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Riot plz Change item max from 3 to 2

CurS1VE·7/6/2019, 4:27:49 PM·82 votes·21,770 views

I've run into over and over, there isn't really any strategic decision behind it people are stacking items on 1 champ cause it's basically a easy way for them to be competitive.

I don't have a problem with items overall but when you have double spear of shojin and a rageblade or whatever, it makes it so that there isn't a lot of counter play to it and rather than say "nerf this champ" or "nerf this item specifically" it's more beneficial to the entire community since:

It increases the amount of decision making you have with items
It limits radical snowballing building 1 champ which is not good for the game in any way
it will help other champs who aren't as popular or "strong" have a chance to be since it would in some ways require some sort of choice to be made
If you are on the other team against someone who happened to get more items you still have at least some chance depending on your team. You can in theory "Outplay" some champs with 2 items but when they have 3 it's nearly impossible to match

Also; I am all for the removal of Double Stacking Items, making them Unique passive makes more sense. I'm not saying to pick 1 or the other, in fact I think it'd probably be a better game if BOTH changes came through (no double stacking items / unique and also reducing items from 3 to 2)

There's been a lot of ppl expressing in this thread so I am just editing this now so ppl understand that it doesn't have to be 1 or the other, there isn't anything saying that both changes couldn't come in and honestly I think if both were implemented the game would be imo better.

69 Comments

Ratpie7/6/2019, 4:47:55 PM32 votes

I have a hard time with a lot of the suggestions I read on here, but the more I think about this one, the more I like it.

Some of the worst item things I see would be fixed by this. 2 good items still makes a really strong combo, but it helps keep champs from being undefeatable. I won one game because I got a level 3 Kass, and put phantom, warmog, and a blood thirster (I have tried it with the 87% MR item, but that really feels ineffective tbh). Nobody could kill him. It was some funny stuff. I had a team that actually wiped all my other champs, and he 1v5 the rest to win. But if I could only put 2 items on him, he is still strong, but he has to have 1 weakness. Either he can't regain life back as easily, or I have to open him up for crit damage. Same thing for those corner adcs that have RFC, hurricane, and a bloodthirster or crit item. They are too easy to protect and give far too much damage (put them 1 spot over to avoid blitz pull, have your army of ice or yordles etc.) With only 2 now you have to make a decision, do you go for range and spread, or range and healing, or healing and spread? Still all strong options, but not absurd end damage and sustainability/utility. 3star Ashe with RFC/Hurricane/blademaster with ranger bonus is what I went against recently, and she was solo freezing and killing my whole team.

I would give this more upvotes if I could. This game is mostly about decision making, and this would add another good layer of that decision making.

Icy Hot Shoto7/6/2019, 9:39:18 PM13 votes

And maybe make it so you can't do double of the same item.

I saw a Pyke with just 2 SoS, and he was stunning basically every 3rd auto attack. That was broken as hell and made the entire game completely unfun for myself and those I was playing with.

Remni Strath7/6/2019, 6:37:22 PM10 votes

I actually was thinking this same thing just yesterday that it should be lowered to 2 as well. There's just too much that can snowball easily currently with 3 items

tParaboll7/6/2019, 7:27:15 PM10 votes

This is actually a pretty good suggestion i never thought about that.

Mastergun1177/7/2019, 1:42:04 AM4 votes

I honestly feel like there's 2 things they need to do 1. Make it so people can't double stack 1 item and 2. Make it so in the early stages people are guaranteed items that way others will always have a chance even if they are behind that will solve the whole issue. Plus if someone is putting strong items on their adc it won't matter because theres PD and Thornmail really easy to make iteams.

The Dreamwalker7/6/2019, 9:12:05 PM3 votes

I just wish items were unique and couldn't be stacked. Like you could build it, but you wouldn't benefit from the effect only the stats.

TrenixPL7/6/2019, 8:02:27 PM3 votes

I'd even be down for restricting it to one item per champ with item combining still being a thing.

mrxavier20127/6/2019, 10:28:47 PM3 votes

I think for the game to stay on par with auto chess and keep a relative relevance for a long time this would not work. I get the idea but I think a better fix would be to make the items not stackable or make it into a more progressive build like items on league. Do what auto chess does and make the items build from a path and you can go into different items and change the way the attributes work. I like auto chess better because the game is based on how you build your comp and the piece's strength and abilities and items are just a plus.

