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@Narrative team: Why the changes in Jarvan's bio?

BaWsMaNn·2/6/2019, 7:04:48 AM·23 votes·14,683 views

So Jarvan's bio got a change just recently and some of the alterations really don't make much sense to me. His capture by Noxus has been removed, his time spent anonymous in the village was removed, and his whole experience is shorted and feels somewhat cheapened. Across all of Jarvan's lores he has spent time in Noxian captivity from old lore with Urgot to the last lore before now, it has become a key point and event for his character for development and the beginning of his developmental arc (and doesn't Sion's existence rely on it for his mental resurrection via Jarvan's blood?), and now it is just gone. Not to mention, his arc feels a little rushed and without as much emotional development as his previous lore had. I was wondering what the thought process to change his lore was, considering the lore seems to follow the same idea but I unfortunately feel has lost the impact of his previous lore, and why it was done the way it was?

I ask because I feel Jarvan's character is somewhat diminished with this new lore, his friendships with Shyvana and Garen feel weaker as less time is offered to them, and he seems to get off easy with a weaker consequence compared to his other lore, as well as his lore not actually needing these changes evident in that the overall plot remains the same despite being fully rewritten. But, while I do has these criticisms, I do enjoy LoL's lore over all and from his new lore I do like certain additions such as furthering Jarvan III's character, mentions of Lady Catherine who I thought was forgotten in the JoJs, general expanding on ideas with extra details, and the addition of Xin Zhao into the lore. Also, gosh, that mention of Jarvan being king in the future, that makes me so excited and I hope that comes as a skin with that amazing new look he has! Those are really nice touches I enjoyed. I personally would have loved Jarvan to get an updated lore which included these extras but kept the narrative of the previous version.

If you have extra time and patience, I am interested to know a) if Demacia's king is still elected by a council like said in Jarvan's old lore as it is no longer present and b) how Shyvana has gone from having to keep her identity quiet to every noble in the Demacian court knowing she is a dragon as that is rather interesting considering Demacia's position on magic.

Thank you for taking the time to read and answer if you do, it is much appreciated.

26 Comments

Thefrostyviking2/6/2019, 11:31:48 AM10 votes

The problem with Jarvans old lore is that it makes Noxus seem kinda r%%%%%ed, utterly so, and the Demacian nobility as well.

First up, he didnt have any kind of guard or adviser who told him that charging dick first into enemy territory is a terrible idea or tried to stop him , then he somehow got conveniently separated from his top level elite royal guards and then despite extended combat he didnt get help and instead got captured.

He, his guards and his advisers all look mentally disabled here.

Then the Noxians as mentioned ,caught him, had him prisoner for weeks while moving deeper and deeper into Noxus, but somehow conveniently despite Jarvan was a top level important prisoner the camp was still so poorly defended that a troop lead by Garen could sneak up on them and cause such a big commotion that despite not reaching him Jarvan somehow broke free and escaped on his own although injured.

Noxus looks like they were all collectively smoking something very damn potent during that entire sequence i mean, why the hells does a top level priority prisoner get kept in some remote and averagely defended camp? Why could Jarvan escape on his own? No guards or chains? Why the fuck could a fully armed troop from Demacia manage to follow a extremely important Noxian convoy for weeks into Noxian territory without anyone realizing they were there?

How in the worlds could Jarvan escape despite his injuries? Travel for weeks through unfamiliar lands to get back to the borders of Demacia and only then collapse and be found by Shyvana?

How in all the sodding hells could the Demacians not realize there was a very big problem with Shyvana´s appearance? Its very clearly not human and for them to realize that she isnt the very opposite of everything they stand for would be a absolute miracle.

The new narrative removes so many of these giant ass problems and the only strange part left is the fact that he was allowed to ignore his advisers and go dickfirst into enemy territory, but its not unreasonable for him to escape a losing battle into a nearby forest and then over the course of days then lose his companions due to Noxian scouts but still getting close to friendly lands in the process but collapsing before he could reach due to his injuries and exhaustion.

...To be honest i´d probably petition the writer to have the lore changed to him attempting something like a surprise raid only to get ambushed instead, makes more sense and people dont seem to stupid.

Then given that he was right on the border of Demacian land and inside a forest with his followers having somehow held back the scouts its not impossible for him to somehow make it so close to getting back as he did before collapsing of injuries, which makes encountering Shyvana much more reasonable.

And given that the forest was a border area with people not visiting frequently it makes sense for Shyv to hide there, which makes her finding him due to the smell of blood a almost given conclusion...... i mean he just barged through bleeding so a dragons nose wouldnt miss that.

