Old league lore was bad, like really bad.

Sorry man, you know the rules of nostalgia, there wasn’t any problems at all with the old stuff

I like the new lore

I prefer coherent s@#$ to self-important vapidity, personally.

The old lore was brief, simplistic, and often crass, but you know what you were dealing with AND IT ECHOED IN THE GAME with the voice lines and basic interactions, which was the most important part.

Having a champion /directly address me/ as a summoner was some of the best feelings a videogame had given me at the time.

And that is precisely what they tossed out the window.

Glad you're enjoying the current lore.

I'm not.

EDIT: Oh and on the 'IoW was stifling the story' topic: the Riot writers said that. They're the ones in charge of RIot's story, and they get to say that. I find it completely mind-numblingly stupid, and is essentially the equivalent of just saying 'f@#$ it', but it is their right to say it.

As a writer myself, /I/ found the setting inspiring, and helped provide a groundwork for interactions between characters and conflicts that could persist in a way that no normal setting and war could allow for.

And now we're down to pretty damn standard tropes and fantasy dynamics.

Glad you're enjoying the new version, but the old version was unique and flavorful in a way that is not matched. And at this point? Nostalgia for the story is the only value the story has to me. Its been butchered too much to latch onto anything solid. INdividual stories/elements can be really solid, but the whole picture? Not appealing to me anymore.

I dont think anyone hates old lore as us MF mains (Sona tho)

Every single game in which I dont use GGMF:

SuRe YoU cAn HaNdlE mE, sUmMoNeR ?

Nothing excuses that massive retcon. Some changes would be good, but not throwing out the fucking center point of lore. Even GW didn't do that, and they have been here for MUCH longer.

So, you are right. The old lore was a fucking mess. Hell, the most consistently updated part of the lore was a gossip rag! If I don’t want to read about actual celebrities why would I read about the tawdry pointless lives of fake celebrities?

But I’d say there was a potential to the old lore. A potential never realized. Have you ever heard of a game called Legend of the Five Rings? Fascinating card game from years back. In brief each year they’d play a tournament and the way the tourney played out would determine the story going forward. This got crazy at times, with one pretty major player switching his deck to a different faction and that whole thing got turned into one of the hero cards from the original deck becoming a turncoat to the new faction. And just so much more. The tourneys were then written in narrative and created a developing interesting game world. And the reason this worked was because the game’s mechanics developed the story.

The idea of a group of heroes to represent factions playing this strange game to have effect on the world is a unique one and could have been used to create an engaging experience.

It didn’t. Not at all. The closest we got was the halfassed Ionia/Noxus Thing and the battle for the crown of Freljord. Neither actually went anywhere or were given stories to show this development. They just happened and we got a shoe. No new stories or anything. I believe that dream of the game and story being linked together is part of why we have people so invested in the old lore. And hell, a few years back there was a group who did run tournaments to determine their own split off lore based upon game results. I believe the participants found it very fun. I’m not sure whatever happened to them.

But the storytelling I outlined above takes a lot of work. Requires a very fluid understanding of story structure and requires a writer with little control on their own story. More of a grand scale D&D campaign than a narrative. So it makes sense for those who don’t want to do that to scrap it and start something more manageable. Normal character driven stories completely divorced from the gameplay. Noticeably after this game and story divergence the one time they came back together was when Gangplank “died” which was a terrible idea. Instead of letting the players influence the story the story imposed restrictions on the players screwing over any Gangplank player in the process.

So yeah lot of potential little to no actual success in the telling. Instead of a player driven developing story. We got shoes and a gossip rag.

So it was replaced. But here’s the thing. I don’t think the new lore is all that good, either. Now don’t get me wrong. It’s better than the magazine. So much better than the magazine. But it’s not all that good as fantasy. The setting seems patched together, the technology and social development is inconsistent and the designs often laughable. Which admittedly the old lore had just as bad, but then it wasn’t trying to be taken seriously. So it wasn’t.

The new lore seems to strive for more complex storytelling, but I haven’t felt it. I’ve read most of what comes out and honestly I don’t know why. It isn’t particularly exciting. If I wanted good action writing I’d go reread Gemmel, or Abercrombie, or Howard. The moral complexity that gets toted on the boards seems simplistic next to Martin or Hugo. The prose is no Tolkien or Tolstoy. There doesn’t seem to be any glimpse of a deeper meaning to the stories or some grand reflection of human nature.

The new lore has never made me laugh, or cry, or scream, or give me an adrenaline rush. The characters don’t excite me, the worldbuilding seems slapdash.

