I'm not gonna say too much here, I'll just let the screenshots talk for themselves.Just know the first 3 games are played by me, in a row. The last one is from a game played by someone else, but in Plat 3, like me.
1st game: +27 LP https://imgur.com/EsveSu8
2nd game: +27 LP https://imgur.com/X9c756P
3rd game: +27 LP https://imgur.com/MWVo2aA
Someone else placed 8th, in the same elo as me: -72 LP https://imgur.com/4qHjTAB
Barkley2 votesGetting 8th should hurt. A LOT.
Shit I'd even say take away the demotion cushion. Your MMR should be your MMR. period. Enough of this hidden BS.
I don't know or care what your rank is and I'm not going to look at it or assume anything, so for the sake of argument lets say you peaked at Gold 1, then started losing.
You probably spiked real hard off a bunch of wins -- then wins started meaning less and less (because they should reasonably have diminishing returns? Idk its a rito thing -- ask them)
In the game, because its stupid, you've been blazing through ranks and divisions. Iron, Bronze, Silver, Gold -- one after the other. Nothing can stop you.
But in actual MMR land, where shit actually makes sense and matters -- you've only been climbing a little bit. But this is hidden from you, because Riot is stupid.
So realistically you're actually probably only like high silver, mid low gold MMR.
So now we're back in rito land where the game is for some reason telling you you're Gold 1, but in MMR land, you're only mid silver. Because of the huge discrepancy, you lose a SHIT TON of LP because the stupid game's stupid system is always trying to get you to equilibrium of where your MMR actually is behind the scenes. If you win a bunch, it'll drag you down. If you lose a bunch, it'll help you out.
All of this said -- hypothetically you'll go on a pretty nasty losing streak now. You're matched against players that are higher than your skill. Probably MUCH higher than your skill. Gotta knock you down a few pegs back towards players you actually belong with.
But wait, there's more!
Because of the discrepancy in MMR and Rank, the game will actually OVERCOMPENSATE in trying to get your two different-for-some-goddamn-reason ratings, and will now start putting you against players you absolutely crush. We're gonna swing the pendulum the entire other goddamn direction.
Sweet, omg, I'm gaining LP again! I've gotten better! I'm good at this game! Look at me smashing EVERYONE!
And because of the stupid ass ranked/MMR system discrepancy, you get catapulted right past the rank you're supposed to be AGAIN and end up mismatched AGAIN.
And you'd THINK that after a little while, the momentum would cancel itself out, and you end up nice and comfy cozy where you're supposed to be, and all the outliers and weird streaks and trends go away, and you pretty much stay consistent from that point forward -- which is what would normally statistically happen in a functioning, normal system.
But that's boring. Its much more interesting and much more addicting and much more profitable to keep the players on this nice pendulum effect, so that when they're high -- they're real high. Give them the illusion that they're making progress -- they're fighting the good fight! But when they're low, they never feel like they're gonna be up again. We're chasing dragons here. Like a bunch of damn junkies.
Welcome to ranked the Riot way.
Quîver1 votesI agree with 99% of what you said. That is exactly what is going on right now. But ONLY because the game is so new and the ladder hasn't had a chance to settle. Ranked 5v5 the ladder works exactly as intended. People are more often than not at the correct ranking they should be. Getting better little by little. Eventually when the game gets more balanced and people settle into their ranks, it will even out. MMR is still gonna be an issue with win and loss streaks, but I say within 5-6 months everyone is going to be where they are supposed to be. Not saying you are wrong in anyway, about the state of it right now, but its beta and it's been 3 weeks of ranked. What can we expect?
Barkley1 votesEven normal 5v5 ranked works this way. Your mean rating will be precisely where its supposed to be, but the upswings and downswings are ridiculous. I've personally gone on 10-20 win streaks and 10-20 loss streaks. The statistical probability of this happening by chance, without any sort of external influence is minuscule (Though not impossible).
There are forces at play that help these things happen. If it were a truly fair system -- we would do as you say. We'd get hardstuck somewhere for weeks, months at a time. Ever so slowly improving (or not, even). Most you'd fluctuate is a few divisions.
But you regularly see people going up and down +/- 3 divisions or sometimes even a full rank at times.
I'm not trying to claim conspiracy theory here (although it is fun, isn't it?) and I'm not saying anything about my own rank or where I belong -- but I would readily call into question how normal the curve really is, how consistent the game actually is at matchmaking according to rank/MMR, how the two correlate with each other to give us what we experience, and most importantly WHY we need a hidden rating at all.
Quîver1 votesOkay actually I'll give you that. I have gone on long win and loss streaks like that. Usually blaming or congratulating my play. I'm sure most the time it is my play, but I am actually curious now as to how accurately placed I am. Cause the win streaks would be complete utter stomps. Then I would get stomped over and over. So okay I agree sadly... I never really thought about it that much.
