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What can be done (Visually/Artistically) with Pantheon?

ModCaptainMårvelous·11/9/2015, 8:01:43 PM·45 votes·7,195 views

http://puu.sh/lfv1O/5fe5e97746.jpg

Today I was thinking about Pantheon. I've been playing him a few times because I have a gut feeling his jungling will come back in S6 and that he'll be strong. Even without the bandwagon, I enjoy the kit and have him making an appearance in something I'm writing. With that quick intro out of the way, it's occurred to me that one cannot do much with Pantheon without drastically changing who he is.

http://i.imgur.com/706bsZi.jpg

Pantheon comes from a time when League focused more on stereotypes and archetypes more than actual characterization. Amumu was a sad mummy. TwistedFate was a cocky gambler and Sivir was a mercenary mistress. Pantheon too was little more than a one-note joke about Spartan/Greek warriors with a side-joke tossed in about his bakerly desires. There's little outside of him being a capable warrior that functions as his character.

Now, like we've seen in recent times, a stereotype and base archetype can evolve beyond that. Sivir is now a seething mass of complexities about her role as princess versus her love of being a mercenary. Twisted Fate (Tobias) is now a river-folk conman who is only just now rebuilding the bridge between him and Graves. These archetypes have evolved and become more complex as characters. The problem is when you try to apply this to Pantheon, both aesthetically and visually.

Foremost, Pantheon's got a VERY clear visual style. He's a spartan. He's Leonidas from 300. You can't take too many liberties with a design like that. Sure, you can add intricacies like arm-guards, insignia and otherwise but you can't mess with the core design too much. Twisted Fate had a similar problem where he cannot be too different or else you risk losing who he originally was. An example like Garen can be made because of his base archetype (The Gallant Knight) can have all sorts of armor changes, capes, what have you.

With pantheon, too much differentiating will make you lose the clear Spartan tie he has.

Following this, Panthon's kit doesn't afford much visually. His kit is very visceral, grounded in reality and effective...save, of course, for Grand Skyfall. Unless you really play up Pantheon's superhuman capabilities and give him some sort of relic or power in being able to leap across the land? He's going to be your basic spartan warrior. You can't really make him that different other than saying "He's like the others but better. He's just stronger than your average foot soldier".

Much of this relates to a core problem: Spartans were a closely tied, similar group of people.

With all this in mind, here are just some ideas I have about what one can do with Pantheon:

  • Play up his demi-god/greek hero heritage. Maybe those of Targon are demi-gods descended from a super-powerful race of people. They can run faster, strike harder and fight better than anyone who steps up to them. They're not just peak human: They're something more. Pantheon, of course, would be among the greatest of them.

  • Give his Grand Skyfall an origin. Perhaps Pantheon's leaping is an ancient Targon relic that grants him flight. Make a league-parallel to Hermes if you must. Just don't expect the average person to believe "Oh yeah he's just able to do that. Shut up don't ask questions."

  • Expand his backstory comparative to Solari/Lunari. The Rakkor are the normal people seemingly caught up in this religious feud that doesn't concern them. How does Pantheon feel about this? Was Diana an enemy as well or was she too once a friend? Is his duty to defend Targon all-encompassing or does he have (gasp) actual human desires beneath his helmet?

  • Be willing to part with SOME of his Spartan/Greek heritage. Pantheon, visually, can't evolve much if he's constrained by this rule that he has to be the Spartan guy. Keep that part of him but don't make it everything. Maybe give him a new helmet. Make his shield less of a carbon-copy of Spartan shields. Give Targon and, by extent, Pantheon an identity that is only partially inspired by that civilization, not wholly.

#TL;DR: Pantheon's cool but he's a bit of a one-note character with little going for him. If Pantheon is to ever get a VU or grow as a character, something unique is going to have to be done about him.

68 Comments

Veraska11/9/2015, 8:15:39 PM11 votes

Visually I think he could use an overhaul. like he's from targon, where leona and diana are from, they represent the sun and moon so pantheons armor could represent the earth, it doesn't have to be as slick and curvy as the solari gals but it should definitely be more than a 300 Halloween costume.

