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I find the "female representation" discussion quite iritating..

lofi n chillhop·11/11/2015, 7:03:52 AM·38 votes·6,405 views

as mortifying as it is to look around at art and feel grossed out by the sexualized poses and emphases, it isn't any better to hear people cheer that a woman is depicted as "unattractive"

I mean yeah don't want to see women be constantly objectified as sexy, but the contrary to that is definitely not woman being objectified as ugly. that's still the same judgement. that's still saying that what defines a woman is how she looks sexually. Yay she's not sexy? because she's supposed to be sexy? it doesn't work.

and if you ask me, most of the men in league are good-looking. this isn't something all that strange, to come up with art that looks nice. the thing is, that the depiction of men is predominately action-oriented. heroic poses, or poses mid-leap, mid-strike. and very rare is there art of a man who's groin is lunged forward, or who's butt is sticking out too ogle at.

what's "sexualized" about woman in media is not their beauty, but rather the fact that their poses is a butt pose. or a bust pose. and they're so scantily clad they might as well be naked.

I don't care if cleavage is showing, I just don't want to see a plethora of women running around in their underwear.

I don't care if they've got hips and bust I can't compete with, but I just want the lighting to emphasize their face or weapons just like with the men.

I don't care if she's so fit that I feel fat (and I'm pretty skinny) but I just don't want to see a close-up of her boobs or bum like that's what the scene is all about.

it isn't about the woman being sexy or not sexy. it's about the art showing off her "Sex" potential instead of her "fight" potential.

and I really like Illaoi, because goddamn she's intimidating! she's ready for action! she's in control of herself, and her environment. and if you ask me, she's quite gorgeous! and most importantly, these awesome "identities" found in the art are not overshadowed by her "sex" identity.

163 Comments

Krigjer11/11/2015, 5:37:12 PM18 votes

I'm just glad to see more and more diversity in the female champions we've been given as of late.

I hate threads saying 'okay you got your fat woman champ. Now give us a champ with big tits and ass now!'

There are websites dedicated to that, you don't have to get it from a video game.

Xulsigae11/11/2015, 10:42:11 PM8 votes

If I may quote myself from another thread:

It's important to note that showing skin isn't necessarily sexual or attractive (otherwise nude champions like Zac would be way too much) and being covered up isn't necessarily nonsexual (skin tight out fits and such). What makes a champion attractive is a variety of aspects. A common complaint I hear is that people focus too much on females being uncovered or sexualized and not enough on males. This misses the point of uncovered not equating necessarily to sexualized. Just because Tryndamere/Braum/Pantheon/Varus/Ryze has a bare chest doesn't make him sexualized automatically. How a champion poses, what their kit and story is like, what quotes they say and their personality matter in how sexualized they are. Cultural context too, as a shirtless man in Western society isn't seen as sexual as a shirtless woman.

Being attractive or unattractive is similar. I (as a straight male) don't find Jinx attractive because she's crazy and I don't like homicidal people. Her personality and story makes her unattractive to me. Even if she wasn't flat chested, that wouldn't make her more attractive to me, but she would likely be more sexualized depending on how much focus was put on her chest. On the flip side, I don't think a few scars, scales, or a wart or two makes someone automatically unattractive. It's certainly okay for a champion to be attractive, but different body shapes, faces and such should be part of it and flaws not ignored. Being conventionally unattractive is the same.

What's important is how they are presented visually and thematically I think. A champion's looks should reflect their character and profession or background. Far too often someone will claim that asking for a more thematically appropriate costume is 'slut shaming' or 'too politically correct.' This is wrong. I don't mind Ahri being sexual in her appearance because it fits her character and role as a temptress, same as Eve. The first Cassiopeia made sense too (not much anymore due to that stupid curse in the tomb). If every female champion in League was a temptress sort and wore appropriate attire, it would be thematically appropriate. Lacking diversity sure, but appropriate. Even on champions like Sona it makes a bit of sense because she's a more social character and performer and her outfit might go with that aspect. Being attractive as a performer can be important, though obviously not necessary.

