Boards›Story, Art, & Sound

Should League have an Official Webcomic?

Igotlazy··78 votes·5,828 views

http://i.imgur.com/K5Ztcuy.png

**There was at one point in time, a MOBA by the name of Dawngate being developed by EA. Though it looked promising, it was eventually cancelled due the game's inability to develop a large community by the end of it's Open Beta. I'm bringing up this story because Dawngate had an incredibly interesting way of developing it's lore which I honestly think League should adopt. It had a Webcomic, known as "The Dawngate Chronicles". **

Here's an example of some of the pages. https://cmmedia.global.ssl.fastly.net/459a1345f29ce1ed0455/24892348/960x1250.jpeg https://mir-s3-cdn-cf.behance.net/project_modules/disp/5ed4f717114079.562b5e739f1ed.jpg

The comic was updated 3 times a week (Monday, Wednesday and Friday) and had a few story arcs throughout it's run, usually with the focus of familiarizing readers with the Heroes in the game. It was good, like really freaking good. The art was amazing, the stories were engaging and fun, being able to see the characters you play as interact with their world and other Heroes, it was all just so well done. It is in my eyes, how MOBA lore should be handled. The Poppy and Ekko comics are some of the most well received pieces of Lore ever created, Why can't a Webcomic be the main way League's stories are told?

86 Comments

paradoxiq14 votes

Hi League ppls! I was Dawngate's EP. Just got pointed here by the twitters and wanted to write a thing ...

Story is ironically challenging in this genre: MOBAs are games defined by characters, yet the gameplay can't afford the moments required to develop those characters beyond their mechanics. Nor should it: games are not stories, and in MOBA, the expression of skill through the character is not only paramount, it's really all that matters. Gameplay first. No time for cut-scenes in a 10 player pvp game!

But good stories and the characters that bring them to life are fucking beautiful, and they make the expression of the character through those mechanics so much more meaningful and fun! Somehow, games are stories, or they want to be ... they certainly share something core with them through agency and the resulting connection we all have as players.

So while gameplay was always paramount, we also invested in deep world-building for Dawngate, and in funny ideas like match-up specific VO between characters, and in vehicles like the Dawngate Chronicles web comic to explore how to could bring characters to life. To be honest, It was all for science. We did it because we dug it and believed in it and we wanted to bring gameplay and story closer together: some of it worked, some of it didn't.

So on behalf of the crew who brought the Dawngate Chronicles to life: so glad you guys dug it ... we all loved making it!

"Splash of color!" :)

Leadpaintchips2 votes

Honestly, you guys set the standard for me for storytelling for MOBAS. You had a story that weaved the gameplay into it, and you ENCOURAGED us to pay attention to your lore, and to have the feels for all the characters, even the one's we didn't like. They were larger than life, but still human. They didn't feel like flat, one note songs, even when they were.

turkeyBACON3 votes

I don't agree that gameplay should be "paramount". I would argue that games are a spectrum and that not all games have or need stories but others are all about story and are the better for it. Moba's are certainly more difficult genre of games trying to find that balance but you guys were definitely close. Perhaps the closest so far. But just because something is difficult doesn't mean it doesn't deserve to be explored to its fullest. Dismissing story just feels lazy and the easy way out.

paradoxiq2 votes

We certainly didn't dismiss story, which was the point of my post. Acknowledging difficulty and sharing the development challenge was the goal there. Sorry if we missed each other on that! :)

For us, gameplay is paramount, and for Dawngate (and I'd argue, for the modern experience of MOBA as a genre), it needs to be. That was simply one of our values at Waystone, just as it is at our new studio. So the challenge was: how do we honor that and find a way to equally honor good storytelling.

Igotlazy3 votes

{quoted}

We certainly didn't dismiss story, which was the point of my post. Acknowledging difficulty and sharing the development challenge was the goal there. Sorry if we missed each other on that! :)

For us, gameplay is paramount, and for Dawngate (and I'd argue, for the modern experience of MOBA as a genre), it needs to be. That was simply one of our values at Waystone, just as it is at our new studio. So the challenge was: how do we honor that and find a way to equally honor good storytelling.