LORE wise id like them to play up his "champion of the Rakkor" thing, he's not just any warrior he's incredible, he's so strong and he's such a good fighter that his tribe herald him as there hero, bordering between the mortals and immortals,

Pantheon should be league of legends Hercules story

I could talk way more about his kit and my gripes with it, but this is a story focused thread, I'm glad we're talking about panth tho, he's always been a wasted opportunity hopefully he's the target of a gangplank level rework if/when they do some targon related stuff

turkeyBACON11/10/2015, 12:44:58 AM5 votes

Personally, I have a couple of different directions I could see Pantheon going.

  1. Let Pantheon remain one dimensional at first. THE spartan warrior. The artisan of war. I would expand him visually a bit. Borrow some Persian or African influences to widen the visual language of the Rakkor. He's never been exactly noble despite people wanting him to be together with Leona. He doesn't care about the fall of Solari. The Rakkor tribes remain stable as they've mostly governed themselves. He's a warrior first and foremost for now.

  2. Embrace the fan service and allow Pantheon to join Leona's cause. He already has powerful relic weapons and he'd just take up the Solari visuals. The thrill of hunting down the heretic. A challenger worthy of the fight. He'd go at Leona's stead to capture Diana to bring her to justice. Leona would remain behind to repair and rebuild the Solari.

  3. A third (technically 4th) party could approach Pantheon. They see Pantheon as a caged warrior wasted. A potential tool to be used. The Spear to strike down the complacent and the Shield to brace against the oncoming chaos of a war between demigods, Chosen of the Sun and Moon. A secret sect heralds of disaster and beckons Pantheon to take up a higher purpose. "Night begins to fall but the sleeping sentries must be awoken. A Star in the Twilight must rise." If you haven't guessed this other party is a branch of the Kinkou Order. A neutral party trying to maintain balance in the world. If Pantheon becomes their agent he gets a near complete overhaul. Ionian influences mixed into the Rakkor styled spartan base armor. He'd look visually distinct from everyone as he's in direct conflict between the Solari and Lunari.

Ironclad Dragon11/10/2015, 1:01:17 AM4 votes

http://img09.deviantart.net/c856/i/2014/259/f/6/rugged_pantheon_2_0_by_akantorking-d7mdx4y.png My take on it.

Apparently Iron Stylus liked it.

{quoted}

I'm just interested because it tells me a story with it's design. We don't know what the environment Pantheon's people live in. If it was anything like what that image indicates, I get the context of his character at the very least.

kaltenashes11/10/2015, 1:06:30 AM4 votes

Yes,This....Plus a baker skin [slayer-jinx-wink]

SchaakaKon11/10/2015, 3:05:54 AM3 votes

Theres no rule that Pantheon has to be a carbon copy of the 300 movie series (visually).

Keeping him not gaudy, but a gruff 'blue collar' warrior, is how i see his core identity.

Oelyk11/10/2015, 3:47:49 AM2 votes

As long as he still has those manly gluts, I'll be okay with a VU. http://41.media.tumblr.com/6333b9841817ac9aac91c990101c130a/tumblr_inline_nnfhlv2UQi1t8mzj2_500.jpg

Merxamers11/10/2015, 5:56:42 PM2 votes

For any update, i'd like to see him keep the bit of personality he does have; the battle-quipping the way the real life Spartans did), the great laugh-spam, the tragedy of him never becoming a baker.

I would like to see him have a bit more depth though. You definitely don't get much of a sense of where he came from, or how he feels about things. I'm fine with his overall look, but maybe they can play up the Perseus model, ie. have him be a soldier-hero with a lot of divine artifact weapons.

As a headcannon thing, one thing i've always wondered is who these guys are always fighting. They're warriors, right? Well who the heck are they warring against?! What if the area by Mt. Targon was where all the animalistic tribes were (Alistar and Rengar's people, etc.). You'd think that humans who have to square off against cow and lion people would be a bit better at warfare than the average grunt.

The Whamboozler11/10/2015, 11:54:41 AM2 votes

Grab the Dragon Slayer Panth skin. BAM. He now has a visual update, isn't a spartan AND he has an excuse for his ult.