Other champions, being sexualized and wearing impractical outfits are not so appropriate. It didn't make sense for Sejuani to be going around in a metal bikini on the tundra (she doesn't have to be uncovered to be a badass). It doesn't make sense for Zyra to be just a lady with a few leaves stuck on her and with her feet in the shape of heels. It doesn't make sense that Leona wears heels either. Nami is based on a mermaid, but rather than just being a half human half fish, she's pretty fishy all around...but still has her skin split to have rather human cleavage. Caitlin is a highly competent and practical cop...with a miniskirt. They can be attractive sure, but at some point their appearance loses touch with their character and themes. If Caitlin likes to wear a miniskirt off the battlefield or when not on a case, that's just fine. If Leona likes heels, that's fine too, but not in a battle situation. Context for attire is vital. Impractical outfits in skins are fine as those aren't canonical and are just for fun (mostly, as sometimes they can get a bit too much). Splash arts are a common offender in that regard too. Spine breaking poses and other sexualized aspects can push a champion away from what they are as a character and into just an action figure or fan service. See Sivir and such. Champions like Vi I don't really see as sexualized (though her behind in her splash art is a bit exaggerated), but I do find her attractive. She's tough and scarred and that's okay. Same with Katarina (though her splash arts are a bit wonky at times and there was that debacle with her candy cane stripper pole). I like Kalista's look and think it fits her thematically, but I don't find her attractive physically. Leona and Diana are certainly attractive and I'd say even beautiful, but for the most part are practical and in appropriate attire (though Leona's heels...grr...).

Dreamspitter11/11/2015, 7:39:57 AM5 votes

[{quoted}](name=jinxie pooksie,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=fvKzPGsO,comment-id=,timestamp=2015-11-11T07:03:52.076+0000)

as mortifying as it is to look around at art and feel grossed out by the sexualized poses and emphases, it isn't any better to hear people cheer that a woman is depicted as "unattractive"

I mean yeah don't want to see women be constantly objectified as sexy, but the contrary to that is definitely not woman being objectified as ugly. that's still the same judgement. that's still saying that what defines a woman is how she looks sexually. Yay she's not sexy? because she's supposed to be sexy? it doesn't work.

and if you ask me, most of the men in league are good-looking. this isn't something all that strange, to come up with art that looks nice. the thing is, that the depiction of men is predominately action-oriented. heroic poses, or poses mid-leap, mid-strike. and very rare is there art of a man who's groin is lunged forward, or who's butt is sticking out too ogle at.

what's "sexualized" about woman in media is not their beauty, but rather the fact that their poses is a butt pose. or a bust pose. and they're so scantily clad they might as well be naked.

I don't care if cleavage is showing, I just don't want to see a plethora of women running around in their underwear.

I don't care if they've got hips and bust I can't compete with, but I just want the lighting to emphasize their face or weapons just like with the men.

I don't care if she's so fit that I feel fat (and I'm pretty skinny) but I just don't want to see a close-up of her boobs or bum like that's what the scene is all about.

it isn't about the woman being sexy or not sexy. it's about the art showing off her "Sex" potential instead of her "fight" potential.

and I really like Illaoi, because goddamn she's intimidating! she's ready for action! she's in control of herself, and her environment. and if you ask me, she's quite gorgeous! and most importantly, these awesome "identities" found in the art are not overshadowed by her "sex" identity.

To be honest.

This game needs more sexy men, so they can compete with all the women that are already out there.

I want to play a bishounen.

Fiveofswords11/11/2015, 9:21:19 AM2 votes

so i totally understand where you are coming from and respect it. And I hear women have an issue with sexiness depictions quite a lot so i know this is a real issue. And that bothers me.

in my honest opinion, you are totally misunderstanding this.

First of all, men arent stupid. Its not a struggle for men to understand how a woman might be both sexy and awesome. Its not like men only see women as one or the other. That isnt how reality works. Its totally possible for men to respect women for non sexual things, and possible for men to be seduced by their sexiness...at the same time or even seperately. Maybe its not liek this for women i dont really know. Butthe vast majority of men know a sexy body is jsut a sexy body and implies nothing else at all...psotiive or negative about that person in any other way.

However, unfortunately perhaps, sexiness has a great deal of power over men. I guess they are very visual and just the suggestion of a sexy image will sell the hell out of anytihng to a man. Whether its video game spash art or a car or whatever other stupid thing. If this bothers you, imagine how obnoxious it is for men. YOu have no idea how many stupid things men are inspired to do over a stupid shape. The culture pretends liek women are strongly influenced by their emotions...well the fact is that if there were no sexy women in the world, most men wouldnt see any reason to have a job or even wake up in the morning. Not even joking.

But the good news is that you are not competing with this fantasy. The fantasy is in fact somehow more appealing to a man because it is just that: fantasy. A guy doesnt actualyl want to enter some codependant unhealthy relationship with miss fortune...ok? She isnt real. Real things dont happen with her. Its a totally different phenomenon of having real relationships with real women.

And by the way, i think female attraction can be jsut as shallow as male attraction. But what turns women on seems to be not so much visual but rather the agency/power/property of a man.Sorry but humans are jsut not so far removed from monkeys and thats how gender roles have been for mammals for the past i dunno billion years or so. Believe it or not theres actually nothign deep about finding power to be sexy. Adolf Hitler should not be sexy. But apparently he was to many women. Anyway thats why the male splash art looks the way it does.

GenoXx11/11/2015, 7:25:04 AM1 votes

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Stekeltje11/11/2015, 7:55:08 AM1 votes

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