Hey folks,
Check em out! Trying out a stickied thread so there's an easy central place for discussion that the Narrative and Foundations folks can hopefully also jump into. What's your take on the new story goodness?
Renekton Bot25 votesWhy did you let Nasus write these?
Renekton Bot30 votesLook how often he uses the term "lean" to describe himself. That ritual wasn't the first time I had to carry you up a flight of stairs.
Renekton Bot27 votesFatty.
StoneColdSteve2 votesI agree. Renekton Bot should have had the job. His 100% factual and accurate stories about his real life as a crocodilian demigod are far more entertaining.
Pyro20 votesRemember when we used to whine about lack of content, and "Riot lore team" was a joke?
Glad to say it's all in the past now :)
The only complaint I could have here is that while these bios portray the Shurimian characters in great detail, we're still lacking one element the Institute of War provided: canvas for interaction between characters from different locations.
Keep up the good work!
DeathBurst7 votesThe only complaint I could have here is that while these bios portray the Shurimian characters in great detail, we're still lacking one element the Institute of War provided: canvas for interaction between characters from different locations.
It's kinda ironic you would say that, because if I remember correctly, the IoW was scrapped because said canvas was too restricting and was forcing interactions between champions.
Personally, I find it a bit sad that the game itself is not justified in the lore, that was a huge originality of this game's lore, but I have to admit that champs like Rek'Sai or Kindred would have been hard to do in the old lore.
Decrit8 votesWell honestly, having two characters that hate themselves share the same waiting line for the bathroom and being forced on doing nothing, for example, is not that entertaining...
Photos of Ghosts16 votesOr the wifesteal botlane.
...
...
... :>
NO.
DeathBurst6 votesWell, it's not exactly how the old lore was supposed to work either, but yeah, it definitely had more constraints than the new version.
(For the records, champs were supposed to be summoned directly on the Rift by the "Summoners" (the players) and most of them were not residing in the IoW, and were free to pursue their own purpose during their "free time". Most champions that hated each others either had no face-to-face time outside of the Rift or were refraining from acting publicly due to political implications, etc., and had to scheme in the background.)
Kenocka15 votesHey folks,
Check em out! Trying out a stickied thread so there's an easy central place for discussion that the Narrative and Foundations folks can hopefully also jump into. What's your take on the new story goodness?
Crossposting from a friend's blog.
I’d like to register my disappointment that Azir supposedly had children with slaves.
Slaves cannot consent. What Azir did was rape those slaves. If he actually believes that people should not be slaves, then neither should he be raping them.
Calling it ‘liaisons’ makes it sound less terrible than it is. It wasn’t a case of liaisons. It was the case of a man who knew slaves were people and deserves names, somehow thinking that it was acceptable to force himself on them anyway.
If this was a character like Jhin or Jinx or even Zed, where they are clearly the villain, I wouldn’t care so much. I’d still be disappointed that you had to explicitly make a character a rapist but I’d at least accept it’s part of narrative that makes them a villain. Azir, on the other hand, is presented as a hero. The readers are supposed to feel sorry for him and believe he had good intentions.
Good guys aren’t rapists. Promoting the idea that you can be a good guy and still be a rapist is dangerous, especially when the community is already known for making rape and death threats towards female gamers.
I would like to request you remove the part about Azir having 'ill-advised liaisons’ with slaves. It would take hardly any effort at all to remove two words and change to just make it only be harem girls and wives but it would change Azir’s lore so very much. He would still be flawed, just not a rapist.
I don’t want to cheer for a rapist. I don’t want to be told that a rapist is a good guy, just misguided. Please change it.
Warlord Dienekes4 votesSweet! Time to talk about the complicated history of sexuality, slavery, morality, and all that awesome stuff. From a historical standpoint! Woo!
Alright, so the first thing that I see wrong with your post is the opening argument itself. "Slaves cannot give consent." Well, no. That's actually provably not true. Slaves, despite their living conditions are still people with desires, needs, emotions, and all that good stuff. Honestly, that opening argument itself just confuses me since I think we can all agree that the reason why slavery is bad is because it takes away the personal freedoms of an individual in various ways, and yet here you go taking away even more. Of course a slave can give consent, if they want to.