Cowseed7/6/2019, 6:20:27 PM3 votes

Auto heavy champs are dangerously strong with three items. Especially lucian and considering he's a noble shivers

1 516 735 35087/7/2019, 1:50:36 AM3 votes

{quoted}

I've run into over and over, there isn't really any strategic decision behind it people are stacking items on 1 champ cause it's basically a easy way for them to be competitive.

I don't have a problem with items overall but when you have double spear of shojin and a rageblade or whatever, it makes it so that there isn't a lot of counter play to it and rather than say "nerf this champ" or "nerf this item specifically" it's more beneficial to the entire community since:

It increases the amount of decision making you have with items

It limits radical snowballing building 1 champ which is not good for the game in any way

it will help other champs who aren't as popular or "strong" have a chance to be since it would in some ways require some sort of choice to be made

If you are on the other team against someone who happened to get more items you still have at least some chance depending on your team. You can in theory "Outplay" some champs with 2 items but when they have 3 it's nearly impossible to match

incorrect, it reduces the amount of decision making you have by reducing options. We don't want to dumb the game down. 2) It's better to itemize inteligently, and that often doesn't mean putting the items on one champion, this doesn't actually address snowballing at all with best play. And snowballing is good.

It won't actually help other champions, it will limit their ceiling and make them worse.
This is fallacious, everyone has the same prospects until the game unfolds, the only people who will have a problem are sore losers. /thread

stoovebagg7/7/2019, 4:18:34 AM3 votes

I dont believe having 3 items is the problem. What seems to be way too OP is the ability to stack items. If it was change to where you can 3 unique items per champ instead of just 3 items then it would stop certain champs from feeling unstoppable.

Zenai107/7/2019, 3:05:10 PM3 votes

its the worst feeling when you get nothing but defensive items and then you go against tier 3 carry with full attackspeed.

Nixas7/7/2019, 1:26:08 AM2 votes

This makes a lot of sense to make the game competitive, please do this!

Shleelpboy7/7/2019, 2:19:18 AM2 votes

Agreed to this.

JelleKillemAll7/7/2019, 11:57:35 AM2 votes

really good post i like the idea and see only positive things to come out of this if riot implement it

Politur grime7/7/2019, 12:03:44 PM2 votes

Just wanted to post it myself. This is 100% true and demands more decision making and better comp comprehension than just getting that one hypercarry and let him corner carry the whole comp.

Saw enough Tristana's, Draven's and Kassadin's who just needed a frontline which survived long enough. And that's working actually in 90% of the matches.

SrKillaIot7/7/2019, 2:00:02 PM2 votes

I can see where 2 items would make things like kassadin killable and characters like that. I actually think that is extremely healthy for this game I would be behind this. I don't enjoy watching my hard work in a game lose to immune to damage characters because they were able to rng to the right item order to became unkillable. It isn't fun to me when I've been winning all game to lose because of broken character just 1v9ing my team because his 3 items lets that happen. It isn't a skill behind the other player either he just using broken concepts that need to be changed. I've used those team that are broken also and it isn't honestly fun to play the game.

I've won every time I've used one of those comps strategy's also. So it shows that there isn't really much counter play in the game. Imo the game goes like this. Did you get op team comp with op items. Yep win game. Did you not get that op team comp with op items. Lose game.

I've become bored after about 20 games I don't see the point in playing when literally you just run 4 team comps and try to get the most broken items and look for those characters who abuse them. I don't think ill be coming back to this game until they at least introduce more team comps that are viable to run in the game instead of the 4 main ones atm. I want diversity in the game I play. Not the same game being played 20 times in a row. I see no one building anything other then the same 4 team comps. So strategy is literally just build the 1 of the 4 that counters the main winners team. If your not doing that you just lose and it boring to me to be using the same teams almost every game. I rarely have a game where I created a new comp that can actually win vs these main 4.

DiabolicalDude7/6/2019, 9:44:31 PM2 votes

I honestly think the item limit should be one per champ, and rather than a random chance to get an item spawn, it should be guaranteed from certain monsters.

There is enough rng in every other aspect of the game. Too much just makes it less competitive, and more based on luck.

Even with guaranteed item spawns, those items being random is still a bit too much rng for my tastes, but I concede it needs to be random to maintain the "draft" sort of gameplay.