But seriously, I'm pretty sure the excuse for skyfall is he's toting several enchanted relics of his people. That's also why his spear comes back when he throws it and his shield can stand up to nearly anything. (Why Gragas has limitless kegs to toss at people we'll never know) He was a kid from his tribe who wanted to protect his tribe. He's a patriot of his people, following their traditions even when they're brutal or harsh. In his old lore he killed his brother in single combat to earn the right to be his people's champion and wear the items he now wears. He was prepared to execture Leona, a childhood friend, at the behest of his elders. He's got a personality... it just doesn't show in his emotes and VO.

I personally have always liked the fanon that Panth was once a weak child, who pushed himself into brutal training to overcome his physical frailties and become a warrior. He's built more slender and a lot less bulky/burly than a lot of the typical AD bruiser meatheads. There was a comic floating around about Panth being picked on for wanting to be a baker (his people often starve, so wanting to be involved with producing food would mean he can live in peace AND that his people are prospering) instead of a warrior, and that a young Leona stuck up for him and stood by him. This protection was his motivation to learn the arts of war... so that he could be as brave as the fiery-haired girl who he grew up with and maybe defend her someday to repay her.

Panth is one of my mains and most played champs. I'd love to see him given a bit more depth and some more VO lines besides just generic spartan lines.

NeonSword11/9/2015, 8:02:43 PM2 votes

you can delete him. easy fix artisically

Kobila200011/11/2015, 7:33:23 AM1 votes

You can see a glimpse of what they're going for here: http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-dFJOVBFAC0c/VHSrte2C0rI/AAAAAAAAeWE/UQZtWUX3msY/s1600/maxresdefault.jpg They gave him segmented chest armour, a sun badge and a skirt so he's a little bit closer to Leona's design. He still very much looks Spartan though. For a Spartan/Greek look really all you need is a Corinthian helmet and no pants. Everything else is open to creative liberties. Of course promo art and visual updates are two different things, but it's the most we have currently.

I was always bothered by his shield, especially the lambda sign on it. Lambda stands for Lacedemonia or in other words, Sparta. It's like writing "Japan" on Yasuo's scarf.

For his backstory they should definitively expand on his relationship with Leona so it's not at the level of "Yeah they both bought sandwiches in cafeteria once" and explain some things about their tribe. I don't think he knew Diana though, because she's Solari and from what I gather they don't exactly live among his tribe.

Dragunnitum11/11/2015, 2:47:21 PM1 votes

His Toes omg xD

Vanjie11/9/2015, 11:53:20 PM1 votes

I think every champion that has the big feet, small stature, and overlarged features need to be updated. I can name a few:

Shen, Pantheon, Mordekeiser, and Taric. All of these champions have large feet that make them look horrible. All of these champions are not at their respectable heights . . . . in my opinion. Mordekeiser should be like HUGE but his weapon is so large and his body frame is small. Pantheon just looks like a short midget with big feet. They need to slim him out a little more, make him taller, and adjust his feet size. Taric is just horrible. Shen has big feet and I think he suffers from the same problem Pantheon does. His model is to stakly, he has large feet, and he just looks out of place compared to the newer champion art.

HigeR11/10/2015, 6:38:23 AM1 votes

I like the fact that he's an spartan like warrior, I think they should add a real face to his character though, that would be the utmost important part.

As far as his character having some significance in the targon world, I'd say that there's a difference between being an spartan and being Leonidas, even though, I don't think he should be just leonidas... There's one of your points that really got my attention, when you say that targon is greek oriented, I couldn't agree more, though knowing Riot they're not about having the "Greek region" but mostly about building said region with greek inspiration... what I mean is, that greek mythology is quite amazing as it is but Riot is not likely to take from it and just put it in the game, instead they would want to create their own myths, based on different things, for example, the sun and the moon as the highest ranks.

While greek mythology has these characters (Helios and Selene, Apolo and Artemis) we can see how Leona and Diana are not even close in terms of their characters, they're not some saint seiya characters who just happen to be in the game.