Then because she is the abused loner she is its no wonder she decides to be nice, and we already saw that the border villages dont follow the "no magic" thing as much so its not strange once again for them to welcome her when she comes carrying a passed out and wounded soldier of theirs.

And given that she was a loner who never had friends is not strange to long for it once she saw how the villages stuck together and even helped Jarvan out despite him not being a direct part of their community.

Then the entire dragon attack thing before jarvan taking her back to the capital, a bit more iffy but given that he is the crown prince and the only royal child and Shyvana is his savior its not too odd for the nobility to be unable to say or do anything about her given her merits which makes her joining Demacia work much better.

All this until now fixed so, so, so many plotholes and its great.

And you seem to have misunderstood, its not j4´s blood that was used to reanimate Sion.

Its the blood of his killer, j1, apparently Noxus got his corpse.

GreenLore2/6/2019, 10:52:08 AM6 votes

Overall I think this might have been done to make the noxians less "incompetent" looking.

I mean J4 is pretty much the most valuable hostage they could ever have,yet they failed to bring him into safety and let him escape.

Sure this was due to Garen attacking the camp,but how did Garen even know where J4 was located and how did he get there in time?

It honestly feels a bit too conventient how things played out for J4 in this case.

Whyte Lyon2/6/2019, 8:48:12 AM3 votes

I ask because I feel Jarvan's character is somewhat diminished with this new lore, his friendships with Shyvana and Garen feel weaker as less time is offered to them, and he seems to get off easy with a weaker consequence compared to his other lore, as well as his lore not actually needing these changes evident in that the overall plot remains the same despite being fully rewritten.

"A bio should be informative, like a characterful encyclopedia of that champion to help onboard people. They should not be stories, and anything that could be told in a story, should be" - SCATHLOCKE

Entire established plot points, character background and development are not being removed without the strict condition that there was a new development that completely contradicts them. Eg. Ryze was originally witness to Icathia's destruction, which was a contradictory thing now removed.

If you think something in the bio did change, and that something has been lost. Simply understand that this is a misplaced, almost irrational anxiety. It is not removed from the character's background, but the details presented were just tweaked to focus the biography on what elements are the utmost relevant.

Wild Geese2/6/2019, 1:16:12 PM2 votes

Because they want Demacia to be the bad guys now, so all Demacians must not have any sympathetic qualities.

ForgottenLuck2/6/2019, 9:43:17 AM2 votes

Gonna need to disagree with you personally feel it makes him more fleshed out and relay a bit less on the Shyvannas story making both their own character

NotaRobot10062/6/2019, 3:42:07 PM2 votes

I'm also kind of sad they killed off his mom. League's already got plenty of dead parents, we don't need another one.

Metallikaiser2/6/2019, 3:17:32 PM1 votes

I like the change, because the Noxians not just killing him, the only future of their hated rival just felt stupid. Contrived in a way reminding of some bond villain lecturing instead of just completing their plan.

ModCaptainMårvelous2/7/2019, 9:32:54 AM1 votes

Not RIot but I have ideas on this.

If you have extra time and patience, I am interested to know a) if Demacia's king is still elected by a council like said in Jarvan's old lore as it is no longer present and b) how Shyvana has gone from having to keep her identity quiet to every noble in the Demacian court knowing she is a dragon as that is rather interesting considering Demacia's position on magic.

For A, I do believe the council/election is still a thing. However, the Lightshield family has done such a good job that they're constantly re-elected. Hence why J3 is probably grooming him so well: Because there's a good chance he has to live up to his father. It also explains why he's so fervent in having J4 study. He wants J4 to be a worthy successor and improvement, just as J2 was for him. This is more conjecture but it does make sense.

For B, while Shyvana is half-dragon, Sylas's lore points out that rule-bending is widely accepted by the Demacia elite. I'd also haphazard a guess that trying to call out people for having magic is a good way to get the skeletons in your closet dragged the fuck out into the streets. For the Sylas lore snippit:

He could sense glimmers of hidden power even among the wealthy and prominent… some of whom were the most outspoken decriers of mages. But while the poor were punished for their afflictions, the elite seemed above the law, and this hypocrisy planted the first seeds of doubt in Sylas’ mind.

The alternative theory is that while Shyvana is half-dragon, it's seen less as "She's magic" and more so that she's a descendant of a dragon. It's not technically "magic" but rather her genetics/half-dragon lineage that give her the powers. Of course, this raises the different problem of "is it really safe to bring a half dragon to court?"

Warlord Rhinark2/6/2019, 2:14:05 PM1 votes

The problem witth Jarvan's lore happened when they reworked Urgot.

Without him being the reason why Jarvan was captured, the whole thing just falls apart.