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Is there any chance of any Evil Demacians? Lucian and Vayne don't really count.

darkdill·8/27/2016, 12:27:21 AM·18 votes·2,766 views

Lucian might be a "Knight in Sour Armor", but he's still a Purifier and definitely one of the good guys. He's just always emo because of what Thresh did to Senna.

As for Vayne, she doesn't go around killing just ANYONE, but only necromancers, dark wizards, and dark monsters. In some ways, she's like a Viz-Jaq'taar (a mage slayer assassin) from the Diablo series, and like Batman or Huntress in more obvious ways. But that doesn't make her EVIL; she's more an anti-hero.

But so far Demacia has no villainous characters in its roster. Before you say that it's laws would make such a thing impossible, keep this in mind: in a medieval society like Demacia, the laws would benefit whoever holds the best cards.

To give an analogy, in Tales of Vesperia, Magistrate Ragou is guilty of committing some absolutely atrocious acts (such as feeding villagers who can't pay taxes to monsters for his entertainment), but due to his political influence the kingdom's laws can't touch him. He meets his end when protagonist Yuri Lowell murders him in cold blood (an act that makes you love Yuri even more because he doesn't give a damn about the consequences; he just wanted that scumbag Ragou to get what was coming to him).

Now what about having a Demacian noble who is somewhat similar to Ragou? Namely, a Demacian noble who has a LOT of political influence such that the kingdom's laws can't really touch him. I think that'd be an awesome addition to the story, though whether it'd be worthy of another Champion is up to debate.

(I accidentally put this first in Gameplay. Remade topic in correct section.)

38 Comments

Beyond Legends8/27/2016, 12:28:23 AM16 votes

Garen is pretty evil he chopped Urgot in half.

#urgotlifematter

Bârd8/27/2016, 8:43:52 AM11 votes

The most evil demacians are the leadership of the state; Jarvan III and the Council.

Whether the evil lies on one party, the other, or both, they have worked to do some pretty dishonorable things.

  1. Enforcing a 0 tolerance honor code, with death being your first warning in some cases.
  2. Forcing Fiora to kill her own father in accordance with said honor code.
  3. Forcing Lux to become a child soldier, dragging her from her home and giving her some pretty severe PTSD.
  4. Refusing Freljordian refugees at their borders, leaving them to die.
  5. Supressing the advancement of knowledge; in order to perform any scientific experiments, you must first get it approved by the council.
  6. Honoring Noble houses, while looking down on "mere peasants".
Evewynn8/27/2016, 3:53:16 AM8 votes

I think this would be an interesting concept to delve into. Also a good noxian. I'm not sure if riven counts.

Ebonmaw Dragon8/27/2016, 12:52:52 AM8 votes

Jarvan is super evil dude, he HUNTS and kill INNOCENT dragons for FUN and he wears their CORPSES as armor.

http://i.imgur.com/fYepn4h.jpg ** STOP THE DRAGON GENOCIDE**

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RybNI0KB1bg

Won't somebody please think of the children?

https://scontent.cdninstagram.com/t51.2885-15/s320x320/e35/12362275_642530595849453_1672271867_n.jpg

All those poor baby dragons without family thanks to the TYRANY of the EVIL DEMACIAN PRINCE.

PS: Vayne is Evil as well.

bill848/27/2016, 3:11:34 AM5 votes

already done. Galio is secretly evil, just nobody knows since they never pay attention to him.

LordHippoman8/29/2016, 8:41:29 PM2 votes

There's an issue that Riot has admitted to a ton, that Demacia/Noxus is supposed to be this "morally grey" thing, but Demacia's flaws have super rarely, if ever, been canonically acknowledged, and "Noxians did a horrible thing to me" is the backstory of like 20 champs.

Demacia's bad thing is supposed to be that they're classic Medieval society, with all the shitty side effects of that. Totalitarian rule, racism, sexism, etc. But we...never really see that. Jarvan has never been depicted doing anything really bad. The "totalitarian" laws totally accepted Sivir, a former Noxian mercenary, into their city (This is pre-retcon I'm citing), and basically just gave her a slap on the wrist when she got drunk and went on a joyride around the city. (JoJ) They're openly accepting of other races, with Poppy being a major ambassador (Again, old lore for this part) and they have several high ranking male and female champions.

Really the only negative aspect of Demacia we saw in the old lore was in Lux's Judgement, where they've sorta got this whole shady brainwashing thing going on, which is pretty terrible! But it just...never gets mentioned again.