You guys were doing an amazing job over there, I'm sorry that EA decided to pull the plug. The reason this stuck in my head for so long was because it was THAT good. The Webcomic format allowed for me to be continually invested in these characters since there was always a new update to look forward too. http://hydra-media.cursecdn.com/dawngate.gamepedia.com/a/a5/1.14.jpg Look at Voluc's face. God dammit, I had such pity for that character. The feels man. Everytime I died to him in-game I would think "it's ok, he's been through a lot".

I would honestly rather have a continual and scheduled release of small content than giant pages of text every 3+ months. I mean the writers at Riot tell good stories, but it just comes as such a massive wave. I'm not even looking for some crazy overarching plot that involved all 128 champions. I would be completely satisfied with a mini-arc of Ekko's adventures with his buddies in Zaun for ~30 pages, then maybe a jump to Quinn on one of her scouting missions in the Freljord.

Leadpaintchips2 votes

GAH! I need to stop looking at this thread, all the feels!

That character pretty much had me in emo mode the whole time I saw him on the map.

This lore is just so sad, one of the worst for the feels in ANY game I've played.

I have to agree on the smaller, constant lore over the massive lore dumps that we have gotten. They're nice every once in a while, but would rather had a weekly (or biweekly) comic over that.

turkeyBACON3 votes

Sorry, I guess I misread your post as trying to provide a reason why Riot was falling short on their lore. I don't feel its necessary especially since you guys at Dawngate seemed to be on the right track of integrating moba gameplay with interesting and engaging storytelling. While you guys set a high standard to reach, Riot should be already there and trying to exceed it.

Riot obviously had issues that they seem to be turning around on (slowly). And they seem to be trying to provide more on the lore front. They just haven't found their own voice yet. And all the faltering and slow progress is frustrating as a fan of both games, esp. since dawngate is gone now and League has all the potential to fill that void.

Well, here's hoping league can meet my expectations but at this point its slim. And best of luck to you guys to your new game studio, I'm eagerly waiting to see what you guys put out.

paradoxiq1 votes

They're a smart bunch there at Riot, but I get where you're at. I'm optimistic they'll continue to explore and find ways forward that are right for them and for their game.

Valenten1 votes

Hey Paradoxiq! This is a silly question but do you ever think that there will be a chance to revitalize the story or is that also in EAs vault? I personally was really looking forward to Viridians story and more of Freia (my personal favorite character in game and in Lore).

paradoxiq1 votes

EA owns all the things.

Valenten3 votes

SADNESS D:

KING OF MASKS5 votes

Dawngate was an absolute treasure. Thank you so much for working on it.

Necron XCIX9 votes

Favourite page in the whole comic

http://hydra-media.cursecdn.com/dawngate.gamepedia.com/5/58/5.3.jpg

While I eventually stopped playing the game for various reasons, I absolutely adored the comic and I was sad to see it die out along with the game. I would love to see LoL attempt something similar

Leadpaintchips3 votes

when you had pages like the above and pages like this:

(http://i.imgur.com/m83TmgV.jpg)

it was good.

Necron XCIX2 votes

much yes

basically every strip with Renzo was pure gold, as well as the bit with vex... and ronan... and freia...

and pretty much the rest of the comic. can't think of any bit that straight-up sucked

Leadpaintchips4 votes

The lore (and everything surrounding it) was just. . . . . amazing.

It was only after reading the strip that I actually started to not loathe Renzo, because his floofing around the map combined with his referring to himself only in the third person just grated on me for some reason.

Seeing him as he was there just put it all into perspective for me.

ViashinoWizard8 votes

Man, I miss Dawngate. Salous was my favorite hero in any moba I've played.

Meep Man2 votes

Dibbs man!

Leadpaintchips2 votes

Think it was a tossup between Rex (for that philosophical lore "Too dumb for two legs, too smart for four legs, what is Rex?") and Mina (she just felt like how a support SHOULD be).

