How Does Kindred Die?

Teridax68·9/18/2015, 1:52:55 PM·2 votes·2,978 views

From the looks of it thus far, Kindred seems to be the embodiment, or at least an aspect, of death itself, and might not even be "real" in the same physical sense as most other champions. In-game, though, Kindred's very much visible, targetable and killable as much as any other champion. Could their lore account for this? What does it mean when death itself dies?

I'm definitely not asking for Kindred to be untargetable and immortal with perma-stealth, obviously, but I feel there's an issue of lore-to-gameplay dissonance that Riot is going to have to address with respect to the in-game functionality of some champions. Along with Kindred, there are already a few other entities that are immortal (e.g. Kalista), that transcend the physical plane (e.g. Bard) or that would otherwise be somewhat above being harmed by normal means (e.g. TahmKench). As we get more of these champions, we might end up with games full of entities that should normally be completely incapable of affecting or even perceiving each other. Will Summoner's Rift ever get its own written lore? How does it fit into the League of Legends canon, if it does at all? The map already tells many stories through its environment that have parallels in the lore (the mage/paladin architectures look like the Magelords and Protectorate from Aatrox's lore, the ancient jungle creatures have some of the same mystical qualities as Bard and Kindred, and Baron Nashor is obviously a clear intrusion from the Void), so it would be a shame to have it excluded from the story of Runeterra and its creatures.

32 Comments

Sharjo9/18/2015, 3:59:05 PM3 votes

I'd imagine that while Kindred can't be permanently obliterated, they can be physically destroyed. They would probably reform in whatever plane of existence they originate from, which could take anywhere from days to years, before making a return. Given the way they talk about "dying" in game, it's likely that they enter a slumber while they recover from near destruction, but for all intents and purposes it's highly likely they can't truly die unless they were destroyed in their plane of origin, whatever or wherever that is. If you're looking for a comparison, look for demons in World of Warcraft. Their immortal souls are bound to the Twisting Nether, so while they can physically die they can always come back after enough time or through being demonically resurrected, with the exception being that if they're killed in the Nether, they die permanently.

There's likely a whole bunch of means that the entities that we consider near immortal like the living dead, demons and celestial beings can be killed off permanently, but the means are likely highly varied and potentially really complicated.

As to the history of Summoner's Rift; I can't say what it is even though I'm confident it's a fairly important historical location in Runterra. I'm not 100% sold on the idea that the two sides represent the Magelords and Protectorate but indeed a possibility. Either way the facts we know:

  • Both sides were well versed in magical summoning, and used a lot of gems and crystals as the foci for their magi.
  • Aatrox made an appearance here at some point.
  • Baron Nashor was summoned to the Rift, more likely by the Red Side due to the destruction shown there. Why is unknown but it was potentially to tip the tide of battle in the favour of one side.
  • The whole place is magically radiated, causing various magical mutations in the wildlife such as two headed wolves and living plants that are on fire.
  • The place is old enough to be decrepit, but not old enough that it's basically a ruin waiting to be unearthed; a lot of the ruins present aren't nearly as overgwon as would be expected if this had been left for thousands of years, but there could be magic at work messing with the natural reclamation of the Rift.
James Stone9/18/2015, 6:24:59 PM2 votes

Wolf: "Have they forgotten us yet, little Lamb?" Lamb: "All still know us, though they try to forget. Soon we will remind them."

I find this quote very interesting, because it suggests whatever Kindred are, they weren't active and around for a while, for so long in fact they were nearly forgotten, or at the very least they haven't been present in Runeterra's cultures for a while. Considering you can't really forget Death, it suggests whatever they are, they are something... different

Fasmodey9/18/2015, 2:26:28 PM2 votes

It's because lore means nothing for gameplay. Would you like to see Xerath, Kalista, Bard, Kindred every time that's because they're god compare to other champions and can't die? Kindred is just a normal champion for the game, can be killed by Teemo or even a minion.

They said thousand times they don't want to shape the game with connected lore for clarity. There will be events but they still don't change gameplay of champion, offensive and defensive stats.

Tesla Effect9/18/2015, 5:08:04 PM2 votes

Its vanquished for a time, never fully destroyed.

SEKAI9/18/2015, 1:56:02 PM2 votes

How Does Kindred Die?

I guess the same way that happened to this guy.

http://i.ytimg.com/vi/KeBdy6ZeLEA/maxresdefault.jpg

Reisuke Naoki9/18/2015, 4:24:52 PM1 votes

Think of it this way. Bard has a Spiritual Form and a Physical form.

Bard can be killed because his Physical form is harmed. Notice the thing he does when he dies? his mask falls and something goes out. That is how he dies. He will reform his Physical presence in time, but his Spiritual form will never be harmed.

This applies to Kindred as well. What we see is a physical form. An Illusion of some sort. when the Illusion is broke, their spirits live on, and because they are special kinds of spirits, they have enough energy to reform their physical entities again.

to support this theory, it was said in Bard's discussion that he can be sealed. Sealed spirits/apparitions are unable to reform. They will ahve restricted power. Where am i going with this? This means They live forever, Physical and Spiritual forms, but their Physical forms can be harmed, thus "death" occurs, unless the death of the physical entity also means the sealing/restricting of the spirit as well.

then again, some lores will throw a wrench at this theory, like Vayne's ability to use silver bolts to "purge" (also meaning to restrict, banish, seal spirits in a sense), Zed/Lux/Diana/Leona/Malzahar/Lissandra/Brand's death animations make them literally immortals as well, because they disintegrate into their respective elements when they die, and still reform.

James Stone9/18/2015, 6:05:31 PM1 votes

Seems like Graham O'Neill's influence is already being felt, which is good, because I really like his writing style, but on the other hand it does create a massive ludonarrative dissonance in it of itself.

If I had to hazard a guess, I'd say Kindred isn't really Death, nor its Angel.

In the old lore, if I'm not mistaken, the First Rune War was between God and Man, where the great Sorcerers of Old defeated the reign Gods had over them. It could be beings like Kindred and Tahm Kench are surviving "Gods" from Eras past, who're slowly regaining their influence and power.

50000000000000009/18/2015, 6:34:47 PM1 votes

Kindred dies whenever a child says "Kindred doesn't exist"

Maximum Morde9/18/2015, 9:58:50 PM1 votes

Probably Silver bolts.

Valaran Nara9/19/2015, 5:14:10 AM1 votes

Remember people, Kindred doesn't truly exist.

Kindred is a folktale.

Kindred is as real as the Grim Reaper.

You don't have 100% clarity on if reapers or THE Grim Reaper exist until you meet them at his/her/their door.

DragonShea9/19/2015, 7:30:28 PM1 votes

How Does Kindred Die?

The same reason that boot's buff Corki's speed.

Rustling Bush9/18/2015, 1:58:10 PM1 votes

Kindred just kinds of fizzs out into smoke before re spawning, so in a sense they really don't have a physical body that can truly be destroyed

Ebonmaw Dragon9/18/2015, 2:26:55 PM1 votes

I think that they say this when they "die":

Wolf: "Is this what it feels like to end?" Lamb: "I do not know, for this is not our end." Wolf: "Do others come back?" Lamb: "Those who do, wish they hadn't."

Centuros9/18/2015, 2:34:17 PM1 votes

Ekko never actually dies in-game, he just pulls the cord and rewinds..

Axests9/18/2015, 2:34:59 PM1 votes

they don't actually die, the idea is that their powers are limited on the fields of justice and...oh wait summoners don't exist anymore so lore like that doesn't exist