Quinn rework concept

Caseo·Sep 17, 2014·4 votes·1,233 views

I'm a big fan of Quinn's design, both character-wise and kit-wise, but I've long felt that she has a few issues that need to be ironed out in order to make her effective as a marksman. I apologize in advance to anyone who is looking for Quinn to be retooled as an assassin; my goal here is to better allow Quinn's passive and ult to consistently and effectively serve her as a Marksman, while making a minimum of large-scale changes to her kit.

The changes are as follows:

Passive - Quinn's passive no longer applies randomly, but is applied by her abilities. The mark is no longer consumed on hit; however, hits against marked targets do less bonus damage, the mark has shorter duration and can only be applied to champions. It will still reveal affected targets.

Q - No longer blinds, but instead applies Quinn's passive to all champions it hits.

W - Passive buff for hitting marked targets gives a smaller AS/MS buff that stacks up (like Jinx's minigun stacks).

E - Same as before.

R - This is the most significant change. Quinn no is no longer replaced by Valor, but calls Valor to the battlefield as a Tibbers-like pet unit. Valor's health, armor, and magic resistance are flat values that scale with Quinn's ult level. Valor's Attack damage is equal to a percentage of Quinn's own AD. The percentage increases with ult level. Valor's attack speed and movement speed are high flat values that don't increase with ult level. While Valor is on the field, Quinn's Q is used to direct his movement and attacks. Valor's basic attacks apply her passive to champions. Valor will functionally be an antithesis to Tibbers - fast and with strong basic attacks, but fragile. His leash range will be relatively long (he can roam further than Tibbers, but can't teleport and must roam back to Quinn if he gets out of her range). Quinn can activate her ult again while Valor is still active in order to despawn him (after a short channel) and jump to his location, performing the Skystrike execute that currently concludes her ult.

6 Comments

PharrøwSep 18, 20142 votes

Sorry, but this seems horrible. Quinn is in a good spot, she just doesn't fit the meta. She has insane damage and dueling capability over most ADCs and can change to a hyperfast assassin (like a Talon for autoattackers instead of casters) to finish people, pick them or escape.

I love playing her right now, and I personally think she's fine.

CaseoSep 18, 20141 votes

I'd appreciate it if you'd offer the reasoning behind your positions. Quinn is not in a good spot; even with the meta favoring ranged tops, Quinn is considered a weak pick, particularly because she is designed to be a fragile marksman, not a bruiser like Gnar.

She has "insane" damage, I agree, but her control over how much damage she can deal at any given point is nonexistent. The unreliable nature of her passive and its importance within her rotation means that at any given time Quinn may find herself crippled for reasons outside her control. (I am aware there are ways to influence the targeting of her passive, but not only is this a huge and unnecessary Burden of Knowledge for new players, it's still unreliable due to glitches and eccentricities of programming)

The above proposed kit would not remove her mobility or her ability to assassinate - if anything, it would enhance these things while offering Quinn more safety (in having Valor as a separate unit) and more counterplay (in allowing Valor to be targeted)

It's great that you love playing her and think she's fine. If you actually consider the kit concept, however, you'll find that the gameplay will end up being largely the same - the only major change you'd see is consistency and reliability.

ModWulf HelhammerSep 23, 20142 votes

a huge and unnecessary Burden of Knowledge for new players

There's this thing called a skill rating for a reason. Quinn is ranked has a rating of 7, tied with Vanye, and outclassed by only 5 other ranged ADCs: Lucian, Kog'ma, Draven(mostly because of his axes, I believe), Ezreal, and Twitch. A skilled Quinn player is able to monitor when Harrier is on cooldown and when it is good to go for an engagement, even set it up that it will trigger on the enemy champ next.

ModWulf HelhammerSep 23, 20141 votes

The Harrier Mark (along with her E) is, imo, the strongest part of her kit. Changing it from what it is to what you're suggesting (which is kinda confusing the more I look at it. Do marked targets do less damage to her, or she to them?) eliminates her best aspect. Additionally, the blind is what defines her as a duelist. She is made to be able to take on pretty much any ADC 1v1 and beat them, because she can cancel out the enemies staring attacks.

Valor as a pet is also not a good idea. Quinn's ult is made to be a high risk, high reward type of skill. The AS and MS buffs you get are insane, and add to that an AOE execute skill.... If this was just a pet that you could send out, it would take away the risk. I certainly wouldn't care if a spell generated pet died, but I do care if I die. I know you specified that there would still be the execute, where Quinn would just jump down wherever Valor was currently, but then you still have everything to escape with: flash, heal, Vault, etc. There is minimal to no risk at all for this skill, and it still is insanely powerful; it would get Quinn nerfed faster than a fed, full-build Hecarim with ghost.

I think what Quinn needs to mark her out as a real ranged ADC is a slight range buff to 550, same as Vayne, the other master duelist ADC. This buff would probably take her out of the top lane a bit, so those people will stop complaining, and would cement her as THE best dueling ADC in the game.

ShrîkeOct 7, 20141 votes

No, just no.

akamrbooneOct 7, 20141 votes

I am also a huge fan of Quinn, I love playing her top lane and basically getting a free laning phase. :3

However I am kind of confused by this rework. Both Quinn's Passive and her W passive would be nerfed, so where is she making up that lost damage? Would the ramping attack speed from consecutive hits be worth the damage loss? To the point that Atk Speed items would be less valuable to her? It seems like a hard nerf to her passive>aa>E>aa combo that lets her practically auto-win trades.

Also I don't quite understand the reworked ult. Will valor become some kind of super beefy front line fighter? or some kind of melee assassin/anti-carry? Will you control and attack with both of them at once?