[Rework Concept] Taliyah, the Stone Weaver

SSmotzer··1 votes·2,081 views

https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/leagueoflegends/images/e/e7/Taliyah_Promo.jpg

Passive - Land Surfing: Taliyah gains bonus movement speed when near terrain or while on Worked Ground. Taliyah can also surf over small pieces of Terrain.

  • Throwing Stones: When Taliyah lands a critical basic attack on an enemy champion, she causes a rock to appear where they were standing, which lingers for 4 seconds before exploding, dealing a small amount of magic damage to enemies. If an enemy dashes over the rock, it erupts, interrupting their movement and dealing bonus magic damage.

Q - Skipping Rocks - First Cast: Taliyah throws a rock in a target direction, dealing magic damage in a line. Any rocks on Worked Ground will also be flung in the target direction, dealing reduced damage.

  • Second Cast: If Taliyah has at least 50% Crit Chance she can fling all of the rocks on Worked Ground in a target direction, dealing magic damage in a line. With reduced mana cost.

  • Third Cast: If Taliyah has 100% Crit Chance she can again fling all of the rocks on Worked Ground in a target direction, dealing magic damage in a line, at no mana cost.

W - Seismic Shove: Taliyah marks the target location and selects a direction. After 1 second, the ground erupts, dealing magic damage to all enemies hit and knocking them in the chosen direction for 1 second.

  • Rock and Roll: If Seismic Shove is casts on a Rock, it will greatly increase in size, be knocked in the target direction and explode, dealing magic damage and knocking up enemies where it lands.

E - Unraveled Earth: Taliyah shifts the ground around her and lifts the earth in a cone, slowing all enemies and dealing a small amount of magic damage to enemies in the cone. Enemies who dash over or are knocked through Unraveled Earth's area of effect cause their movement to be interrupted and dealt bonus magic damage.

Casting this ability causes Taliyah to create an area of Worked Ground around Taliyah that lasts 120 seconds.

R - Weaver's Wall: Taliyah channels for 1 second before summoning a massive wall of spiraling rock that tears through the battlefield in the target direction, creating impassable terrain for 5 seconds and knocking aside allied and enemy champions it passes through as it emerges.

Taliyah can reactivate Weaver's Wall while channeling to ride atop the wall at 1500 speed as it emerges. Taking damage or inputting a movement command in any direction will force her off the wall, which will continue along its path normally.

Reactivating Weaver's Wall again destroys the wall instantly.

37 Comments

Arakadia2 votes

Your reasoning for applying crit to her kit is to make a crit mage. I have a few problems with that.

The first revolves around what you change her scalings to. If she is still an AP champion, then there is no way she would build crit. If you change her scalings into AD then she literally just becomes a weird utility marksmen. If you want her to be a crit AP mage, you need to give her ways to access crit/use crit more effectively.

Additionally, if you got her to build crit, she has no access to a large part of her kit until she gets crit. And even then, she has to hope and pray to RNG that she can spawn some rocks. If so much of her Q and W power is put into rocks, then her kit suddenly becomes significantly more RNG.

The other issue I have for making Taliyah a crit based mage is that it seems too forced. It doesn't push her gameplay to better fulfill her thematics. It doesn't fix gameplay issues.

All it does in fact is just change her role significantly.

If Taliyah was going to get a significant rework I would prefer it be to push her as a rock mage, maybe influencing or manipulating terrain to some extent. You do this a little bit by having her summon rocks, but her being crit oriented doesn't make much sense for her.

Finally I assume that her Q still creates worked ground? It seems odd you remove the unique 5 shot mechanic. Also I suggest changing the W's effect on rocks. Chances are that if you can crit>W they will have walked away from the rock by then. Unless the rocks are really big when summoned.

Anyways thats all I've got today.

BeatzBoyFTW2 votes

Again with the way-off "rework" changes?

SSmotzer1 votes

{quoted}

Again with the way-off "rework" changes?

Way-off? The only real differences is her Q and her passive.

BeatzBoyFTW1 votes

{quoted}

Way-off? The only real differences is her Q and her passive.

Making her build from pure AP-mage champion to Crits? Really?

SSmotzer1 votes

{quoted}

Making her build from pure AP-mage champion to Crits? Really?

She doesn't have to. She can still build ap and only throw a single really powerful rock around, instead of throwing several weaker rocks all over the place.

Chembaron Yamada1 votes

Why would you want to shift Taliyah, who always has been a classic AP mage, into a crit oriented build? This seems extremely weird and you don't mention any changes to scaling, so she still scales with AP and therefore she will always miss out parts of her kit for either missing the AP to increase the damage or missing the crit to utilise the kit perfectly?

