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Lore Update Opinions: Vel'Koz and Lissandra

HonestJohnTheCon·8/20/2018, 5:55:16 PM·40 votes·21,296 views

My opinion on the new lore. Take it with a grain of salt if you disagree, although I'd be interested to hear why you disagree if you write a reply.

#Velkoz Vel'Koz, the Tentacled Terror New Vel'Koz lore was absolutely fantastic. His new lore keeps the main tones of his old lore while throwing in more information about the Void, and more specifically, his role in the Void. He also retains his position as being one of the most intelligent Voidborn, as he has been around for longer and his sole purpose is to gather information and bring it to the Watchers. His short story paints him exactly as he should be: intelligent, dangerous, and with an insatiable drive for knowledge. He's kind of like GLaDOS if she ever got out of the lab. Which is great. Quality of New Lore: 10/10 Faithfulness to Old Lore: 10/10 Spooky Tentacles: 10/10

#Lissandra Lissandra, Retcons Within Retcons Hmm. I'm not gonna lie, her bio was kind of hard to read for me. I didn't really understand her goals or personality other than "stop the Void's approach", which was a complete 180 from her old lore (now that the Void are the Watchers, anyway). I don't understand WHY she had to sacrifice her sisters and other Iceborn in order to stop the Void's advance specifically, nor do I understand HOW she pulls off staying hidden in the new lore. Also, she has completely different goals now. I can understand if they set it up as a Morde & LeBlanc situation, where she served for a while planning to rule the world, but when realizing the Void planned to destroy it, betrayed them while keeping her original motivation. But we don't really know where she's going with this. I think that the bio should be rewritten just for clarity's sake, to be honest. No offense to the writer, but it seems like you tried to fit too much information into the word limit of a bio. Quality of New Lore: 4/10 Faithfulness to Old Lore: 1/10 Plans Within Plans: 5.8/10 not enough plans

#The "Short" (Read: 30 minute) Story It was pretty good. It gives us information about Frostguard's beliefs and customs, while also presenting the Void as a threat. It shows exactly how the Void drives people insane, as well as how it corrupts people and how Voidborn are created (there may be other methods, but here's one); that's information we've been missing for a while. It was well-written and the writer did a good job on it. It was kinda lacking at some parts, but overall I think it did a good enough job. However, it also raises some questions that were previously decided by the old lore. Dark Ice is now regarded as sacred? Where did that come from? Iceborn are still around, thousands of years after the Battle at the Abyss? How, exactly? Are Ashe and Sejuani Iceborn? That actually was actually hinted at in Lissandra's bio, but it's still confusing. Quality of Short Story: 9/10 New Lore in Short Story: 8/10 Clarity of New Lore: 6/10

What do you guys think of the new Freljord lore? Was it good? Bad? Does Lissandra need more plans? Why?

I personally thought it was pretty good, but Lissandra's new lore needs more clarity for sure.

79 Comments

RyzeTheSmurfMage8/20/2018, 6:01:59 PM20 votes

So that's what that Voidborn tried to do to Ryze. Corrupt him. Well he should been gifted with 2 eyes because he messed with the wrong person. Now about lore, I agree with everything you said. I wish Riot would now release an ACTUAL story for Lissandra where she's the main character and her powers are actually shown.

Shinjrou8/20/2018, 6:43:29 PM10 votes

IMO, Lissandra lore update feels like a downgrade, she had so much lore with all her monologues. The Winning HA monologue was removed; many things were retconned; her currents quotes don't really reflect her new lore. But I think it has potential to be something great, let's wait and see what happens. item 3110 Lissandra

The Iceborn8/20/2018, 6:05:37 PM7 votes

Exactly, they tried to fit everything into one lore thus confusing everyone...

