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Where the Villians at?

Skorch·Sep 12, 2018·8 votes·8,286 views

Is that seriously something we are lacking? (this was gonna be about just female villians but after double checking there are practically no villians at all) There are very few VILLIANS in league, a lot of just moral greyness everyone working for what THEY consider good for other people. Even people like + are really just pissed at noxus and while kind of assholes arent villians. And noxus themselves are being written to be different, but not evil. They do what they consider good for their common man.

I want more TRUE supervillians. And i mean SUPERVILLIANS. sure there are "bad guys" like and but they are only just bad guys, hell even lackeys to Mordekaiser. And a lot of "villains" are just groups, Darkin, Voidlings, Demons.

The only true single villians are the murderers and , , and the black rose. Murderers while solo, are just murderers (dont get me wrong i love jhin), Zyra has got nothing recent in years, all we know of Morde is hes "growing his army" the black rose is barely in the lore at all. Sure we have "the entity" but he's just the boss of league of legends, he'll probably never be a champion or at least for a REALLY long time. Liss got changed.

So I feel like this is a bit nitpicky. But can we get more villain... at least stories? maybe not champions, but more information on what the TRUE villians are up to, other than existing.

Although an entirely new evil female champion would be cool too... something to cover where lissandra was, and someone who ISNT connected to a currently existing faction (darkin, shadow isles, void) someone who acts of their own will.

39 Comments

A Superb VillainSep 12, 201814 votes

#I HAVE BEEN SUMMONED!

reba042Sep 12, 20184 votes

ALL BOW TO OUR LORD

A Superb VillainSep 12, 20183 votes

Nonsense!

I wouldn't demean my adoring public by demanding them to prostrate themselves before me. All that I ask is for you to indulge your vices. Revel in your gluttony, your wrath and lust. Unshackle your pride, your greed, your envy!

OrgrimmenSep 12, 20182 votes

The only deadly sin you forgot was sloth. Why can't I indulge in my desire to sleep all day? I demand equal rights!

reba042Sep 12, 20181 votes

ILL KILL FOR MY LORD!

A Superb VillainSep 12, 20184 votes

Because the conception of sloth as a sin does not align with our modern understanding of the word. We perceive sloth as laziness when it's context as a sin actually means an indifference to the Christian God (the absence of worship).

In this day and age, I hardly need encourage its practice.

OrgrimmenSep 13, 20181 votes

That is true, although this is purely hypothetical, given that you are acting in the role of a 'superb villain', and thus would be perfectly fine with that result.

OleandervineSep 12, 20185 votes

The villains are the Void silly. The way the lore's going, every character we think is a villain will secretly not be a villain because they don't want the Void to win.

SkorchSep 12, 20183 votes

{quoted}

The villains are the Void silly. The way the lore's going, every character we think is a villain will secretly not be a villain because they don't want the Void to win.

Damnit...

OleandervineSep 12, 20181 votes

Yeah I know. One of the bittersweet things about Lissandra was the fact that we knew her unphased loyalty to the Watchers would end in her demise, and it made her a bit tragic, yet a very well developed character.

Then her new bio came. And it's a colossal mess that backtracked on a lot of her villainy.

Somber RitesSep 12, 20184 votes

The "villains" are the void, and Mordekaiser (possibly Veigar )

I think it's good that we don't have too many supervillains running around. Because people aren't like that unless there's something seriously wrong with them.

And while the psycho here and there are neat, too many of them stagnate the whole concept and ruin the whole theme.

People are nothing but large grey areas most the time. And the only time someone is really like, HARD evil is when they've got more than a few screws loose.

As far as I'm concerned, Runeterra's own Sauron, Mordekaiser is plenty villain for me. (and maybe Veigar , lets see how updates change him)

SkorchSep 13, 20182 votes

[{quoted}](name=Somber Rites,realm=NA,application-id=A8FQeEA8,discussion-id=Olvf0EiQ,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2018-09-12T23:57:21.639+0000)

The "villains" are the void, and (possibly )

I think it's good that we don't have too many supervillains running around. Because people aren't like that unless there's something seriously wrong with them.

And while the psycho here and there are neat, too many of them stagnate the whole concept and ruin the whole theme.

People are nothing but large grey areas most the time. And the only time someone is really like, HARD evil is when they've got more than a few screws loose.

As far as I'm concerned, Runeterra's own Sauron, is plenty villain for me. (and maybe , lets see how updates change him)

In veigars lore it states him as still having annoying morals

Somber RitesSep 13, 20181 votes

{quoted}

In veigars lore it states him as still having annoying morals

Hence why I said maybe, we don't know where they'll go with him if his lore is rewritten after a VGU.

