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TFT requires no skill to win, prove me wrong.

Copic·7/6/2019, 7:04:38 PM·33 votes·15,501 views

Cool, you learned how to ECO and know how to position champions. These are pretty common sense things.

But when I keep losing to someone who has 4 tier 3 champions (Yes, I'm aware that they high rolled), and I do the EXACT same thing (which is trying to high roll), it's completely random if I get my shit or not.

It's also completely random if someone gets 4 items in the first 3 minion waves at the start of the game. I'm lucky to even get one item.

More often then not, all of my items are literally selling champions I get from the carousel.

This game mode literally consists on "Hey I got 4 items at the start of the game with 3 tier 2 champions before the next creep round, looks like I won". Sure, this isn't entirely true, but the early game to mid is the part of the game which is hardest to transition from, you either got what you need from luck, or you just straight up lose. I'm lucky to get 2 tier 3 champions by the top 4 of the game, yes I know how to ECON and yes I know how to high-roll, the game is just way too random.

I really don't understand how Riot plans to make this game into a ranked environment when shit like this exists:

You're not guaranteed an item drop from creep waves.
You're not guaranteed getting a champion you need.
Transitioning from early to mid is damn near impossible if you don't get offered what you need without ruining your econ.
Even if you do get items, some of them are completely useless. (some of them aren't listen in the item son here)
If you do happen to get good items, they're not guaranteed to work well with the comp you have.
Etc.

It all boils down to this:

Either you're luckier than everyone else you're playing against, or you're just going to lose. Sure, you can master the craft of ECON and position well, but in the long run, if you don't have the items you need, can't manage to get your T2-T3 champions, nor get the champions you need for your class bonus, you just straight up lose.

That is why I believe that this game mode requires absolutely 0 fucking skill to win. If you can prove me wrong, please I'm all ears. I love being proved wrong.

44 Comments

Ratpie7/6/2019, 7:16:05 PM10 votes

I think if you are wanting to be in 1st place every game, then yes you are right. There is too much RNG to be in first place every time. But ranked is about being in the top 4, not just the top 1. If you reframe the goal of success, then "skill" does come in, but not in a normal way we talk about skill in LoL. It is more about people's ability to be adaptable and make critical decisions, which is a type of skill. With skill I cannot get #1 every time, but I am pretty sure I can get in the top 4 MORE than I get in the bottom 4. There are games where you will get pure crap and godlike teams with RNG. But from playing so far I am finding those are far from every game.

So I am not really saying you are wrong, RNG is real, and there are some areas (item counts) that should be, and from the last patch notes are being addressed to make it better, BUT with getting LP for being in the top 4, you should be able to compile an average of your performance that will make you climb or fall in ranked. If you are below average in making the necessary judgments and risk/benefit decisions, you will be losing LP, you do better than most and you will climb. And if people are smart they will look back at their decisions during the game to figure out where they made errors in judgment and do it better next time. But from what I have seen in people, most people don't put in the effort and will likely linger down in the depths in ranked play.

CHODES AND LOADS7/6/2019, 8:56:21 PM7 votes

knowing how to play the mode well can get you top 4, maybe top 3. after that its pure rng. and bad luck can dump you into the last or second last place regardless of what you do. theres really shit you can do when someone has literally three times your items, or some clown somehow has four t3 champs before the third draft.

Jennifer4207/6/2019, 10:31:33 PM7 votes

gamemode that has random champ "drops" and item drops - well what do you expect with skill? ofc its heavily luck based.

ShadWooo7/7/2019, 1:32:40 AM5 votes

Yeah. I cannot deny your argument. When you get that far, you either get something that allows you beat your opponent or you don't and go home.

I also feel I am winning quite a lot only because there is no meta yet, item synergies with champions aren't commonly known yet and generally players still don't know how to play it to maximize their chances to win. I wonder what happens when this will be commonly known and everyone will do the same shit.

Still, I like it and I burned out from SR as this season is completely crap and I feel the games in SR are much more coinflip than TFT because I play champions that are shit tier. And when you finally get your comp and items rolling in TFT it is so much fun. In SR game is decided in first 10 minutes (in my elo anyway) and you don't get even close to full build ever so you play shitty early game where your champ has no damage over and over and it is not fun.

Teh Song7/7/2019, 12:22:01 AM5 votes

Thing 1: You are entirely right. RNG in this game is ludicrous and needs to be toned down. Personally I argue for the outright removal of all rng from all pvp things, but I digress.