SSmotzer1 votes

Well, it will still be all ap, but it will give players the choice between only throwing a few rocks really hard, or pelting a ton of rocks all over the place.

Besides, there are a couple of ap attack speed items, so she won't be wasting any stats in that department. It's not like any of the crit chance items actually come with attack damage, besides Stormrazor, so I'm not looking to make her ad, just more attack speed focused. Much like Azir.

Get Ogre Here1 votes

You have to build crit on a mage...? That doesn't work. It seems like you're trying to fix something that isn't broken. If you just tag on little new things to Taliyah's already existing abilities that'll just make her a Ryze 3.0 (because Azir exists) and we know how that goes.

SSmotzer1 votes

Well, Riot is looking to rework Taliyah, so I just thought I'd try to squeeze in the crit mage they always wanted to make.

Besides, why won't it work? Azir builds attack speed and he is still a mage, but Taliyah would be able to make use of the crit chance most attack speed items comes with.

It also doesn't stop players from building all ap and just throwing less rock much harder.

Chembaron Yamada3 votes

Source for the confirmed rework?

SSmotzer1 votes

{quoted}

Source for the confirmed rework?

If you've played her recently you'd get a pop up asking your feedback on Taliyah as a champion, and what you like best about her, her lore, her design, her gameplay, etc.

Plus with her recently popping back into the meta in a big way as a burst assassin jungler made Riot go OH NO! and she still is stupid strong in the early game and falls off hard in the late game, plus she suffers in every aspect in lane since they nerfed her.

Plus plus, Riot has said they are looking into her.

David 7771 votes

{quoted}

Well, Riot is looking to rework Taliyah, so I just thought I'd try to squeeze in the crit mage they always wanted to make.

Besides, why won't it work? Azir builds attack speed and he is still a mage, but Taliyah would be able to make use of the crit chance most attack speed items comes with.

It also doesn't stop players from building all ap and just throwing less rock much harder.

Crit does not affect on-hit effects, so it's a pretty wasted stat unless you go AD

SSmotzer1 votes

[{quoted}](name=David 777,realm=EUW,application-id=A8FQeEA8,discussion-id=ioovAkil,comment-id=000100000001,timestamp=2018-09-05T23:49:25.598+0000)

Crit does not affect on-hit effects, so it's a pretty wasted stat unless you go AD

....What?

How is it wasted? The more crit items she has the exponentially more rocks she would have, which would scale with ap.

item 3087 item 3115 item 3020 item 3046 item 3027 item 3165

That right there, that is a scary lookin' build; health, ability power, damage resist, magic damage on her autos.

David 7773 votes

{quoted}

....What?

How is it wasted? The more crit items she has the exponentially more rocks she would have, which would scale with ap.

item 3087 item 3115 item 3020 item 3046 item 3027 item 3165

That right there, that is a scary lookin' build; health, ability power, damage resist, magic damage on her autos.

260AP, 54 magic damage on hit from Nashor's Tooth. It might look scary but whatever damage you deal, half will come from base damages. And you are only reaching 60% crit chance here, btw.

SSmotzer1 votes

[{quoted}](name=David 777,realm=EUW,application-id=A8FQeEA8,discussion-id=ioovAkil,comment-id=00010000000100000000,timestamp=2018-09-06T09:44:46.633+0000)

260AP, 54 magic damage on hit from Nashor's Tooth. It might look scary but whatever damage you deal, half will come from base damages. And you are only reaching 60% crit chance here, btw.

Well, you probably don't even need 100% crit chance, as throwing around rocks and keeping them on worked ground is a tricky thing to juggle.

David 7771 votes

{quoted}

Well, you probably don't even need 100% crit chance, as throwing around rocks and keeping them on worked ground is a tricky thing to juggle.

Yeah, the build you suggested gives that along some nice AS + 60% crit. But that'd mean that, with a nearly full offensive build you'd deal average 182 physical and 54 magical damage per AA, at around 1.6 AA per second, dealing a mixed 377 damage per second.

Unless her skills were to scale with AD, where it'd make sense to build a pure ADC build on her, the right amount for crit for her would still be ZERO.

At any rate, why did you ever consider giving her crit scalings?

SSmotzer1 votes

[{quoted}](name=David 777,realm=EUW,application-id=A8FQeEA8,discussion-id=ioovAkil,comment-id=0001000000010000000000000000,timestamp=2018-09-06T14:42:32.369+0000)

Yeah, the build you suggested gives that along some nice AS + 60% crit. But that'd mean that, with a nearly full offensive build you'd deal average 182 physical and 54 magical damage per AA, at around 1.6 AA per second, dealing a mixed 377 damage per second.