Villainous VSep 13, 20184 votes

You called?

Vlada CutSep 13, 20183 votes

Aatrox Ending the world isn't enough for you is it?

ZedUsanGovosSep 13, 20182 votes

A lot of the now Grey Characters (Zed, Xerath, Viktor, etc.) are seeming to abide by the rule

"Just because you are bad guy does not mean you are bad guy."

On the one hand, it feels like Riot is trying to expand their lores and give more depth to why they do what they do (which makes sense for Zed and Viktor), but then they continue going on until they effectively turn the villains into borderline anti-heroes. Zed, for example, was an evil shadow ninja whose law was:

"Embrace the shadows, or DIE in darkness!"

If someone didn't wanna b a shadow boi, they get killed and their shadow got stolen.

But they had very vague stories. Not much was known about them (for better or worse), and when Riot updated them (for better or worse), they decided to give a more human aspect to them (for better or worse). I love anti-heroes as much as the next guy, but Zed went from Ra's Al Ghul crossed with the Arkham Knight (The Demon Knight of Arkham?) to Donald Trump crossed with Red Hood (the Red Wall?). I absolutely love Zed being an anti-hero and sympathetic, but keeping him as a straight villain wouldn't be a crime (no pun intended) either. Like All For One. Yeah he takes in Tomura-- in Zed's case, Kayn-- but he still isn't doing what he does for the sake of protecting his country. He's doing it to destroy Pro Heroes (and groom Tomura as the next All For One). Or so I presume, as I'm not totally caught up with the manga or anime yet.

Zed could have been an All For One-esque character. Someone who is trying to break the Traditionalist beliefs in Ionia, striking from the shadows while grooming Kayn (who now has Rhaast and could potentially become the third-most powerful being in Ionia next to Syndra and Karma) as the next Master of Shadows to take complete control over Ionia, as opposed to a conservative trying to deport the Vastayans and protect Ionia from potential threats.

Moreso than that, it'd also add a bit more impact to Zed's decision to put aside his differences and work with Shen to take down Jhin. It'd show his understanding that Shen deserves as much justice for what happened to them (or his hatred for Jhin) is greater than his ambition for taking over Ionia and decimating the Traditionalist Clans. Because if he's an anti-hero, it's somewhat expected that he'd be willing to put aside differences to fight Jhin. Because Jhin is just another threat to Ionia.

But that's just my two cents on the topic.

Stars ShaperSep 12, 20181 votes

Aatrox Cassiopeia Chogath DrMundo Elise Evelynn Fiddlesticks Gangplank Hecarim Jhin Jinx Karthus Khazix KogMaw Leblanc Lissandra Malzahar Mordekaiser Nocturne Pantheon <----Especially this guy Pyke Renekton Singed Sion TahmKench Thresh Varus Velkoz Viktor Xerath Zoe <--- this little pest.

How many more do you need?

reba042Sep 12, 20181 votes

Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Sona Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo Yasuo

M00ndanc3Sep 12, 20182 votes

[{quoted}](name=Stars Shaper,realm=EUW,application-id=A8FQeEA8,discussion-id=Olvf0EiQ,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-09-12T20:25:04.098+0000)

<----Especially this guy <--- this little pest.

How many more do you need?

Veigar

SkorchSep 13, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Stars Shaper,realm=EUW,application-id=A8FQeEA8,discussion-id=Olvf0EiQ,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-09-12T20:25:04.098+0000)

<----Especially this guy <--- this little pest.

How many more do you need?

I stright forgot xerath and renek, but a lot of those i mentioned somewhere. And it still doesnt change the fact that there are more "good guys" morally in the middle guys, and little story for a lot of the the champions you listed barring a few.

PaperlessKutSep 13, 20181 votes

I don't know about Renekton though... Is he really a villain? I mean he was a Protector of Shurima albeit a blood thirsty one after his Ascension, but Xerath is the one that muddled his mind while he was trapped in the Tomb to become an intense killer. Now Xerath is a pretty evil fucker that is for sure. Killed Azir after he gave up on the whole slave thing and made Renekton hate his own brother with a passion.

Quiet DudeSep 12, 20181 votes

Sona

SS Big DaddySep 12, 20181 votes

Darius Darius Draven Draven Have always been the baddies from that League cinematic when they fight ahri n shit. Chogath cho obvs needs a rework but still

BârdSep 13, 20181 votes

Darius/Draven are just noxians. Noxus is brutal, but they aren't pure evil.