Honorable mention to Renzo, cause he might've grated on my nerves when I first heard him, but he grew on me (not enough to main, just enough to appreciate the character).

edited for Googling names.

Meep Man5 votes

Renzo grew on everyone, especially once you saw in the web comic.

http://41.media.tumblr.com/825e1a5a0f25c4018541f19beed54591/tumblr_nad0kaj1dl1rro06so2_500.jpg

BioticBrony1 votes

For me I could never find a hero that appealed to me. No body really stood out except for the person who could put themselves in somebody elses body

Leadpaintchips5 votes

That was Mina loved her.

kaltenashes1 votes

that champ seems amazing, wut happened to dawngate?

Leadpaintchips4 votes

It died. No one gave a reason, but my personal beliefs is that they rushed it into open beta, and when it wasn't doing as well as what EA wanted, they killed.

and if you looked at their whole roster of champs, they were all amazing. The characters were just awesome. Their kits meshed well with the lore. If you get a chance, just wander through their characters, and all the lore they released.

kaltenashes2 votes

i'll, if nami was a mid laner http://dawngate.gamepedia.com/Amarynth

turkeyBACON8 votes

Kinda surprised King of Masks hasn't shown up yet in this thread.

Back on topic, while I think a comic would be great for league I'm not convinced that Riot has an actual overarching narrative story for the game. League has the problem that it might just have too many "main" characters that it might be nearly impossible to give a satisfying storyline for each. Maybe Riot could pull it off but I wouldn't get my hopes up.

Leadpaintchips7 votes

What is up with people bringing up Dawngate recently? It DID have some amazing lore around it, and the gameplay had some really good ideas put into it, but it's been dead for a long time.

It just makes me sad that I can't play that anymore. . . .

Tribbles Foxfolk6 votes

{quoted}

What is up with people bringing up Dawngate recently? It DID have some amazing lore around it, and the gameplay had some really good ideas put into it, but it's been dead for a long time.

It just makes me sad that I can't play that anymore. . . .

Dawngate was a brilliant MOBA filled with SO MUCH potential. It wasn't like STRIFE, just trying to cash in on a popular market, but it was innovative, fresh, and really really fun. The art style made my jaw drop so many times (seriously, the Eastern art style is really underused in these games) and the gameplay was so engaging.

I really REALLY hope someone picks up ownership of Dawngate and makes it the excellent MOBA it could have been.

Tesla Effect1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Eevee Girl Alex,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=AhXfEnAq,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2015-12-11T01:51:32.233+0000)

Dawngate was a brilliant MOBA filled with SO MUCH potential. It wasn't like STRIFE, just trying to cash in on a popular market, but it was innovative, fresh, and really really fun. The art style made my jaw drop so many times (seriously, the Eastern art style is really underused in these games) and the gameplay was so engaging.

I really REALLY hope someone picks up ownership of Dawngate and makes it the excellent MOBA it could have been.

How about East European Artstyle being grossly underused in any game to be precise.

Tribbles Foxfolk2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Tesla Effect,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=AhXfEnAq,comment-id=000100000000,timestamp=2015-12-11T02:16:29.950+0000)

How about East European Artstyle being grossly underused in any game to be precise.

Sounds about right. I'd be down with more Eastern art styles as long as they aren't used alongside, say, Saturday-morning-cartoons graphics. THAT is where I draw the line.

Meep Man7 votes

If Dawngate comes back, I would instantly play again. Dibbs and crew were the best heroes I've ever played and the online web comic made me so invested in it and really brought the characters to life! So much potential, but it had to be backed by EA... ugh... the people who were actually working on the game though, they were actually really fun guys. They brought livestreams and such! They even were cool and livestreamed what they were gonna release when EA decided to shut it down.

Leadpaintchips4 votes

If Dawngate came back, you would hear a 30 year old man "Squee!!!!" like a Japanese Schoolgirl.

Yes, the WHOLE WORLD WOULD HEAR ME.