Unless her skills were to scale with AD, where it'd make sense to build a pure ADC build on her, the right amount for crit for her would still be ZERO.

Why would her skills need to scale with ad? None of the crit items even come with ad, and when she crits she drops a projectile her Q or W could throw to deal magic damage.

At any rate, why did you ever consider giving her crit scalings?

Because it would be interesting. I thought, what else could crits do for a champion? Besides Riot has said they are working on introducing crits for mages, and I figured why not try something more than just an item that allows abilities to crit.

Plus with Riot wanting to rework Taliyah, I thought it would be a good opportunity to collaborate the ideas.

Warlord Rhinark2 votes

{quoted}

....What?

How is it wasted? The more crit items she has the exponentially more rocks she would have, which would scale with ap.

item 3087 item 3115 item 3020 item 3046 item 3027 item 3165

That right there, that is a scary lookin' build; health, ability power, damage resist, magic damage on her autos.

This is a laughable build and if you tried this on a Mage right now, people will call for reports the moment they see a Brawler's Glove in your build path.

SSmotzer1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Warlord Rhinark,realm=EUW,application-id=A8FQeEA8,discussion-id=ioovAkil,comment-id=00010000000100000001,timestamp=2018-09-06T10:19:36.606+0000)

This is a laughable build and if you tried this on a Mage right now, people will call for reports the moment they see a Brawler's Glove in your build path.

Why would you start brawler gloves? They are still a mage, they would start ring, then build into rod, as mages tend to do.

Also, plenty of off meta champions can built crit and attack speed and still be viable. Thresh, Sona, Ahri, Bard, etc.

I don't see why actually giving a mage the ability to scale with crit chance is inherently a bad thing.

Warlord Rhinark1 votes

{quoted}

Why would you start brawler gloves? They are still a mage, they would start ring, then build into rod, as mages tend to do.

I did not suggest buying Brawler's Gloves as a starting item.

Also, plenty of off meta champions can built crit and attack speed and still be viable. Thresh, Sona, Ahri, Bard, etc.

Yeah but they don't build crit AND Mage items at the same time. It's one or the other.

Also, Sona doesn't build crit items. Only the others do, and the Ahri players aren't even trying to win.

I don't see why actually giving a mage the ability to scale with crit chance is inherently a bad thing.

The same reason why Assassins don't scale with Armor and Magic Resistance.

It doesn't make sense.

SSmotzer1 votes

The same reason why Assassins don't scale with Armor and Magic Resistance.

It doesn't make sense.

But what if a champion is designed around it?

Like a champion who can turn his armor into their strength. Imagine an imprisoned champion who mainly scales with armor, but their ult allows them to break the chains, and converting their armor into a huge burst of damage.

A mage doesn't build attack speed unless they are designed to build attack speed right? Attack speed on Veigar is pointless, but attack speed on Azir is important. That is what I am trying to get at.

Warlord Rhinark2 votes

{quoted}

But what if a champion is designed around it?

It'll become a huge balance issue and would do more bad than good.

Like a champion who can turn his armor into their strength. Imagine an imprisoned champion who mainly scales with armor, but their ult allows them to break the chains, and converting their armor into a huge burst of damage.

This doesn't sound like an Assassin to me.

A mage doesn't build attack speed unless they are designed to build attack speed right? Attack speed on Veigar is pointless, but attack speed on Azir is important. That is what I am trying to get at.

And what you're trying to get at is pointless.

Attack Speed on someone like Azir is only possible because of specific items like Nashor's Tooth that gives both Ability Power. and Attack Speed in one item.

But there doesn't currently exist a Crit item that also gives Ability Power.

And there wouldn't need to, because crit doesn't even have anything to do with magic damage to begin with. It's meant for amplifying the physical damage of your basic attacks.

SSmotzer1 votes

But there doesn't currently exist a Crit item that also gives Ability Power.

But there doesn't currently exist a Crit item that also gives Attack Damage.

And there wouldn't need to, because crit doesn't even have anything to do with magic damage to begin with. It's meant for amplifying the physical damage of your basic attacks.

But what if a champion was designed to amplifying their magic damage from basic attacks?

Warlord Rhinark1 votes

{quoted}

But there doesn't currently exist a Crit item that also gives Attack Damage.

False.

item 3031

But what if a champion was designed to amplifying their magic damage from basic attacks?

Sounds too gimmicky and, again, cause for several balance issues.

Also, critical strikes are supposed to represent great precision in an attack, and I don't see Taliyah as a honed type of person.

