RNG for the sake of RNG isn't a good thing.

Barkley·Jul 31, 2019·4 votes·857 views

First and foremost -- RNG is not why you're hardstuck Iron/Bronze, or wherever you are. There is enough skill expression in this game that if you play well, you will definitely climb. Lets get that out of the way right now. Give me my downvote. It may be a contributing factor in the games you lose, but its not why you lose often and can't climb.

Phew. Now that's out of the way...

There are certain things in this game that are RNG where there's legitimately no reason for RNG to exist. Its RNG for the sake of RNG. And for a game company that's fought so hard over the years to remove RNG from their game to "Keep it competitive," this comes as a bit of a shock to me.

First, the opponents you face in this game are randomly chosen. Why? What's the strategic value here? In a game that's meant to have layers of strategy, wouldn't it make more sense to tell someone who they're facing next? I'm not opposed to random pairings, but random BLIND pairings doesn't make a whole lot of sense. There are few things in this game that feel worse than going against the top player 4 times in a row when you didn't see it coming and had no time to prepare. Sure, you could just assume you're facing the same person twice -- but then we're getting into Schrodinger's TFT opponent. You're only going to face the same opponent twice when you DON'T prepare for it.

Second, the amount of items any one person gets in one match is random. This is absurd, and there's roughly eleventy-bajillion posts about this already so I won't beat a dead horse. Riot doesn't care, we got it. Short and sweet -- Items should be random. Quantity shouldn't. If you want a lengthier explanation as to why -- go read one of the 600 other threads about it. There's legitimately no one that plays this game that would argue this system is stupid. 100% of people want it changed. Riot doesn't care. Moving on...

Third, proc chances are random. Why? Why do we have a 60% chance of X, and a 30% chance of Y, and a 25% chance of Z happening in a game? Why can't we do things like "Freeze a champ on every 3rd auto attack" or "Every other spell cast is twice as strong" or "Whenever you land 3 consecutive damaging abilities/attacks on the same target, some shit happens" There are so many more consistent ways of applying effects in a game. I don't see why we opted into yet ANOTHER pointless instance of RNG. (Thanks for that noble buff on my level 1 Lulu! Just what I needed...)

Fourth, the carousel. Why? Not only is it a bunch of random champions -- some of which might absolutely win the game for someone. Some of them might be completely useless to everyone. Some have items that will win the game for them. Some have items that nobody wants. you might get a carousel full of bows and belts. you might get one of each item. You might get three FULLY COMPLETED items. One of them might be a FORCE OF GODDAMN NATURE!?! What is this?? Why is this?? Here's an idea -- make a mini shop. Each mini-shop round, you get one token. The mini shop presents you with 3 random champs and 3 random items. Spend your tokens as you like among the randomly given choices. Or don't! Save them for later! Also -- creep rounds now have the chance to drop a mini-shop token (but if they do, they drop nothing else) This is the single biggest RNG cesspool in the game, and its just so damn easy to fix. My solution is only one of dozens I've seen that are better than the current implementation. Pick an idea and roll with it -- but this shit's gotta go.

Lastly is champion behavior. This one I feel like will get better over time through bug fixes. At least I hope so. Currently, there a number of annoying things that can happen.

Champions sit idle and do nothing for an entire round
Champions randomly change targets in the middle of a fight.
Champions randomly cast their abilities in a completely different direction than their target.
Champions that are supposed to target low-health enemies with their ability -- don't. (Lulu)
Champions that are supposed to block incoming damage -- don't. (Braum, with his shield behind him protecting no one)
Champions that are supposed to travel to a target -- don't. (Warwick leaping into nobody. Rek'Sai taking a scenic detour, Darius spinning for funsies)
Champions that are supposed to target a group -- don't. (That cho'gath ult that hits precisely no one. Leona. Sejuani.)

And these are just the RNG complaints I have. Don't get me started on item stacking/champion stacking. (For those who haven't had the pleasure of facing a with his good buddy )

Now... despite all this -- I'm having a lot of fun with this game mode, and I really do love it. I'm climbing just fine -- had a brief stint in platinum, am now Gold 1 trying to get my way back into Platinum. I can consistently place in the top 5, rarely place in the bottom 3. Its a good time, and I'm gonna keep playing.

But god damn we could really relieve a lot of frustration if we just changed a few of the things this community talks about regularly.

11 Comments

True GarenAug 1, 20194 votes

Riot likes RNG in general, because RNG is frustrating.

Pika FoxJul 31, 20192 votes

Who you face is random just so you cant position to hard counter a single teamcomp. Assassins, blitzcrank and other position depending units would get hard fucked early if you could position specifically for them.

Its less of an issue later because its just a fight to see who won more, and you have more units than just your assassincrank.

Gold as a reward is fine. Only complaint i have is that gold is worth less the later in the game you are, and late game you need 10+g if you dont get an item.

BarkleyJul 31, 20191 votes

Alright, fair enough -- Then make some change that says "If I faced player X last round, I don't face player X next round."

Pika FoxJul 31, 20192 votes

{quoted}

Alright, fair enough -- Then make some change that says "If I faced player X last round, I don't face player X next round."

I dont think that would really improve the game at all.

BarkleyAug 1, 20191 votes

How so?

if I'm running a full gunslinger comp and smashing absolutely everyone but the top guy who has a yordle comp -- This game is designed so that certain comps counter other comps. Thats "as designed."

So if I've got the most powerful gunslinger comp on the map, and its smashing everyone.

And he's got the most powerful yordle comp on the map, and its smashing everyone.

I should hyptothetically be 2nd, and he should hypothetically be first. Because yordles counter gunslingers and other than that, we've been smashing people all game long.

But that's not what happens.