Sartazi1 votes

Tbh I don't want someone to pick up ownership of Dawngate at this point. I'm too afraid they will just ruin everything and will lead Dawngate in wrong direction. Only exception is Spiritwalk Games. Paradoxiq & Co made Dawngate and they know why its so great and how to develop this game into an even better game. Can't wait for their new game and hopefully it will be at least half as good as Dawngate

KING OF MASKS3 votes

Never forget.

Wind Whistler4 votes

{quoted}

What is up with people bringing up Dawngate recently? It DID have some amazing lore around it, and the gameplay had some really good ideas put into it, but it's been dead for a long time.

It just makes me sad that I can't play that anymore. . . .

Damn. Here I am wishing I could play Sion again, and here you are wishing you could play an ENTIRE MOBA again. I can't even imagine your pain.

BeastOG4 votes

Man I miss that game. I had such a fun time whenever I got on. And don't get me started on the amazingness that was Renzo. It was the game that solidified my hatred of EA as a company when they shut it down. [zombie-nunu-bummed]

Leadpaintchips3 votes

Ya, was the same for me. Pretty much killed all support I was having for them, I feel dirty picking up any games now, and I don't think I'm going to feed any more money that direction because of it.

Ralanr3 votes

I really liked the comic despite never getting into the game. It allowed for some interesting storytelling.

But a webcomic would remove any hope of connecting the lore and gameplay. I know they aren't trying to do that, but I'm holding out hope.

Igotlazy1 votes

{quoted}

I really liked the comic despite never getting into the game. It allowed for some interesting storytelling.

But a webcomic would remove any hope of connecting the lore and gameplay. I know they aren't trying to do that, but I'm holding out hope.

How so?

Ralanr3 votes

Mainly in how the certain champions would develop. Let's say Poppy realizes she's the hero in a comic. Her in game personality would not reflect this...unless they did a story related skin...I don't know why I wasn't considering that.

Leadpaintchips2 votes

The other part of that webcomic, is that players through the game itself, had a voice as to how the various arcs could go. Most of the pivot points in the story which had two of the characters in conflict, had a few days where players could play as one of the characters to show their support.

Tesla Effect1 votes

{quoted}

The other part of that webcomic, is that players through the game itself, had a voice as to how the various arcs could go. Most of the pivot points in the story which had two of the characters in conflict, had a few days where players could play as one of the characters to show their support.

Riot could easily do all of this if they wanted to. They have the budget and no big evil company hindering their progress, so long as this leads to more profit as oppose to just wasting resources for no actual profit.

Leadpaintchips1 votes

The only problem with that would be how they are currently handling their lore. It's not a large, arcing story, it's small clips, as one person put it to me "snapshots" of each champions.

Tesla Effect2 votes

{quoted}

The only problem with that would be how they are currently handling their lore. It's not a large, arcing story, it's small clips, as one person put it to me "snapshots" of each champions.

They did try and do something with the whole Bilgewater Shadow Isles thing, but they need to expand upon that same formula and including it within other regions with different champions, sorta start making this world a world instead of something we just say is a world but has no actual substance that makes something that we define as a world.

Blitzidious3 votes

I wouldn't say it was the games fault for not bringing in enough players, or the company that made it, I'd say it's more EA's fault for having the Universal name of "Worst fucking company ever".

Meep Man3 votes

Game was awesome, developers were great, EA happened.

Narasimha2 votes

It wasn't that it wasn't bringing new players, it was that it couldn't even retain the players it had. The lore was nice, but the gameplay was all sorts of unbalanced and stale. While the planned Progression patch (if I recall the name correctly) would have gone a long way in helping that, it was too late in coming.

Fuzzyears3 votes

I miss Dawngate. I had so much fun playing their version of support. (Mina FTW)

Beyond Legends2 votes

As much I like the idea of a web comic for League, I feel like currently it is just not ready for such things. Runeteraa or Valoran is still very under develop as a whole and I would rather see them fleshing those out rather than a daily or weekly web comic.

Meep Man4 votes

That's... what a weekly web comic would do.

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