There are actually many examples in history of true romance between master and slave. The most dramatic (in my mind anyway, I'm sure people will of course disagree) was Suleiman the Magnificent and his slave turned empress Roxelana. By every account we have of them they seem to be nauseatingly in love. Dude wrote crappy love poems to her, had this whole succession crisis because he wanted one of her sons to succeed him. It was a big thing.
Anyway, so, first point, no. Doing the nasty with a slave does not automatically imply rape. Saying that it does with 100% certainty just takes away what little freedom a slave actually had.
Not to say that slaves weren't raped. They totally were. Happened all the time.
Next point. Reading the passage itself "Ill-advised liaisons" well, ill-advised by who? Certainly not Azir, since he's getting his groove on. There is really only two options: by Xerath or by the Shuriman people. Now personally, I'd vote for the Shuriman people, but it's ambiguous. Now, what would make a liaison ill-advised? If he's just raping slaves, well, people would have been doing that for years anyway, that doesn't make sense to me. It could be because he was actually something of a don juan to them. A great woo-er of women, which personally I think makes much more sense to his character. He sees slaves as people, like Xerath his closest friend. But he is still a charismatic intelligent emperor, and throughout history those kind of people seem to get others willing to bone down. But that's really up to your interpretation, if you want to imagine him being a rapist go for it. It's certainly possible.
And final point. If Azir is totally a rapist, if he used and abused his slaves. Then I will finally congratulate Riot on creating a truly realistic morally complex society and the effect it can have on an individual. Really, all their other efforts to do that have been pretty much crap. Here we can see an actual realistic representation of an ancient emperor and what that actually means. A real historical figure and how good and bad they can be. How the culture changed them into something so warped and foreign to our modern sensibilities. That's what a historical figure looks like. That's what our past was. No great empire existed without slaves before the industrial revolution. The cultures that had slaves and harems tended to have a lot of cross-breeding that was not pretty to our modern sensibilities. That is history and I applaud Riot for having the guts to do that.
Solideus12 votesI really loved the stories!
My favorite element is Nasus being accompanied by the ghostly memory of his brother as a child. Very powerful! The juxtaposition between the demi-god Nasus has become and the child his brother once was is very striking and appropriate.
I also loved how well Renekton was portrayed as a maddened, confused, crying beast. It really added depth to him and solidified his character.
A tasteful amount of world-building sprinkled in, kuddos! Also great hints at thematic connections to the in-game characters. (Namely Nasus' Wither.)
I'm also noticing leadership, autonomy, servitude and slavery are really prevalent themes in Shuriman stories. For example, I can't help to notice how the Ascended are powerful and esteemed, but in a way they are also slaves, sacrificing their humanity bit by bit and serving Shurima for millennia, while perhaps not even noticing it themselves.
Xerath's and Azir's stories showing that both being the most powerful or being the most oppressed can casually create terrible people or people that do terrible things is also mirrored somewhat in Nasus' and Renekton's stories. Even the great and benevolent mind of Nasus is used by the culture of Shurima for conquest and warfare, while Nasus doesn't even necessarily see any inherent problem, "big picture", with this being his new role.
All in all, a wonderful read!
Sahn Uzal4 votesMy favorite element is Nasus being accompanied by the ghostly memory of his brother as a child. Very powerful! The juxtaposition between the demi-god Nasus has become and the child his brother once was is very striking and appropriate.
Ooooh, I didn't get that part, thanks for clarifying :l
Ebonmaw Dragon9 votes"Emperor Xerath"
Great, more Civil Wars incoming.
Excalibait9 votesIt was just so overwhelmingly beautiful, yet tragic, I actually shed a couple of tears while reading them.
Nasus' hesitation when entombing his brother, the shadow that followed him, the guilt inside of him. Renekton is no longer a brutal beast with no sense at all, but rather suffering and ill-advised, chasing Nasus, who he once selflessly saved from death.
It might sound weird, but I see a lot of similarities between these two and me and my brother. I was the older one, who always watched out for him. I was the one who loved to study, he loved to get his hands dirty. Even when my brother passed away 5 years ago, I felt guilty as I couldn't be there for him when he needed me the most.. It's like reading a fanfictioned version of my life.