Camille Ferrøs8/20/2018, 6:01:21 PM6 votes

I agree with your opinions. Funny how many had comments about the darkin reton and Riot slapped us even harder with this bs. How do you even explain the Iceborn ¿

Nylisa8/20/2018, 6:16:04 PM5 votes

I just wonder what this means For Sejuani and Ashe and their struggles against each other and Lissandra, i fear what might happen to their lore now...completely changed to something new?

i'm not a person who usually complains about big changes on champions but i've grown accustomed to old Sej/Ashe/Lissandra lore. changes like,this all of a sudden, is really frustrating for me to deal with. i was looking for an expansion on their lore not a re-work.

AbiwonKenabi8/20/2018, 6:20:36 PM5 votes

Vel'Koz's lore was great. I wish it focused a little more on him--he isn't mention until the last few paragraphs.

I agree the Lissandra bio is really confusing. I'm glad you said something, because I thought there was something wrong with my reading comprehension. Not only does it paint Lissandra as completely opposite in her support of the Watchers, but it makes her less of a villain (one of her trademark qualities) AND none of her actions since the War make sense anymore. WHY would she start erasing/manipulating history?

And before a Rioter comes around and clarifies that she manipulated history so hard even us, the audience, can't see the truth, I'm calling bs, because we've been given no indication that this is possible. Its not like the short story showed someone uncovering part of the truth and being eliminated by Lissandra or something, assuring us she's more similar to her old self than we thought. It was one way, and now its the opposite, so it reads as a retcon, NOT a deliberate "hiding info for the sake of the story" situation.

With the Iceborn thing, it was always implied that there were still descendants of Iceborn that had some of their qualities still, but being descendants never knew the full story on what happened (this is why is hurts when they use True Ice weapons, they aren't full Iceborn, but they are still able to wield them without freezing to death). Seems like Lissandra is rounding up the ones she can find as children. Ashe and Sejuani are heavily implied to be descendant from Avarosa and Serylda respectively. This was another cool aspect of Lissandra's old lore, as it was building up to be another Civil War reflecting the one she had with her sisters.

Regaly8/20/2018, 11:22:28 PM4 votes

Lissandra's lore was underwhelming. She's my favorite champ because she is evil in nature not because of a fundamental cause. Ugh.

LordHippoman8/20/2018, 6:46:24 PM4 votes

I think that quite honestly nearly all of it is fantastic. We knew basically nothing about Serylda or Avarosa for years aside from "ashe and sejuani but not really", and this gives them viewpoints and characterization. Vel'koz's story reaches more into what the Void is, which is always an interesting topic. The worldbuilding and fleshing out of the setting is good.

Honestly, though, and I'm sure this is why a lot of us are confused, I disagree with the decision to make Lissandra some sort of tragic anti-villain. First off, don't get me wrong, she's still a villain. I think people are overstating this by calling her a "hero" now. It's Lissandra's fault that the Watchers are even here, she's still murdering countless people to keep her secret. It's just that she's now deeply regretting her decision and terrified of the Watchers, instead of being in an alliance with them.

I think this might be an attempt to make the character more "morally grey", and I can see why Riot would do that. Fans LOVE to take characters who are intended to be villainous and give them reasons to be heroes of their own stories. I think we can really see that with Viktor. I don't think it's a stretch to say Viktor's original incarnation was pretty clearly supposed to be unambiguously a bad guy, but fans really resonated with the character and he's been changed into a tragic hero. But, every time Viktor gets new Lore, fans tend to worry and we get a lot of threads reminding Riot that Viktor should not be portrayed as villainous. Syndra is another good example, I've seen a lot of people talking about how they wish the new Syndra lore didn't make her such a "villain". Although literally the only thing we had ever seen Syndra do in an interaction in the old Lore was straight up murder a man.

I think one possible interpretation of the Lissandra changes is that it's a bit of a response to this. Riot can see that Lore fans enjoy characters who are ambiguously "good" or "bad", and want to make champions appealing. That said, I think it's a mistake with Lissandra because her character thrived in villainy. Lissandra was, pretty unexceptionably, the "final boss" of the Freljord arc. "Plans within Plans" and all that. What made her fun was her deception and cruelty, spending centuries spreading her twisted influence. Adding "but she doesn't REALLY want to" to that doesn't feel like it enhances her character in a meaningful way.