Noxus' good side was meant to be that they were founded on this idea of strength allowing you to rise above if you worked hard enough, but Quinn is a random farm girl in Demacia who managed to do exactly that. Meanwhile Noxus also has the gladitorial slave pits, the chemical weapons, the random invasion of Ionia because "lol why not", the slaughter of Freljordian barbarians for kicks, the genocide of the Minotaurs, sensationalized public executions (Draven ) and THEY LIVE ON A GIANT SKULL MOUNTAIN.

With the new lore, it seems like they're trying to give Demacia a more blatant dark side.

Fiora's lore is pretty much all about sexism running rampant in the city-state, and turns her dad from a cheating asshole into a tragic sacrifice who got screwed over by House Crownguard. I don't think the sexism bit lands well, though, considering that there are a load of Demacian lady champions who seem to command a lot of respect, so it's a bit of a contradiction.

I think Taric's update is a little better about it, mentioning that his love for nature, art, and other precious non-Demacian things is a "potentially treasonous philosophy", which I think ties way better into what was implied with Lux's Judgement: Demacia is brainwashy as all hell. I think that's a good angle to push on if you want to make Demacia a bit more shady.

To actually get to the point of the whole topic, because of that, I'd be interested in seeing a villainous Demacian champion who was one of the people in charge of the military indoctrination. Like, go for the whole shady inquisitor meets drill instructor vibe. These people basically have the job of molding children into killers for the crown, I think that would be a really interesting direction to go. Of course, yeah, corrupt official could work well too, but I think the issue with a Ragou type character is that they don't really fight, and you kinda need that to be a champ. You could always add in some magic skills or something like that, though, maybe go for a WoW Archbishop Benedictus "corrupted clergyman" kind of deal.

Tl;Dr: There aren't really any outright villainous Demacians, because the whole Demacia/Noxus conflict is sorta still in the process of being redone, but there are a LOT of interesting angles for one.

Oakleaf Ranger8/27/2016, 4:04:58 AM2 votes

Are you kidding, Every Demacian is pure scum. Noxus is where it's at

DemiMax9/3/2016, 11:25:41 PM1 votes

Lucian and Vayne aren't even evil, they hunt and kill it. Are they goody two shoes? No. But are they evil? Also no.

If you think about it Garen isn't that much of a good guy, he sentenced is long time friend (Taric ) to "endure 'the Crown of Stone'", which is basically a disguised Death Sentence. All that because they had different ideals and Taric didn't find much interest in mindlessly fighting for crown. Imagine your best friend kicking you down a well to starve because you said you prefer you Mayo over Ketchup. So yeah Garen is pretty much quite the d*ck all he can seem to do is shout his own name and Demacia, oh and Justice too.

shockprimex1/14/2019, 4:53:51 PM1 votes

Yes. his name is Sylas

ModJikker1/14/2019, 11:38:49 PM1 votes

Please don't necro threads. It's pretty clear that this thread was created before Sylas was even heard of by the community so bumping it now isn't really helpful and can only confuse others. I'm going to lock this thread up as a result.

Let's make a new thread if we want to discuss Sylas' motives and "evil" Demacians.

[poppy-wink]

GULAG 4 U8/27/2016, 9:22:59 AM1 votes

Lucian is a demacian??

GreenLore8/27/2016, 11:38:48 AM1 votes

I doubt that any of the nobles is really safe from the law. I mean Fioras father was a pretty high ranking noble and he got almost his whole family exiled because he tried to cheat in a duel.

However they could introduce a noble who simply knows how to get around the law.

Kotex8/27/2016, 12:22:43 PM1 votes

Yea after Ekko was made for the sole purpose of having a heroic contrast to all the villains of Zaun i'd think Riot would try to work that angle more often. Even though ZAC was the original good guy from Zaun.

Demacia and Piltover have no villainous champions and the Void has no heroic champions--maybe if Kassadin counts. Personally i think Riven qualifies as a "good guy" from noxus; she adheres the the teachings of strength, without being a devious asshole about it. I think it would be safe to call her Neutral Good at least. Would like to see more karmic diversity to break up the typical alignments given to certain factions.

Mimaropa8/27/2016, 8:40:42 PM1 votes

Nobody mentions fiora Fiora ?

Chromatic Eagle8/27/2016, 11:15:07 PM1 votes

It's hard to see a noble with borderline political immunity considering how disgraced Fiora's family became.

I think a general could be cool. How often we get one of those?

I still think Shaco should be a Demacian serial killer.

Decrit8/28/2016, 6:04:59 PM1 votes

Fiora is evil to me, because she cares only for herself and her image. There is a reason and a context on what she does, of course, but she choose her own path from the many choices she could have done. She follows Demacian rules but she also stretches them to wathever she feels good for her.

Obviously it does not sound "child murderer evil" but that' s also what is good about it after all.