Sabre: You can smite enemy champions, causing them to do 20% less damage to you while you causing bonus true damage on autoattack. This is for the players that duel enemy junglers, or are reliant on their autoattacks. Ranger's Trailblazer: This makes your smite an aoe stun that heals for a % of the damage dealt. This is for champions that prefer to stay in their own side of the jungle, clearing their camps. The enchantments for each of these 4 items is universal between them, with each being focused for the champion you are playing. Warrior for AD champions, Magus for AP champions, Juggernaut for tank champions. Devourer is the enchantment that takes place of Wriggle's Lantern.

After all is said, if you are having trouble staying alive in your jungle, rush to make a Ranger's Trailblazer, as it is the one that will help you the most in surviving these new, unforgiving camps.

Scramrail1/18/2015, 3:27:22 PM1 votes

Thanks for the reply. I already disliked jungling before these changes and I dislike it even more now. What was the purpose of all these changes anyways? Was the jungle really so bad as it was that they needed to completely overhaul it along with the items?

Its nice being able to use smite during ganks for added damage/control, but that just ends up forcing you to decide if you want an easier time clearing the jungle or a slightly higher chance of getting the kill during ganks.

Howldoom1/18/2015, 11:36:32 PM1 votes

In terms of actual clearing, start with the side camp near bot lane (Krugs or stone beetles on Blue side, Gromp or giant toad on Red side). **Smite it **for the buff; Krugs allow you to stun monsters every 6th attack for some damage mitigation, and Gromp gives you a poison armor for more damage to monsters.

**Then clear the buff in that quadrant **(Brambleback/Red or Golem/Blue, respectively). Save your Smite, though.

Afterwards, if you're on Red side and killed the Golem, go clear the Murkwolves; this'll bring you to level 3; then go STRAIGHT to the Krugs near top lane and Smite them for their buff, then get Red buff and go back to base.

If you're on Blue side, however, and you've gotten Red buff, then completely pass the Razorbeaks; they do too much damage during your first clear, ergo you will either get executed, use Smite for its buff too early for you to use it properly, or be at very low health which will necessitate going back earlier. Just go to Gromp, Smite it, then clear Blue and Murkwolves, then back.

This is my first clear strat I use with Vi. For less mitigating or sustaining champions, though, you may have to go back a couple camps earlier.

item 3706 - Get this if you like ganking lanes. item 3713 - Faster and easier camp clearing. item 3715 - Good damage to single-target champions. item 3711 - Least popular of the S5 Jungle items, but good if you can keep control of the enemy jungle.

item 3707 - AD Junglers (e.g. Vi, Rengar, Warwick) item 3708 - AP Junglers (e.g. Fiddlesticks) item 3709 - Tank Junglers (e.g. Sejuani, Sion) item 3710 - Feral Flare 2.0 (e.g. XinZhao)

Murkwolves - Smite them only if their jungle quadrant is vulnerable to invades (e.g. your team lost top and/or mid, the enemy may or may not be in there). If you use wards, though, save your Smite for something else.

Razorbeaks - Try Smiting this camp right before you gank, to clear out possible wards from your intended ambush point or to clean your side of the map of deep enemy wards. TIP: Plant Stealth Wards on or near the camp to instantly trigger the True SIght and spoil the buff.

Krugs - Smite these whenever you're thinking of farming.

Gromp - Smite him for the same reason you would with Krugs.

Brambleback (Red), Golem (Blue) - Unless the enemy is near (but not too close to steal the buff), or your presence is requested sorely while you're in the middle of clearing it ("Oh no! Bot lane chased into unwarded territory and got killed by a land shark/broken ninjas/ the Devil and his mushrooms!" or something), you should never have other reasons to smite them (okay, maybe very low health is a possibility, but you should be more careful beforehand). Red heals and Blue gives instant mana when you smite them, but there are other camps more worthy of Smite in the long term.

Dragon, Baron - You should always have Smite for these. UNLESS you just won a teamfight, the enemy jungler is dead and has no Revive like he/she should not have unless they have a system, and the enemy team won't return to steal it in time (be careful if they have someone with Teleport, though).

Spiritflare8681/19/2015, 8:42:57 AM1 votes

As Vi is one of my favorite junglers, and also yours, let's use her as an example

Vi is very much an Auto Attack based champion, and with all AA junglers, you want to start almost exclusively with Krugs. Start with your W. Always. Then E, then Q. It's up to you what you max first, whether you like to be a 1-hit-wonder with a maxed Q, or you want to be a skirmisher/brawler with your W. Don't start Gromp with any jungler that doesn't have very strong innate tankiness (ie a powerful, low CD shield), or very strong sustain (lots of lifesteal) If you're on the blue side you're gonna have a much easier time since you'll have the ADC to leash for you. On the red side, you need to convince your top-laner to leash for you. If your top laner is hella cool ( like when I top) they'll take a couple hits of agro for you and you'll be off to a great start. Otherwise have them help you get the big krug to half health and then ping them to retreat. **Krugs don't hurt nearly as much as Gromp does so you'll have more HP for the rest of your clear, and since you rely on AAs to clear, the buff helps you a lot more. **

JUNGLE ROUTE

I've found that a full first clear of the jungle, and then backing before giving anyone a gank is the best way to go with champs like Vi and Diana. This is the path I take Krugs > Wolves (yeah ignore the whole Red buff section of your jungle) > Gromp (smite here) > Blue buff (smite here if you need it, since the new charge system should have a smite up at gromp and here) > Raptors/Red buff (Raptors if you're more than half health here, Red if you didn't smite blue and need the HP.) > Red buff/Raptors (the other one) > Krugs again. By the end of this clear, you will be level 4, and have enough gold for your jungle item upgrade, pots, and either boots, or a longsword.

ITEMIZATION As far as jungle upgrades go, I almost exclusively use either item 3706 or item 3713 . Trailblazer for faster clearing and counter-jungling, meaning more time fighting you enemies and helping your allies, Stalkers for more effective ganks if your allies lack CC or you really need to shut someone down quickly. item 3715 is pretty niche for me with the junglers I use, but if you're building AS or something or going into a lot of 1v1s then Challenging Smite is pretty damn useful. It just doesn't fit my personal playstyle.

Jungle enchantments. Warrior is your best bet with Vi, she benefits very directly from AD, CDR, and definitely ArPen. Devourer is an OK alternative if you tend to spend a lot of time AFK farming, and you have an AS focussed build for her, but it's a pretty niche build and not that useful in most situations since you probably want to be ganking whenever you can. I only really suggest devourer if you're using a Trailblazer and have that ridiculous fast clear for maximum stacks. Magus is useless on Vi. It's the AP alternative to Warrior. Don't build Juggernaut on her either. In fact, don't build juggernaut.

Your build should be your complete jungle item, one damage item of your choice (black cleaver synergizes best with Vi but there are lots of options), Boots, 2 defensive items, and from there if you're ahead and getting fed, another damage, if you're behind or have mostly assists then another defensive item.

Folding Chair1/20/2015, 3:48:17 PM1 votes

I found that Elise Diana have really good jungle sustain for AP junglers with no healing abilities, (I.E; Fiddlesticks ) For these two I usually start blue (ask for a good leash, don't use smite.) With Elise start Skittering Frenzy/Volatile Spiderling Diana start W (Shield) continue to wolves after blue, do red and smite for health back. Then pick to do Gromp or Krugs and gank the lane that needs it. No the best guide but just what I've been doing lately and I can normally stay in the jungle for a long time as Elise due to her great sustain