Placentas7 votesI think Nasus has been elevated into my list of favorite champions. I enjoyed his old lore for what it was, Super Intelligent Space-Dog From Mars Who Knows Things About Death, but his new lore is fantastic.
I especially love how one of the few times Ren & Nas almost get into a physical fight is over books! I love Nasus' dedication to books and libraries, it's fantastic! I dunno, I think I actually want to start playing Nasus now.
Renekton's story is also 100% better than him running around sewers.
Photos of Ghosts6 votesA question: Xerath's lore says that the Ascended could read people's mind and slaves weren't even allowed to think about freedom.
So Nasus was enforcing slavery? So Taliyah is being friendly to Nasus and agressive to Azir when Azir was the one who went out of his way to abolish slavery while Nasus was a slave officer?
SaltyKracka5 votesLoved these stories, but man does Nasus' lore kind of fellate him.
Anyways, Broken Nomad Nasus skin when?
LoZfan035 votesI'm dying for a timeline with all this "a long time ago" lore! Especially now that Amumu has joined the hella hella old crowd along with Aurelion, Mordekaiser and the mythic types. We've got so many things in the nebulous far past now, it would mean a lot to me to know how they relate - Aurelion's enslavement, Mordekaiser's original reign, the founding of Demacia (and other countries, but this one we specifically heard about with Poppy), the cursing of the Blessed Isles, the original Freljord sisters, Amumu's life, Gnar's original time, the Rune Wars if those are still a thing, Nasus and Renekton's ascension, Azir's ascension/Shurima's fall, ahhhhhhhhhhhh. Maybe Zilean could tell us when he gets his lore updated, ay? Hint hint nudge nudge.
While I'm here, can we solve the ambiguously Yordle Amumu business? I would much rather he not be a Yordle and know it vs making it a mystery with no stakes just to pay homage to his old lore. It's fine if people in-universe don't know. It's less fine for us not to.
WhiskerWow5 votesI'm so glad that they kept the librarian part of Nasus intact! <3
I thought that it would be discarded as it supposedly wouldn't make sense on a guard of an emperor.
Kekyoin3474 votesI like these new stories, but there are a couple of questions that I have, specifically in regards to Nasus:
While I'm sure Nasus knows about his brother escaping the tomb, does he wish to confront him, and if so, free him? His in-game taunts to Renekton hint a general anger at him and disassociates him as his brother, yet his bio showed some potential signs of hope for releasing him from madness. So is he looking for Renekton, and if so, why?
What exactly did Nasus do after the fall of Shurima? We know Renekton spent his wonderful time listening to the corrupted words of Xerath, but how about Nasus? He wandered, sure, but did he like, go and collect knowledge or help people out or something? Or did he literally just walk back and forth in the desert for several centuries? It felt a little like we were cut off there, and we sort of just jumped from "failed Ascension" to "Shurima's rise from the grave" (other than that, it was awesome, keep up the good work).
Baron of Bread3 votesIt sounded to me like Nasus just wandered and wallowed in sadness the whole time.
RiotDinopawz5 votesI like these new story, but there are a couple of questions that I have, specifically in regards to Nasus:
While I'm sure Nasus knows about his brother escaping the tomb, does he wish to confront him, and if so, free him? His in-game taunts to Renekton hint a general anger at him and disassociates him as his brother, yet his bio showed some potential signs of hope for releasing him from madness. So is he looking for Renekton, and if so, why?
What exactly did Nasus do after the fall of Shurima? We know Renekton spent his wonderful time listening to the corrupted words of Xerath, but how about Nasus? He wandered, sure, but did he like, go and collect knowledge or help people out or something? Or did he literally just walk back and forth in the desert for several centuries? It felt a little like we were cut off there, and we sort of just jumped from "failed Ascension" to "Shurima's rise from the grave" (othr than that, it was awesome, keep up the good work).
To quote the great Iron Maiden, "Questions are a burden, And answers are a prison for oneself"...