HerlgarSep 12, 20181 votes

Are you just trying to upset Veigar ?

SkorchSep 13, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Are you just trying to upset ?

It states in veigars lore that while he wants to be a villain, he has pesky morals

HerlgarSep 13, 20181 votes

He doesn't want us to know though, which is why he wouldn't like being ignored as a villain

JoeAnarchySep 13, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Are you just trying to upset ?

UPset? is that a short joke?

BârdSep 13, 20181 votes

I don't really think Zyra is evil.

She's pretty much a force of nature.

SkorchSep 13, 20181 votes

{quoted}

I don't really think is evil.

She's pretty much a force of nature.

A FoN thats pissed off.

BârdSep 13, 20181 votes

I mean, kinda?

From her perspective, she's just eating and propagating her species.

She doesn't hate humans, per se, it's just that she doesn't hold them in any higher regard than animals.

Wind234Sep 13, 20181 votes

Now when you say "villain".....in what capacity do you mean? Like, for the entire League universe as a whole? Because if you mean like that, then I think they kinda have the Void for that....

But I have to say, I respectfully disagree with you about a "lack of villains" in League. Some of the champions you mentioned are VERY villainous - just because they may have some sympathetic characteristics doesn't mean they're not villainous, just more complex. If you were to ask Shen or Akali, I'm pretty sure they'd agree Zed is definitely a villain (the man murdered Shen's father and took over their monastery because he thought his own sense of justice was better than everybody else's). And Thresh is for-sure a villain - Lucian's entire story arc is basically a revenge arc aiming to fill him full of holy lead "for Senna!!!" Just because there may be "bigger fish" in the pond, doesn't mean that these guys are less villainous. It depends on the role they're meant to play in their stories.

The very thing you're pointing out is what -makes- a compelling villain - everybody is the protagonist of their own story. Nobody serious is going around thinking "man, I LOVE being evil! How can I be totally villainous today?" We have a character like that in Veigar, and the thing is....he's kinda a parody of that sort of thing. It's clear that NOBODY takes him seriously because he's basically a cartoon supervillain in a world where that sort of thing just isn't realistic. It makes him look crazy and insane and more than a little childish.

Great villains are SUPPOSED to be working towards what they think is good. They're supposed to have a motive and a purpose to their actions aside from "I am super evil, fear me!" When I hear the term "supervillain," I can't help but think of the childishly cartoonish characters from Saturday morning TV shows. If this isn't your intention and I'm misreading you, please feel free to correct me, but I'm of the opinion that villains who land in a darker shade of grey tend to be the most effective at doing their literary job.

However, I will agree with you on two points. One, we definitely need more lore showing League's various baddies actually DOING bad things. We get bios and stories that make them sympathetic, but we also need stories that show us why we don't want these people getting their way. I think the reason why you feel there's a lack of villains isn't because there IS a lack of villains, but because that villainy hasn't been the focus in all the new stories and bios. The second thing I agree with is a lack of independent villains. Most of our cast of baddies are working with some higher force, or are otherwise tethered by something or someone else's will. Granted, this doesn't take away from their villainy in most cases, but it'd be nice having a powerful villainous force that has their own agenda.

SkorchSep 13, 20182 votes

{quoted}

Now when you say "villain".....in what capacity do you mean? Like, for the entire League universe as a whole? Because if you mean like that, then I think they kinda have the Void for that....

But I have to say, I respectfully disagree with you about a "lack of villains" in League. Some of the champions you mentioned are VERY villainous - just because they may have some sympathetic characteristics doesn't mean they're not villainous, just more complex. If you were to ask Shen or Akali, I'm pretty sure they'd agree Zed is definitely a villain (the man murdered Shen's father and took over their monastery because he thought his own sense of justice was better than everybody else's). And Thresh is for-sure a villain - Lucian's entire story arc is basically a revenge arc aiming to fill him full of holy lead "for Senna!!!" Just because there may be "bigger fish" in the pond, doesn't mean that these guys are less villainous. It depends on the role they're meant to play in their stories.

The very thing you're pointing out is what -makes- a compelling villain - everybody is the protagonist of their own story. Nobody serious is going around thinking "man, I LOVE being evil! How can I be totally villainous today?" We have a character like that in Veigar, and the thing is....he's kinda a parody of that sort of thing. It's clear that NOBODY takes him seriously because he's basically a cartoon supervillain in a world where that sort of thing just isn't realistic. It makes him look crazy and insane and more than a little childish.