That said I think we can take certain things from greek mythology, specially the origin of spartans, it is said that all spartan is a son of Ares himself, I don't think that the rakkor should be all demi-gods but we can set them pretty nicely into the whole sun/moon background using the concept of stars. The rakkor could be the guardians of the night that keep the moon at bay, the military stars that were born to step in battle.

Now that the rakkor have a place in the whole Targon mix, we need to find out who Pantheon is, he and Leona know each others since they were kids and he saw her grow up into who she is today, could pantheon be dawn star? The first star in the sky when the sun starts to hide into the horizon? could pantheon devotion be more than just duty for Leona? could love make a soldier stand out enough as for him to become a legend?

All of these questions are possibilities that I believe Riot would consider while building pantheon from the ground up, I don't think his character is locked out and has very few possibilities, in fact, his current set up is so basic that the paths Riot could take with him are almost endless.

FistOfSharkiesha11/10/2015, 6:42:53 AM1 votes

A good start would be to fix his big meaty clown feet.

Cupkek11/10/2015, 8:00:19 AM1 votes

{quoted}

http://puu.sh/lfv1O/5fe5e97746.jpg

Today I was thinking about Pantheon. I've been playing him a few times because I have a gut feeling his jungling will come back in S6 and that he'll be strong. Even without the bandwagon, I enjoy the kit and have him making an appearance in something I'm writing. With that quick intro out of the way, it's occurred to me that one cannot do much with Pantheon without drastically changing who he is.

http://i.imgur.com/706bsZi.jpg

Pantheon comes from a time when League focused more on stereotypes and archetypes more than actual characterization. Amumu was a sad mummy. TwistedFate was a cocky gambler and Sivir was a mercenary mistress. Pantheon too was little more than a one-note joke about Spartan/Greek warriors with a side-joke tossed in about his bakerly desires. There's little outside of him being a capable warrior that functions as his character.

Now, like we've seen in recent times, a stereotype and base archetype can evolve beyond that. Sivir is now a seething mass of complexities about her role as princess versus her love of being a mercenary. Twisted Fate (Tobias) is now a river-folk conman who is only just now rebuilding the bridge between him and Graves. These archetypes have evolved and become more complex as characters. The problem is when you try to apply this to Pantheon, both aesthetically and visually.

Foremost, Pantheon's got a VERY clear visual style. He's a spartan. He's Leonidas from 300. You can't take too many liberties with a design like that. Sure, you can add intricacies like arm-guards, insignia and otherwise but you can't mess with the core design too much. Twisted Fate had a similar problem where he cannot be too different or else you risk losing who he originally was. An example like Garen can be made because of his base archetype (The Gallant Knight) can have all sorts of armor changes, capes, what have you.

With pantheon, too much differentiating will make you lose the clear Spartan tie he has.

Following this, Panthon's kit doesn't afford much visually. His kit is very visceral, grounded in reality and effective...save, of course, for Grand Skyfall. Unless you really play up Pantheon's superhuman capabilities and give him some sort of relic or power in being able to leap across the land? He's going to be your basic spartan warrior. You can't really make him that different other than saying "He's like the others but better. He's just stronger than your average foot soldier".

Much of this relates to a core problem: Spartans were a closely tied, similar group of people.

With all this in mind, here are just some ideas I have about what one can do with Pantheon:

  • Play up his demi-god/greek hero heritage. Maybe those of Targon are demi-gods descended from a super-powerful race of people. They can run faster, strike harder and fight better than anyone who steps up to them. They're not just peak human: They're something more. Pantheon, of course, would be among the greatest of them.

  • Give his Grand Skyfall an origin. Perhaps Pantheon's leaping is an ancient Targon relic that grants him flight. Make a league-parallel to Hermes if you must. Just don't expect the average person to believe "Oh yeah he's just able to do that. Shut up don't ask questions."

  • Expand his backstory comparative to Solari/Lunari. The Rakkor are the normal people seemingly caught up in this religious feud that doesn't concern them. How does Pantheon feel about this? Was Diana an enemy as well or was she too once a friend? Is his duty to defend Targon all-encompassing or does he have (gasp) actual human desires beneath his helmet?