1 - Yeah, Nasus has felt the Tomb of Emperors break open and knows his brother is free. He knows he must face his brother sometime, but he has mixed feelings about that. Part of him welcomes it as a means to purge his guilt, but he doesn't yet know what the outcome will be. Will he be able to fight his brother if he comes at him with fang and claw? Should he? Could he bring himself to kill his brother if that's what it came to? Is there anything left of Renekton to try and bring back? A confrontation between them seems to be inevitable, but his emotions on that score are mixed to say the least...
2 - Renekton didn't corner the market when it came to insanity. Centuries alone in the desert, bearing a terrible burden of guilt won't do much for your sanity, and while Nasus didn't go as batshit kill-crazy as Renekton, he's still haunted by what he was forced to do and what his actions (albeit for good reasons) have done to his beloved wee brother... He's been keeping out of the way of people as much as possible, trying to let Shurima forget about him and the past, but now the past has caught up with him and he knows he won't be allowed to sit this one out.
Cheers, and keep coming back for more bios and stories!
redniwediS4 votesI like these two a lot more than the ones for Azir and Xerath. I feel those two covered too much of the same information, where as the lore for Nasus and Renekton were different enough to make reading them back to back enjoyable.
Nickfer25104 votesI want to imagine 
and 
started talking like this once inside the Tomb of the Emperors:
**
"After a loooooooooooong time has passed, Renekton and Xerath have not stopped fighting (u know, being Ascended and stuff)"**
Hey, I'm starting to get bored of this fight.
To be honest, even though I'm still angry as hell for what you did, I'm getting bored too.
We both know that we will not be able to kill each other anytime soon. So, what about taking a break for now? We'll resume fighting later.
Sounds good.
"They are now seated on the floor with some distance away from each other"
_So, why are you here and not Nasus?
_
_I sacrificed myself to saved him.
_
_To me, it looks like he planned to lock you up.
_
_Get out of here.
_
_He knew you'll saved him like that time when you both Ascended.
_
_I'll eat your head if you keep talking.
_
Ok, let me explain to you my reasoning on why Nasus tricked you, and you don't agree with me, I'll let you eat the part of my sarcophagus that resembles my head. Deal?
I'll find a way to kill you regardless, so it's a deal.
"And the brainwashing begins..."
Fasmodey4 votesAnd for this sin, Xerath had been punished with a horrible, maddening promise: Freedom. Unobtainable. Forbidden. Should the thought even dart through a slave’s mind, it would be punished by death, as the Ascended could gaze past flesh and bone, deep into one’s very soul, to see its dim traitorous glow. And yet, there it was, spoken by the young princeling he dragged from the embrace of the mercurial mother-desert. Azir, the Golden Sun, vowed that he would free his savior and new friend.
How couldn't Nasus and Renekton understand the real purpose of Xerath then?
Veraska3 votesI lost it when I heard that guy say "emperor xerath" like OH SHIT
Decrit3 votesDamn, so far renekton managed to be one of the best character development of the whole LoL lore! :O
From a dude that throwed himself to the turrets to a noble man chained and cracked to insanity... good job!
Kuiper Cliff3 votesI just want to say that I love how Nasus is dying from a "withering" disease when he undergoes the ritual, basically directly giving his wither ability a point of origin I just really like that kind of awesome nerdy detail. :D!
ThatHaleState3 votes@ADillionMostDirty Love them both. But I feel that Nasus' is missing one thing. It never mentions D CANE or how he even began using that weapon? Renektons weapon was slipped in their, and it stated that he took it from a general he killed and liked it so much hat he remade it. But nothing about the cane? Cmon guys
JacobusSimon3 votesThere isn't anything about these short stories that I don't like. Of particular note are the slightly disjointed narrative style of Renekton's story, Nasus' own struggles with sanity, and hints of a new Brand backstory to come. The thought and effort going into these is evident, and I think everybody reading appreciates it.
I'm just hoping for two things:
LastManOnEarth3 votesNasus - "Renek bro, you'll kill yourself out on those streets! I can do you one better, go join the military, you can't brush up with death there now can you." Renek - "wait wha?"
RiotAnt in Oz2 votesHey LastManOnEarth,
Nasus probably figured that what his little brother needed was discipline and structure - something he could get in the military. A place where his aggression and fearlessness could be channeled for a purpose. Big brother looking out for his bro.