Thing 2: If you are playing a match with any level of "I want to get this" in your mind, you're playing wrong. Because of how rng heavy this game is, you don't get to do that. You build what you get, not try to get what you want to build.

General Esdeath 7/7/2019, 2:55:50 AM2 votes

Takes skill to google item combos and remember to put items on your champs (no seriously I see so many people lose and they have 4 items on their bench like wtf)

Dessim87/7/2019, 1:21:10 AM2 votes

ARAM has high Rng too. Can we unite to solve it there too? I’m all for helping this game in all modes be skill>luck.

j0kulhaups7/7/2019, 5:24:42 PM2 votes

I look at the game like poker. There's a lot of randomness involved, but you can make smart decisions that help you out perform other players.

AlienPrimate7/6/2019, 7:20:01 PM2 votes

It's not all about getting tier 3 champions. I beat someone with 4 tier 3 champions while having 0 myself in my last game. This was because I had higher cost champions, more synergies, and more champions through leveling up and getting a force of nature.

EATARI7/7/2019, 2:32:49 AM1 votes

Deezus is an Oklahoman competitive smash player who is Diamond 1 in LOL. He has a 60% winrate. I’m Bronze 1 and I have a 10% winrate. There’s probably something a little more than just luck that separates us.

EMeta7/7/2019, 2:32:54 AM1 votes

In the few tournaments that have gone on so far for TFT, the same players make the top 2 or 3 every time. If what you were saying were true, that wouldn't happen. It's like poker tournaments. Sure, getting the right cards is completely luck, but the same pro poker players get the the top levels of their tournaments very reliably.

Z3Sleeper7/7/2019, 2:33:47 AM1 votes

Just gotta wait til the changes. Also as the other guy said, 1st place isn't really the goal, the goal is top 4, winning is just extra nice.

2Charmnot2Charm7/7/2019, 11:56:35 AM1 votes

You're not guaranteed an item drop from creep waves.

Already fixed on PBE.

You're not guaranteed getting a champion you need.

The champ pool is shared, if you're going for the same champs someone else already has more of then the chances of you getting that champ is lowered.
You can buy champs from the shop even if you don't need them just to remove them from the pool to increase the chance of getting a champ you want.
The higher the level you are, the less likely you are to get Tier 1 and 2 units, so rerolling for them late game is almost pointless if anyone else has that champ.

Transitioning from early to mid is damn near impossible if you don't get offered what you need without ruining your econ.

That's why you roll with whatever you got, quit trying to force comps.

Even if you do get items, some of them are completely useless.

Cursed blade will stop being useless when it's not bugged. If you want to use sword of divine so bad you'll need Rapid-Fire.

If you do happen to get good items, they're not guaranteed to work well with the comp you have.

I'm just going to assume you mean late game, because early mid you have a lot of chances to build something else instead.

But anyways, how do you know the items you built early-mid are Guaranteed to work vs one of the few remaining player's comp?

Dragon claw makes you near immune to spells, but you're facing Assassins/Rangers.

Phantom dancer makes you ignore crit attacks, but you're facing mages.

Your carry is stacked, oh wait it just got phantomed and died to AOE! Either that or it died to CC lock.

The goal of this game is to hit top 3 with the deck you're dealt, but even then you do not need everything to be a star 3 unit to win, you do not need 6 piece class bonuses to win. But you do need to Econ, position, and think how champs benefits your team (even if they have no synergy).

Verxint7/7/2019, 12:07:05 AM1 votes

They really should have included some release valves for the rng, and some more standardizarion like one component per wave.

Zeromatsu7/6/2019, 8:32:20 PM1 votes

I have a comp which helps me place top 3 almost each match on avg drops. But that's only because Draven is broken and abusing him isn't even fun.

What really sucks are those early stages where you get 1 item (at best) while others get 2 full and a half item. I just started leaving in those matches because there really is no way to win.

Leivve7/7/2019, 11:07:59 PM1 votes

Skill is your ability to manage the RNG. Saying the game requires no skill is like saying Bloodbowl requires no skill.

Leo Umbra7/7/2019, 1:27:23 AM1 votes

Very easy to beat rank3 rush. Solid comps with solid class buffs will always win. It's late game scaling vs early aggro tactics. You only lose because of execution error.

Shleelpboy7/7/2019, 2:20:50 AM1 votes

Riot has done it again. Failing on its community for money.