Instead, my gunslinger comp faces the yordle comp 3-4 times in a row. I get wrecked (because yordles counter gunslingers) 3-4 times in a row. That's 20-40 health off my health pool.

Now I face some other random joe shmo.

Out of pure, unadulterated luck -- he beats me because idk.... my Graves glitched out and stood still all game. I don't know -- Pick a random reason why I lost. It doesn't matter.

Now I'm 3rd instead of 2nd because of some bullshit off-chance that some weirdness happened or something glitched out.

When in reality, my comp was stronger and I should have been 2nd only to the comp that actually beats me, not some random RNG luck bullshit.

But because I lost 30-40 health by REPEATEDLY facing a comp that should ABSOLUTELY beat me -- I lose more LP than I would have otherwise, simply because I got rapid-fire paired against a comp that OBVIOUSLY beats me.

I don't see the fairness, here.

If I'd faced that other Joe Shmo guy 4 times in a row, I'd be second place.

or if .... oh I don't know... they stopped people from facing the same dude 3-4 times in a row -- I'd be 2nd, Yordle guy would be 1st, and Joe Shmo would be 3rd. The way it OUGHT to be.

Pika FoxAug 1, 20191 votes

{quoted}

How so?

if I'm running a full gunslinger comp and smashing absolutely everyone but the top guy who has a yordle comp -- This game is designed so that certain comps counter other comps. Thats "as designed."

So if I've got the most powerful gunslinger comp on the map, and its smashing everyone.

And he's got the most powerful yordle comp on the map, and its smashing everyone.

I should hyptothetically be 2nd, and he should hypothetically be first. Because yordles counter gunslingers and other than that, we've been smashing people all game long.

But that's not what happens.

Instead, my gunslinger comp faces the yordle comp 3-4 times in a row. I get wrecked (because yordles counter gunslingers) 3-4 times in a row. That's 20-40 health off my health pool.

Now I face some other random joe shmo.

Out of pure, unadulterated luck -- he beats me because idk.... my Graves glitched out and stood still all game. I don't know -- Pick a random reason why I lost. It doesn't matter.

Now I'm 3rd instead of 2nd because of some bullshit off-chance that some weirdness happened or something glitched out.

When in reality, my comp was stronger and I should have been 2nd only to the comp that actually beats me, not some random RNG luck bullshit.

But because I lost 30-40 health by REPEATEDLY facing a comp that should ABSOLUTELY beat me -- I lose more LP than I would have otherwise, simply because I got rapid-fire paired against a comp that OBVIOUSLY beats me.

I don't see the fairness, here.

If I'd faced that other Joe Shmo guy 4 times in a row, I'd be second place.

or if .... oh I don't know... they stopped people from facing the same dude 3-4 times in a row -- I'd be 2nd, Yordle guy would be 1st, and Joe Shmo would be 3rd. The way it OUGHT to be.

And in this time, you didnt.... swap someone out, reposition to deal with the yordle comp.... nothing? Just stood there and lost 3-4x in a row? Theres only 3 players left in your scenario. You should be adjusting for both.

And even in your scenario, YOU STILL CAME THIRD. You didnt "deserve" second. You didnt even beat the guy in second.

SubdueJul 31, 20191 votes

Random opponents: it's more difficult to arrange your units that in a way that gives you a chance against a variety of opponents than it is to arrange against a specific opponent. For example, if you know your opponent has all assassins, all you have to do is stick all your squishies in front and all your tanks in the second row, and you completely neuter their effectiveness. However, if you don't know if you'll face the assassins or the glacial composition, the above is not an option.
Items: Agreed.
On hit procs: if I stack enough attack speed on Ashe to get to 2.5 attacks per seconds and I get a proc every 3 attacks, that's a guaranteed permanent freeze. Same goes for any other on hit effect with a proc %.
Carousel: Part of the come back mechanic, provides a strategic reason to give up early HP. Let's you show off your little legend.

BarkleyJul 31, 20191 votes

{quoted}

On hit procs: if I stack enough attack speed on Ashe to get to 2.5 attacks per seconds and I get a proc every 3 attacks, that's a guaranteed permanent freeze. Same goes for any other on hit effect with a proc %.

Take my figures with a grain of salt, friend. Lets focus on the concept, not the example. I just pitched a number out there for the sake of discussion. It wasn't meant to be taken verbatim.

SubdueAug 1, 20191 votes

{quoted}

Take my figures with a grain of salt, friend. Lets focus on the concept, not the example. I just pitched a number out there for the sake of discussion. It wasn't meant to be taken verbatim.

Right, so what numbers would make it not broken but also not feel like crap to use?

BarkleyAug 1, 20191 votes

My job title that I get paid for is "Software Engineer" for electronic health records/healthcare IT.

Not "Balance team for Riot Games"

So I don't know the answer to this question.

SubdueAug 1, 20191 votes

{quoted}

My job title that I get paid for is "Software Engineer" for electronic health records/healthcare IT.

Not "Balance team for Riot Games"

So I don't know the answer to this question.

If Ashe can attack 2.5x per second and each attack proc freezes for 2 seconds (like it is now), that means if she procs 1 out of every 5 attacks, she can achieve a permanent stun. If she procs 1 out of every 10 attacks, then any slow attacking or melee range enemies are effectively permanently stunned, since they can't complete a motion before being stunned again. But from the point of view of the player with Ashe, how does it feel to not proc more than 10% of her attacks?

The point is that making it a chance to proc rather than a guaranteed proc lets you increase the probability of it happening, so that Ashe doesn't feel useless, while not guaranteeing that she takes one or more units instantly and permanently out of the fight.

And by the way, it's rather hypocritical to make suggestions about game balance and game design and then cry "Not balance team for Riot Games" when pressed for clarification on your point of view. Do we just disregard all of your opinions because you're "Not balance team for Riot Games?"