  • Be willing to part with SOME of his Spartan/Greek heritage. Pantheon, visually, can't evolve much if he's constrained by this rule that he has to be the Spartan guy. Keep that part of him but don't make it everything. Maybe give him a new helmet. Make his shield less of a carbon-copy of Spartan shields. Give Targon and, by extent, Pantheon an identity that is only partially inspired by that civilization, not wholly.

#TL;DR: Pantheon's cool but he's a bit of a one-note character with little going for him. If Pantheon is to ever get a VU or grow as a character, something unique is going to have to be done about him.

As someone who frequently calls upon the Mantheon for his assistance in battle, I agree that he's a relic of a time long since past.

  • From a character thematic perspective, he's "That Spartan Guy" to anyone who doesn't read the lore.
  • From a gameplay perspective, he's "that guy who drops on you from somewhere in the troposphere with the force of a nuclear bomb and murders your face".
  • From a Pantheon main's perspective he's that "WAHAHAHAHA NUCLEAR LAUNCH DETECTED MOTHERF*CKER!!" guy.

I agree that his identity is rather bland and could use some tweaking. Visually, he suffers from Pizza-Feet Syndrome (much like Mordekaiser) and doesn't really come across as the badass warrior type except in his Dragonslayer skin.

Though somewhat over the top, I enjoy the part of his theme that effectively turns Pantheon into superman. The ability to take off into the air and come crashing down on an unsuspecting opponent 5 miles away, the never-miss spear throws, the blindingly-fast stabs during Heartseeker Strike. It really gives him an edge as this elite warrior trained in secret to become a miniature superman.

One thing I actually like about Pantheon, that many view as a flaw, is the sense of mystery. Who is the man behind the helmet? One thing to note is that we never see his face. Ever. All we see are those 2 determined glowing coals he has for eyes. Just look at those eyes in his splash art. That kind of glare only comes from people who have experienced/seen some sh*t. What is it Pantheon has seen? Why does he never remove the helmet? I LOVE this kind of stuff.

Regarding his lore, I believe there was mention of the spear and shield being objects of extreme power passed on through the generations. Perhaps they are what give Pantheon his ability to perform insane acts of heroism and strength. They must be, to be honest. Especially considering he's going up against foes with guns, magic, chemicals, dark energies, etc.

Whimsy Spook11/10/2015, 4:04:28 PM1 votes

What if they did just move away from the spartan thing and made him an angel. Give him wings when he flies with his 'R', his spears can be holy light spear things, etc. Give him a helmet that resembles his current, you know with the whole shadow face thing still intact, minus the close resemblance to the spartan theme.

Wait, now I'm just thinking of Tyrael at this point but still - who would really care if they moved away from the spartan thing.

Then just keep his skins the same with maybe some minor updates to coincide with the theme of him being an angel - possibly opposite of Morgana, maybe friends or acquaintances with Kayle. "Pantheons" could be like a Leagues form and take on angels. Like how Supernatural took an interesting take on Angels to move away from Demons every episode.

Then boom, whole new identity that only a few people will miss.

Kadavik11/10/2015, 6:54:51 PM1 votes

[slayer-pantheon-thumbs]

Lost R11/10/2015, 9:51:32 PM1 votes

Considering that he's wearing skintight what might be clothing and wearing a shield, spear, helmet and cape, you can do plenty with the idea from there.

1: Give him armor. Not heavy armor like Darius or Garen or even Leona, but enough that it looks like he's making an attempt to protect his vitals under his shield. (The real Spartans actually wore armor; they were not that different from their neighbors in the empire when it came to armaments)

2: Make his listed effects prettier and make the Targon or Rakkor (depending on whether or not Riot decides to unify Targon) insignia on his shield much more distinctive.

3: Make him red and gold instead of red and brown; what I'm guessing the new color codes for Targon is.

Ralanr11/11/2015, 4:49:22 AM1 votes

Does anyone think one of Illaoi's quotes reference the Rakkor tribe? Specifically one of the people quotes?