Great villains are SUPPOSED to be working towards what they think is good. They're supposed to have a motive and a purpose to their actions aside from "I am super evil, fear me!" When I hear the term "supervillain," I can't help but think of the childishly cartoonish characters from Saturday morning TV shows. If this isn't your intention and I'm misreading you, please feel free to correct me, but I'm of the opinion that villains who land in a darker shade of grey tend to be the most effective at doing their literary job.

However, I will agree with you on two points. One, we definitely need more lore showing League's various baddies actually DOING bad things. We get bios and stories that make them sympathetic, but we also need stories that show us why we don't want these people getting their way. I think the reason why you feel there's a lack of villains isn't because there IS a lack of villains, but because that villainy hasn't been the focus in all the new stories and bios. The second thing I agree with is a lack of independent villains. Most of our cast of baddies are working with some higher force, or are otherwise tethered by something or someone else's will. Granted, this doesn't take away from their villainy in most cases, but it'd be nice having a powerful villainous force that has their own agenda.

Your last paragraph is basically it, while there are villainous characters, we never see them because Riot has such a sense of every character needing to be very "grey" when some of the best bad guys in recent literature, are bad for being bad. Sure they are doing what is "good" for them in their eyes, but they also dont hide behind some other point. And yeah I think we need more one off villians, a lot of them are lackeys... all voidlings... all shadow isles (with the exception of the good shadow isles guys and the bossman morde himself.) And more stories please.

ModCaliCoastReplaySep 13, 20181 votes

To Garen everyone's a potential Villain!

...seriously though, Aatrox is a demon nicknamed "World Ender". Swain and Leblanc are serial killers locked in a murder war for control of an amoral military empire. Urgot is a former executioner who now uses his cyborg body as a giant blender for his enemies. Ahri and Evelynn are supernatural creatures who lure men to their deaths for pleasure. Chogath and KogMaw 's food is other champions. is a former criminal possessed by an eternal spirit of burning vengeance. Renekton is an out-of-control ancient god literally powered by anger and determined to slay his brother.

And DrMundo TORTURES PEOPLE TO DEATH BECAUSE HE THINKS HE'S A DOCTOR.

Are you legit worried that Runeterra doesn't have enough bad men and women and evil beings?

reba042Sep 13, 20181 votes

Doesn't Evelynn torture everyone?

PaperlessKutSep 13, 20181 votes

I mean Ahri used to do that stuff, but according to her lore, she now finds it quite heinous to murder innocent people. Plus can you really call "eating" a villainous thing. I mean we eat cows and we don't find it villainous. Hell I would still eat animals even if it was "villainous". And to Renekton's defense, Xerath is the one who put those thoughts into his heads constantly for hundreds of years while being trapped in a tomb. The rest are fair game though in my opinion.

ModCaliCoastReplaySep 13, 20181 votes

To me, a better question is - where are the heroes?

Runeterra has one traditional "good" faction, and that's Demacia. Ionia and Targon align more with isolationism and neutrality than anything. Piltover is a gilded and self-interested technocracy existing parasitically on the wealth of the brual chem-empires of the Zaun undercity. Noxus is a crushingly brutal military dictatorship. Bilgewater is an amoral city of thieves and pirates. The Shadow Isles are a haunted nightmare destroyed by the hubris of the Ruined King. Shurima is a dead empire full of godlike beings with morals and actions unbound by any human social contract. And The Void represents destruction and nihilism as a pure force of the basic fabric of Runeterra's universe. I mean, I guess the yordles and Bandle City are technically "good" but even they represent something more akin to noble-savage nature-spirit innocence than traditional heroic values. (For instance, I get a kick out of Teemo 's lore being full of James Bond-like soul-of-a-killer melancholia because he's the most efficient poisoner and military scout the yordles have ever known.)

Who are the heroes and protagonists of League? JarvanIV Garen Lux ? Seems a little thin. But I like the lore this way. I find Runeterra's descriptions of human nature as expressed in the lore to be realistic - I love the way TahmKench preys on human greed, for instance - and consistent with the concept that no being is entirely pure, and that every creature, human, and empire is characterized by their sins.

KelgSep 13, 20181 votes

Jarvan is an authoritarian facist, just listen to his lines.

JarvanIV "Who dares defy my will?"

Further backed up by Garen 's "Justice, by law or by sword."

[sg-miss-fortune]

FrostfelSep 14, 20181 votes

The only true villains left are getting nerf'd into the ground just like Mordekaiser R.I.P.

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