Fasmodey2 votesWait. Xerath's story says Renekton and Nasus were there when Xerath just finished his ascension. They imprisoned him without any reaction and fought with Bound Xerath. But When I read the story of Renekton, it says when the shockwave shows up they were 1 day away from the Capital. Does it mean Xerath's Ascension was for 1 day? Dıd Xerath just dry up the Sun Disc's power?
Sahn Uzal3 votesI think it's a day.... if you are a human. Nasus and Renekton are ascended and are faster than any human would ever be. They arrived there much earlier.
Jabalor2 votesI looooooooooved Renekton's lore so much!! Being he my main sisnce his released I could not be more happy with how his story is developing! Here are some questions:
RiotDinopawz5 votesI looooooooooved Renekton's lore so much!! Being he my main sisnce his released I could not be more happy with how his story is developing! Here are some questions:
- I thought Ascendants were inmortal beings? Has this been changed? Is Even Xerath bound to die too?
- Do Ascendants find power through purpose? Like Renekton being in the brink of death was because he had failed procting Shurima, but now that his objective is killing Nasus he has been renewed?
- Ascendants can get sick?
Cool, thanks man, Ant in Oz will be stoked to hear you loved Renekton's story.
1 - Ascended beings are not immortal - they CAN die - but it might take a whole lot to actually kill one. 2 - They gain power from the ritual, but where it continues to come from is a mystery, even to them... 3 - Nasus got very sick before he Ascended, and it was the ritual that saved his life and turned him into an Ascended being.
Zackeryss11 votes2 - They gain power from the ritual, but where it continues to come from is a mystery, even to them...
Cmon man we all know where that power comes from
http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/707/862/7ed.gif
https://31.media.tumblr.com/f57c9e8abcc06c823679c0e0af6030a2/tumblr_mzh0hqMANs1qfaa86o1_400.gif
Dantone2 votesI feel like Nasus's kit doesn't really fit his lore very much anymore. I guess he's been around awhile and his kit thematically has to do with life and death, but there's not much of a connection apart from that. I don't really feel like a scholar or general when I play him. I guess I do feel disconnected from civilization because I'm farming stacks, but that's about it.
Anyway, is there going to be any reconciliation of this? Obviously his Q and R are iconic, but I think the rest could have more to do with his lore.
EROTIC RAID BOSS8 votesSeemed smartly tailored to nasus' playstyle to me. When you play nasus you don't concern yourself with dominating your lane opponent. You play the long game and are working to win by taking objectives and winning important late game fights. Nasus is his own win condition, that reflects how he's approaching the battle from a strategic big picture pov
Dantone4 votesWow. You are so right, thank you for pointing that out.
I guess I was expecting his kit to having something like Ekko's W where you have to plan ahead a few seconds for it to work.
But I see what you mean. It's like the whole game is the planning ahead. Because he's lived so long it's like he knows he can ignore those early skirmishes and just stack Qs so that later he can have a big impact.
That's really awesome, thanks for pointing that out.
l Helios l2 votesI kind of like how renekton isn't just a mad dog as much as he seemed before. It at least seems like he has some memory and sanity. That makes him less binary and flat = good.
Any chance Nasus can actually get through to him?
RiotDinopawz3 votesI kind of like how renekton isn't just a mad dog as much as he seemed before. It at least seems like he has some memory and sanity. That makes him less binary and flat = good.
Any chance Nasus can actually get through to him?
Only time will tell...
l Helios l3 votesYou tease
xxxDogmanxxx2 votesThis is still blowing my mind, 17 hours later.
Thuban2 votesNew? Are you sure? Nothing new about these stories other than it's more words telling a story we already knew about before Azir was even thought of.
The Cane Master2 votesHow about you buff Nasus' kit so that he can keep up with Ekko?
Nirvoy1 votesHi guys awesome job with the development of league lore as of lately, enjoying it alot. Haven't read the new lores yet but I got a few general questions about the lore in general.
That's all I got for now, really been into the lore as of lately. Love the work, keep it up! :D
Photos of Ghosts2 votes"don't exist anymore" as in "have never existed". The game is not anymore a representation of facts in the universe of League, but just of its characters. The game is not canon to its own lore anymore.