It is an improvement. But it isn’t great either.

Fiddlesticks old lore is one of my favorites. A mage messed something up and now there's a murderous scarecrow standing in a room, doing nothing. That's it.

We do not say old stories are unconditionally good. For example Bio has changed greatly, but her character is essentially unchanged. And I like her new stories. （Ideally, I would like I want her to relate with them .）

We do not want the charm of our favorite champion to be destroyed by writers not interested in it. That's all there is to it.

Yes, the old worldbuilding was terrible. I think we can agree that while the Institute of War was a fun explanation for having different people interact with each other, it wasn't very good for introducing bigger characters, concepts, and progressing stories. I will admit, I like the world of Runeterra in the new lore better than the old.

However, I think the real reason why people are upset is because Riot is changing the CHARACTERS. The one thing that has people come back other than the game itself is the characters. Lots of people loved the characters, and to see Riot change them up and get rid of the characters they loved can feel personal and cause some grief, which I understand. (Helllooooo Janna)

Usually when people complain about missing the old lore, they aren't talking about stuff as old as the summoners or the Institute of War, generally they mean either something after the big retcon, or something that was before it but still reasonably independent of the concepts.

This, however:

Or how literally nothing was allowed to happen in lore

Is soooo dishonest. The story since the retcon does not move in the slightest, there is no kind of progression and characters don't change unless they're completely rewritten. Riot actually had regular story updates for a while before the retcon (like a full story arc about Trundle and his tribe) but they discontinued it because it wasn't very popular.

The old lore suffered from the problem that it tried to explain what the champions were actually doing in the game. This is a hard sell.... but the new lore just completely ignores it, which is not entirely better. I understand that the writers are enjoying coming up with stories about these characters, but there is nothing even resembling an explanation for what they're doing here or why they're fighting each other.

The new stories and characters ARE (usually) better. But they have nothing to do with the game, which is kind of awkward.

Personally, I also dislike them filling the game with gods, dragons who can juggle planets, and the like. How exactly is Sara Fortune killing them with two pistols?

Honestly Im glad that the old lore os gone and that matches are non-canon because imagining them as actually happening in-lore and people being a-okay with this is horrifying

Friends, family, loved ones... killing each other again and again and again, day after day after day? Like Lux and Garen are okay just murdering each other? People have no qualms about Darius murdering an actual child (Annie)?

Like I know suspension of disbelief is important but there's only so far I can go

Dude what about fiddles old lore.

Spooky boi pops into existence in some room and kills some nerds.

Then he afks in the room and nobody goes in it.

I see a Syndra mention and here I- Wait. Did you call Syndra evil? D:

Old lore had cool Zaun. New lore has Piltover's junkyard that calls itself Zaun.

Old lore had character interactions be common place and we could see the characters we love playing as interact with one another in and out of the field of battle. In new lore, we're lucky to see Garen and Lux maybe exchange a couple of sentences.

Old lore involved the game, and "us" in a manner of speaking. New lore has nothing to do with the game.

Even mentioning Aatrox and champions like him, sometimes mystery and room for imagination can be a good thing. Was Aatrox a demon? Was Aatrox his weapon? Are the Darkin like League's Horsemen of the Apocolypse, with Aatrox being an avatar of war? Sometimes it's not the worst thing in the world to leave people in the dark.

I could go on, but you're entitled to your own opinion and I'm entitled to mine. There's plenty of reason to like the old lore, and if you like the new stuff that's great. Again, you're entitled to your opinion. But don't act like any opinions opposing yours are wrong, especially when it comes to a super subjective field like fantasy and literature.

IoW and Summoners are Gary Stus LUL

I find it funny that you straight up admit new Rammus lore doesn't do shit but talk it up as good even though the writers could do that exact shit with the old material if they wanted to.

No bias at all.

7 years ago, we had a few mages, a few people with swords and a few yordles. Summoners could actually reign them in.

Now we have an undead metal conqueror, 2 ascended that are literally gods battling it out in the desert. A bunch of celestial beings with the power of Gods, and a star creating space dragon.

Do people actually not see it or do they not realize that if the Institute of War were to remain it simply wouldn't work?

Like I'm pretty sure Azir would flip them off if they ever try to take his kingdom away from him. None of the Aspects would even place the summoners to their level and Aurelion Sol would just laugh before disintegrating them without a thought.

We literally have world ending champs in this game now, what's a bunch of simple mages gonna do to begin with.

It's an argument I've been making for a long time. Apparently no one sees this.

Imagine have a CANON waifu, the absolute madman

Old lore was good my dude