SSmotzer1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Warlord Rhinark,realm=EUW,application-id=A8FQeEA8,discussion-id=ioovAkil,comment-id=00010000000100000001000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-09-06T15:41:05.712+0000)

False.

item 3031

That item does not give a single % of crit chance.

Sounds too gimmicky and, again, cause for several balance issues.

Gimmicky? Too gimmicky for LoL? Are we playing the same game? Every champion is gimmicky and full of balance issues...

Also, critical strikes are supposed to represent great precision in an attack, and I don't see Taliyah as a honed type of person.

You mean the elegant dancer who was trained by Yasuo and weaves the earth like a needle and thread? She doesn't seem like the type to hone her skills? Really?

Warlord Rhinark1 votes

{quoted}

That item does not give a single % of crit chance.

That doesn't mean it's not a crit item.

And yes, it does, technically, it just needs some critical strike chance to be there first.

Gimmicky? Too gimmicky for LoL? Are we playing the same game? Every champion is gimmicky and full of balance issues...

This is a whole other story.

I never said I was contempt with other champions.

You mean the elegant dancer who was trained by Yasuo and weaves the earth like a needle and thread? She doesn't seem like the type to hone her skills? Really?

This sounds like wishful thinking.

"Taliyah is a nomadic mage from Shurima, torn between teenage wonder and adult responsibility."

She seems like a carefree person, not one that takes time to analyse the situation and aim her attacks.

SSmotzer1 votes

This sounds like wishful thinking.

"Taliyah is a nomadic mage from Shurima, torn between teenage wonder and adult responsibility."

She seems like a carefree person, not one that takes time to analyse the situation and aim her attacks.

"She trained with himYasuo for a time and began to find the control she had long sought."

Taliyah is not a brute. She is careful of her steps, she is a trained dancer after all, and she is always seeking improvement. First joining the Noxian army, hoping their training would give her the discipline she needs to control her powers. Then when she was thrown at Ionia, she deserted the Noxians and took refuge with Yasuo, who trained her in bushido.

So she is a skilled dancer, a trained soldier, and a budding samurai, did none of these teach her precision? You'd think her teacher, who could slice a strand of hair down the center, long ways, would know a thing or two about precision.

Warlord Rhinark1 votes

{quoted}

"She trained with himYasuo for a time and began to find the control she had long sought."

Taliyah is not a brute. She is careful of her steps, she is a trained dancer after all, and she is always seeking improvement. First joining the Noxian army, hoping their training would give her the discipline she needs to control her powers. Then when she was thrown at Ionia, she deserted the Noxians and took refuge with Yasuo, who trained her in bushido.

So she is a skilled dancer, a trained soldier, and a budding samurai, did none of these teach her precision? You'd think her teacher, who could slice a strand of hair down the center, long ways, would know a thing or two about precision.

Where is it stated that she's a skilled dancer?

Where is it stated that's she's a trained soldier?

Where is it stated samurai even exist in League of Legends, since it's a term from real-life Feudal Japan?

I just don't want a Mage that scales off of critical strike chance.

It's dumb, makes no sense, and only leads to balance issues.

And that's my opinion.

SSmotzer1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Warlord Rhinark,realm=EUW,application-id=A8FQeEA8,discussion-id=ioovAkil,comment-id=00010000000100000001000000000000000000000000000000000001,timestamp=2018-09-06T16:55:06.595+0000)

Where is it stated that she's a skilled dancer?

Where is it stated that's she's a trained soldier?

Her lore?

Where is it stated samurai even exist in League of Legends, since it's a term from real-life Feudal Japan?

They are not exactly called samurai, but their teachings are the same.

I just don't want a Mage that scales off of critical strike chance.

It's dumb, makes no sense, and only leads to balance issues.

And that's my opinion.

An assassin support makes no sense, but we got one.

Warlord Rhinark1 votes

{quoted}

Her lore?

What parts of her lore?

They are not exactly called samurai, but their teachings are the same.

That doesn't mean they're the same thing.

An assassin support makes no sense, but we got one.

And I despise Pyke's existence with every ounce of my being.

SSmotzer1 votes

What parts of her lore?

When she is dancing and while dancing crating murals out of rocks, depicting the history of her tribe. Then she ventured out into the world to learn how to control her powers and came across a Noxian encampment on her way to Targon. She stopped there to rest and displayed her power and stated her quest, so they promised to teach her, and drafted her into their military. She was taken back to Noxus, paraded as a hero and trained before being shipped off to Ionia where she refused to crush an innocent village, so they threw her into the ocean, but she managed to swim to shore. Then she met Yasuo in the mountains who shared her ability to control the elements, and so he trained her in all of the ways of the sword, which is the same teachings as the samurai. Then she felt the desert calling and went back to Shurima to prevent Azir from taking over her nomadic tribe.