EvilUnicornLord8/20/2018, 9:27:29 PM4 votes

Not dark ice, they believe true ice is holy.

The stuff that fell from space ages ago that Ornn used to make weapons.

Revailo8/20/2018, 10:33:31 PM4 votes

I straight up disliked Lissandra's new Lore. There was no reason to make the Watchers into Voidborn. It ruins Both by eliminating their identity. Lissandra also suffers from identity change - the three sisters are no longer in focus, instead its now all about the impending doom of the world with a more or less generic anti-hero sentiment. A unique role was replaced with a generic one - nothing is gained, but a little is lost. The whole Universe direction seems to turn into an anime, where everyone HAS to be related somehow.

tamaya8/21/2018, 1:06:30 AM4 votes

I am glad that the canvas of a narrative became dense. But,In this new story Lissandra feels like a innocent resistance/the tragedy's heroine. I liked wickedness of Lissandra. I think that is really unfortunate.

EdgeLady8/21/2018, 3:01:18 AM3 votes

It's possible that they could edit it. Look at what happened to Nautilus. At first, his mini-bio had him being some sort of immortal mysterious spirit that sank ships for whatever reason. When fans complained, they scrapped that and expanded on his old lore, even though it's rather similar to Pyke's. Even still, similar or not, it's a lot more interesting than what we could have gotten with that first mini-bio.

I wonder if Lissandra is a similar case, and they don't want to make her another Elise (mysterious somewhat-godly woman who heralds the apocalypse with the god-like figure or figures she revers). However, I would agree with everyone who concurs that the two are nothing alike, besides their superficial similarities. The reactions don't seem to be very positive right now; I agree it's a poor attempt to make her morality more gray.

As for what I would suggest, I think that perhaps she should be attempting to use the desires and plans of the Watchers for her own benefits, instead of being an extreme but good-intentioned chessplayer like Camille. That would at least keep some of her well-loved and wonderful villainy.

Don Lupus8/21/2018, 8:36:21 AM2 votes

I really dislike the way they changed Lissandra. She feels less interesting and intriguing now. Another change-for-the-sake-of-it where the lore update ends up messy and unsatisfying (a la Syndra and Karma)

IllusionLord3338/21/2018, 1:09:27 AM2 votes

As a Vel’koz main and a Void enthusiast, a new glimpse of how the Void works was very interesting! The new story was a good read as well, at times it gave me chills! The Void is truly very advanced, and extremely powerful...

If there is a Void invasion on a large scale...

Please End Mee8/21/2018, 2:17:03 AM2 votes

I thought I was having cognitive problems when I read Lissandra's new lore, genuinely didn't understand any of it. Is she for or against the Void now? And why did she rewrite history now that so much has been changed? Is she still even a villain trying to bring back the Watchers or not?

TheHobbits8/21/2018, 2:17:29 AM2 votes

"Plans Within Plans: 5.8/10 not enough plans"

I lol'ed a little at that.

TheUnnamedSound8/20/2018, 11:36:39 PM2 votes

The Dark Ice is regarded as sacred because the story is from the perspective of Lissandra's followers. I believe everyone else thinks that Lissandra is evil for leaving her sisters behind or something. Like you said, her new bio is very hard to understand since it appears to be a retcon. At least that's what I interrupted from one read through.

Healing Hoe8/21/2018, 5:33:02 AM2 votes

I agree about the lissandra lore. I have recently starting reading lores, and lissandras new bio is not interesting. It is very confusing, and doesn't give flat information to explain how she became who she is. I wish there was more too it or it was switched up a bit, as it doesn't explain well about her sisters and what she had to give up to stop the void. What I get out of reading her new bio is that lissandra froze the watchers and her sisters to stop the void and failed? I'm honestly not sure I understand the lore at all whatsoever, but that's what i got out of it. Lissandra

Rito Janitor8/20/2018, 10:47:01 PM1 votes

Soooo is vel'koz a watcher?

Nylisa8/21/2018, 3:01:19 AM1 votes

Something else just occurred to me. what does this new story mean for Ashe's bow?!