Illabethe1 votesActually, the LP gains won't change. Why? The average player performance is actually Rank 4. Over time the tier rewards will average them there.
Which is an average of 12 -15 LP a win, and an average of 15 LP a loss.
The only thing TFT is doing that SR is not: It is giving a range of rewards over time, rather than having those rewards taper off when you have a large game sample size.
Quîver1 votesI agree it seems a bit harsh, but as you go on more win streaks (Like total games. Coming in first. Not win streaks in the game) your MMR (Matchmaking Rating) goes up. Meaning you win more and more LP per win, but I know people don't like hearing that they need to go on streaks, since in this game it's kinda hard to get first every round. Especially with how unbalanced everything is at the moment...
So let me give you another perspective. If you came in first those games you probably would have gained around 45+ per win. Which would have promoted you and given you a cushion to fall on in the next division. Coming in last place should be punishing. Most the time you should be able to pull in 5th or 6th place and not take such a big hit to your LP. LP Gain and Loss = MMR. Right now my buddy is in plat and has the same LP clamping going on, but he also went on a huge loss streak. About 14 games. Those losses add up, and ruin your MMR. Stay positive, if it's really an issue riot will fix it in the upcoming patches. Once the game is more balanced and fleshed out it will be more strategy and less running demons and gunslingers.
And I know you said it it's a different person for the last game but that just means maybe they really messed up their MMR.
Cräfty2 votesYeah, I hope they fix the LP system soon, it's becoming more and more frustrating to climb this slowly and lose all your progress in just one big loss.
And btw, those 3 games in my thread, I played them back to back. That's 3 win streak right there, but still +27 LP each time. #feelsbadman
Quîver1 votesYeah it takes time sadly... I mean where did you get placed? I'm guessing you climbed up to plat pretty quick right? Games only been out about 3 weeks now. I am just about to hit plat now. First 2 weeks I went from Iron II - Gold IV. This week got to Gold I 75 LP.
Take it from me. I have played summoners rift 5v5 ranked since season 4. I just hit gold last season in that. Took me years to climb (mostly cause I suck at that gamemode but still). TFT to me feels like a gift being able to climb this fast.
Edit: Also sucks we play on different servers. Really looking for people to queue up with.
Cräfty1 votesI've been following the game since it was first on PBE, so I had a good grasp of the basics when it came into live server.
When I finished my placements, I got placed in bronze, I think. I can't remember if it was bronze 1 or 2, but it was definitely bronze. then started climbing pretty much every day. 3 or 4 games a day, something like that.
It's weird, I feel like the game was more balanced at its release than now. I swear I saw more diversity in everybody's comps back then, than in this current patch. Maybe that's because everyone was trying to figure out the infamous meta?! idk...
[zombie-brand-clap]
Quîver1 votesThe reason why it's all demons and gunslingers right now is because of the last patch. They really buffed and nerfed the hell out of everything trying to balance the current state of the game. Now we are just left with absolute chaos. The way the next patch looks (9.15 for TFT) it actually seems a little more balanced, but we won't know for sure until we get back in the game during that time. From the looks of it in my opinion Noble, Guardians are going to be busted and same goes for brawler gunslingers again. Demons are getting a bit of a nerf i'm pretty sure.
Check this guy out on the new patch coming (It's Phy if you know who that is lol):
Scramrails1 votesRiot has never been able to implement an intelligent ranked system. I think I played maybe one season of "serious" ranked, climbing to high silver with a low gold MMR, only to be dropped back into bronze the next season. So I said fuck it, if im not going to be placed at or at least very near where I was the previous season (you know, where my skill level says I should be) im not going to waste my time. Its the same with TFT, just a huge waste of time because the system seems designed for the players who can invest hundreds of hours a season climbing ranked with absolutely no consideration for casual play.
Worst JG Wins1 votes[deleted]
Cräfty1 votesHave you tried to open your eyes and to actually pay attention to my screenshots of 3 wins in a row?! I even listed them in order.
Besides, I'm plat 2 and still climbing, so I'm pretty good at the game, thanks.
Worst JG Wins1 votesHave you tried to open your eyes and to actually pay attention to my screenshots of 3 wins in a row?! I even listed them in order.
Besides, I'm plat 2 and still climbing, so I'm pretty good at the game, thanks.
It's called a joke dude.
Also second places aren't wins and don't worry it gets even worse as you get into Diamond.
Illabethe1 votesIt's because they expect a climbing player not to place 8th. Even if you are a loser in the right elo, you should be 5-6th if you are an elo appropriate contender. Which.... only loses 8-20 LP
P.S. You didn't place first. First in Plat is about +56 - +60
P.P.S keep in mind TFT doesn't have Promotion Series, but DOES have deranking protection.......