That doesn't mean they're the same thing.

A rose by any other name would smell as sweet.

And I despise Pyke's existence with every ounce of my being.

And yet he is still a meta support. Get used to being disappointed my friend, I see bad things in your future.

Warlord Rhinark1 votes

{quoted}

When she is dancing and while dancing crating murals out of rocks, depicting the history of her tribe. Then she ventured out into the world to learn how to control her powers and came across a Noxian encampment on her way to Targon. She stopped there to rest and displayed her power and stated her quest, so they promised to teach her, and drafted her into their military. She was taken back to Noxus, paraded as a hero and trained before being shipped off to Ionia where she refused to crush an innocent village, so they threw her into the ocean, but she managed to swim to shore. Then she met Yasuo in the mountains who shared her ability to control the elements, and so he trained her in all of the ways of the sword, which is the same teachings as the samurai. Then she felt the desert calling and went back to Shurima to prevent Azir from taking over her nomadic tribe.

And no sources on any of these.

And yet he is still a meta support.

He has a below 49% win rate.

"Meta support" my ass.

Get used to being disappointed my friend,

I am.

I see bad things in your future.

How come?

SSmotzer1 votes

And no sources on any of these.

The official website, in her bio.

https://universe.leagueoflegends.com/en_US/story/champion/taliyah/

The wiki says her occupations are Wanderer, Stone Mage, Noxian Apprentice, Shepherd

Her aliases include The Stoneweaver, and Yasuo's Little Sparrow.

You know, it would behoove you to read the lore from time to time, especially if you're gonna call someone out for something that is obviously part of their lore.

He has a below 49% win rate.

"Meta support" my ass.

By that logic Yasuo, Kai'Sa, Akali, Zed, Thresh, and Lucian aren't in the meta. All of them are in the highest play rates of champions, meaning, they are part of the meta, regardless of their win rate.

If what you say is true then Taric is one of the most meta champions, despite Pyke being played over 4 times as much as Taric.

I am.

How come?

You seem to be vehemently opposed to change, but change is coming, and it is inevitable.

_ "I speak of the changes coming. That is our purpose. ...It's a pretty easy job."_ -Zoe

Warlord Rhinark2 votes

{quoted}

The official website, in her bio.

https://universe.leagueoflegends.com/en_US/story/champion/taliyah/

The wiki says her occupations are Wanderer, Stone Mage, Noxian Apprentice, Shepherd

Her aliases include The Stoneweaver, and Yasuo's Little Sparrow.

I don't see "Skilled Dancer" or "Trained Soldier" mentioned anywhere.

You know, it would behoove you to read the lore from time to time, especially if you're gonna call someone out for something that is obviously part of their lore.

And it would behoove you to stop saying something that isn't true, and acting like it is.

By that logic Yasuo, Kai'Sa, Akali, Zed, Thresh, and Lucian aren't in the meta.

They aren't and nobody are saying they are but you.

All of them are in the highest play rates of champions, meaning, they are part of the meta, regardless of their win rate.

If what you say is true then Taric is one of the most meta champions, despite Pyke being played over 4 times as much as Taric.

META literally stands for "Most Effective Tactic Available".

Having a high playrate does not mean it's the most effective tactic, just that it's the tactic that's most commonly used.

Having a high win rate, however, means it's the most effective, which means it's the most meta.

What you're saying is false.

You seem to be vehemently opposed to change, but change is coming, and it is inevitable.

_ "I speak of the changes coming. That is our purpose. ...It's a pretty easy job."_ -Zoe

Whilst you are right in me being opposed to change, I cannot fathom why you think it makes you cool by speaking in quotes.

Because it doesn't.

DearPear1 votes

{quoted}

But what if a champion is designed around it?

That could be a thing. But your attempt at reworking Taliyah is not one of them.

SSmotzer1 votes

{quoted}

That could be a thing. But your attempt at reworking Taliyah is not one of them.

Well she is in need of a rework, I just figured why not try something new?

BLIGHTBRINGER1 votes

Hmm, next Nightblue3 video...

##NEW TALIYAH BROKEN REWORK ENEMY TEAM AFK'D AFTER THIS ONE

Taliyah item 3031 item 3087 item 3094 item 3036 item 3026 item 3006

######JK PLS DON'T HURT ME

More from Concepts & Creations

More by SSmotzer