Craftmasters7/6/2019, 11:51:26 PM2 votes

I disagree. If someone is able to get 3 good items on a champ, why stop them? It's likely they're throwing away a few phases drafting items over the actual champs to do so. And if you're having problems with 3 item adcs, try to draft an assassin as your carry. They can fit into a lot of comps comfortably (plus Zed and Akali who get a damage buff if they're the only Ninja), and can jump to the backline carry under a lot of scenarios. Zephyr can help too by taking a champ out of the fight. Even if it's one of their weaker ones, you still benefit. And of course, there's the ol "if you can't beat em join em" approach of making your own adc a hyper carry. I'd honestly say Draven is the only one in a league of his own, and even then, the rest can still compete at 2-3 stars, especially if you just have the better comp.

I do think that they should derandomize the amount of item drops, and just make it so you get the same amount as everyone, assuming everyone kills the same amount of enemies. It always feels bad killing the first three camps and pulling one item just to see someone who pulled three or four.

Pierce The Veal7/8/2019, 6:39:15 AM1 votes

My alternative proposition: guarantee an item drop from every creep (and maybe reduce number of creeps in the first stage, wasting less time), don’t allow duplicate items to be stacked, consider reworking spear of shojin and seraph’s. Everybody having the same amount of items would make it so more champions can be well equipped, making it easier to counter champions with 3 strong items equipped.

Seraph’s and shojin both have problematic designs, the former makes low mana champions spam like crazy (which ends up not being that noticeably bad, because it often isn’t optimal/there’s very few champions with a low enough mana cost that this matters, while also being a bad item on high mana cost units), while the latter makes high mana high power spell champions cast their abilities way more often, beating the entire point of the high mana cost (and being otherwise useless on units with low mana costs, as 15% of 25, 35, and 50 are 3.75, 5.25, and 7.5 zzz).

In addition, it might be worth considering awarding mana for things other than auto attacking/maybe make the mana less/not tied to auto attacks as that means aside from shojin, attack speed items are the best mana items, which is honestly silly; they’re already some of the best damage items, them also being the best mana regen items is crazy, making the recurve bow the most demanded item alongside spatula’s, with tear and bf sword’s demand being mostly for spear of shojin; ga and BT being the only other items from bf sword and tear’s combined upgraded item pools that are good/optimal (excluding darkin/youmuu’s which are good for getting synergies going). Ludens, statikk shiv, redemption, seraph’s, and hush being suboptimal uses of their components in the case of tear items. Sword of the divine, infinity edge, gunblade (maybe not so much after the upcoming buff), and zekes being suboptimal compared to getting BT, GA, or Shojin. Sword of the divine and IE waste two good items on something that is overkill and easily countered. To make optimal usage you need to have a rapidfire cannon, sword of the divine, AND infinity edge, but by then that is often overkill and you could likely have made better use of the components; and you’re shit out of luck if that unit gets focused/bursted; you’ve used 3 bf swords and 3 recurve bows for a unit with no sustain, no mana recovery, no defense, only doing well if you can delete their team before they can touch this unit.

Snider7/10/2019, 12:39:41 PM1 votes

All I can say is thank God none of you are on the balance team

And People Die7/8/2019, 1:43:46 PM1 votes

I would say limit it to 2 normal items and reserve 3rd slot for class/origin items only. I feel like origin items have potential for some interesting combo building but people are hardly ever using them. Perhaps increasing items drops while limiting equipable items slots would shift this. Also, I ain't gonna lie, I abuse double shojin Pyke on every game that I get chance, it is a brain dead strategy that guarantees high place.

YambrinZ7/8/2019, 6:35:14 AM1 votes

I agree. Especially since you can just scrap a 2 star unit with three items and make a new 2 star unit with 3 items....essentially meaning you will literally get freelo if you get 3 items fast enough, because you can infinitely stay above 50 gold and outlevel everyone keeping your team comp inline to match whatever your carry is.

Cavemantero7/8/2019, 12:24:35 AM1 votes

This mode needs to just be deleted. After its novelty wore off and I saw how bad the RNG is rigged (whenever you sell champs it offers you that champ and ignores your stable) I'm done. Nothing is worth getting hosed as much as I have and I've won a game and placed high at times.

Everything about it is setup for you to get the fucking pass. I will never spend money on a 'gamemode' pass.

1800NICECLIENT7/6/2019, 11:04:32 PM1 votes

What if the tier the champ is determines how many items they can use? (This may not completely solve this problem, but would help make 3 item tier 3 units quite rare. Like a tier 3 pyke with 3 items, etc.)