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Aatrox rework idea, Opinions?

hudzell·12/22/2015, 12:43:33 PM·1 votes·984 views

So I was bored tonight and thought up a rework for Aatrox, since he's very unreliable and not very good right now without Sated Devourer. I'm posting here to maybe have some opinions and help to make it balanced, and the first place I thought of was the boards. Here is what I have now! (And for the love of god, please don't just say "OP"/"Broken"/"Bad"/"Ur mum", actually give me some constructive criticism. Thanks)

Edit#1: Changed passive a little bit, adding 10% max hp scaling on the heal, and re-adding passive atk speed Edit#2: Changed Q, added displacement CC immunity mid-jump, changed knockup to knockback then stun. Added costs to the ability titles. Edit#3: Added TL:DR, made enhanced heal remove grievous wounds. Edit#4: Changed passive a bit again, making maths more clear, and added cooldowns (essential), fixed typing error on first w passive. Edit#5: Re-Did formatting and changed passive Blood Price scaling to 25% AD instead of 100%. Redit#6: Clarified Q and added silence to ultimate. Edit#7: Major ult change. Added what was there before (never meant to remove it) and added some new things. Edit#8: Major reblancing, removed the new things from previous edit, reverted Q back to a 1 - 2 second knockup, removing all that complicated stuff. Nerfed ultimate damage from Broken to Not Broken. Edit#9: Changed ultimate up a bit, reworked E active, made some total AD scaling to bonus AD scaling, removed bonus AD scaling on ultimate and buffed the AP ratio, added scaling to Q (never meant to remove it) and nerfed passive atk speed, and clarified the grievous wounds removal. Blood Price adds 2 stacks of Mortal Wounds instead of 1 Edit#10: Reverted Q to normal and added extra effects to it with Massacre active, clarified Passive.

TL;DR Aatrox is exceptional duelist, being a very good help during teamfights if he gets ahead, and almost guaranteed to win a 1v1 against any champion (unless they kite easily, or have something like a dodge or blind) Aatrox gains power against a champion if he has attacked them 8 or more times, or if he's ulted them and attacked them 4 or more times, as his bonus damage from blood price and heal from blood thirst are enhanced. Aatrox's basic attacks apply a bleed that gets stronger the more he attacks them.

Passive - Blood Well, Static Cooldown: 250/200/150/100

Aatrox stores health used by Blood Price (50% AD) and absorbed from champions by Blood Thirst (25% AD) in his blood well, capping up to 230-1035, depending on level

Aatrox gains 0.25% - 0.6% (based on level) bonus attack speed for every 1% in his Blood Well, up to a maximum of 30% - 55% (based on level) bonus attack speed.

Upon taking fatal damage, Aatrox becomes untargetable and invulnerable, draining all the blood from his blood well, healing him for (10% maximum health)+the current amount of blood stored over 1-4 seconds, depending on how full the well is.

Q - Dark Flight, 10% current health, Cooldown: 18/16/14/12/10, Range: 650 /225/75 After a short delay, Aatrox leaps to target location, dealing (70/115/160/205/250 (+ 60% bonus AD)) physical damage and knocking up enemies in the epicenter for 1 second. Cast range increases to 850 while Massacre is active and scaling is modified to 75% bonus AD.

W - Blood Thirst/Blood Price, Cooldown: 0.2 PASSIVE: Aatrox applies a bonus on-hit effect every third basic attack:

PASSIVE: If the target has maximum Mortal Wounds stacks, Blood Thrist and Blood Price are enhanced.

TOGGLE OFF - BLOOD THIRST: Aatrox heals himself (10/15/20/25/30 (+30% Bonus AD)), the heal is doubled (20/30/40/50/60 (+ 60% Bonus AD)) if Aatrox below 50% maximum health. ENHANCED HEAL: (17/25.5/34/42.5/51 (+51% Bonus AD)) and (34/51/68/85/102 (+102% Bonus AD), removes grievous wounds for the next Blood Thirst.

TOGGLE ON - BLOOD PRICE: Aatrox deals (20/35/50/65/80 (+50% bonus AD)) bonus physical damage and applies an extra stack of Mortal Wounds, but loses (10/17.5/25/32.5/40 (+ 25% bonus AD)) health. ENHANCED BONUS PHYSICAL DAMAGE: 65/80/125/170/215 (+150% bonus AD)

E - Blades of Torment, 5% current health, Cooldown: 10/9/8/7/6, Range: 900 PASSIVE: Aatrox's Basic Attacks, Dark Flight and Massacre apply Mortal Wounds, making the target bleed for (4% AD) physical damage over 4 seconds.

PASSIVE: Basic Attacking a champion with Mortal Wounds enhances the ability up to 8×, altering the bleed damage to (6/8/10/12/14/16% AD) physical damage over 4 seconds.

ACTIVE: Aatrox deals (10/15/20/25/30 +5% AP) magic damage to all nearby enemy units, multiplies damage by the amount of Mortal Wounds stacks the target has, and slows them by 65% for 1/1.25/1.5/1.75/2 seconds. (This ability cannot be cast if there are no enemy units with Mortal Wounds stacks in range)

MAXIMUM MAGIC DAMAGE: (80/120/160/200/240 +50% AP)

R - Massacre, Cooldown: 120/100/80, Range: 550/325 ACTIVE: Aatrox draws in the blood of his foes, silencing for 1 second and dealing (150/250/350 (+85% AP)) magic damage and adds 4 Mortal Wounds stacks to all nearby enemy champions and filling his Blood Well by 20% of its maximum capacity for each champion hit. Aatrox gains 325 bonus attack range and 45/55/65% bonus attack speed. The effects of this ability last 12 seconds and refreshes and reduces the total duration by 2 seconds every auto attack, (no interaction with on-hit items like sated devourer, just every auto attack period.) down to a 4 second duration.

8 Comments

Fortnite Dab xd12/22/2015, 4:33:22 PM2 votes

Now, to be completely honest with you, you are just trying to make your main the strongest champion in the game. No removal of grievous wounds.

ModEchoing12/22/2015, 4:47:17 PM1 votes

OP.

More seriously though, props for recognizing Aatrox is kinda dull, and I like how you've given him a unified theme around inflicting mortal wounds. The actual result, though, just comes off as a bunch of attack speed steroids, especially his Blood Well, which is an innately free 30%-60% just for not dying. It seems more like change for the sake of change rather than innovating Aatrox's kit and bringing something truly new to the table.

A rework implies a significant change in abilities, changing up their functions and their overall usage patterns, such as Ashe's old Q and her new Q. The problem here is that all of these abilities serve the same function as before, except with new stuff added on. That's called a buff, not a rework, and this would propel Aatrox into a ridiculous spot.

Umbral Regent12/23/2015, 3:40:45 AM1 votes

The Q you proposed sounds a bit too much like a cut & paste of Zac's Elastic Slingshot, and on top of that, adding attack speed boosts to his passive is probably not going to help him any.

Beuhlakor12/25/2015, 9:07:07 PM1 votes

Hello.

(WARNING WALL OF TEXT)

Diamond scrub and Aatrox lover here.

I think you have it all wrong about Aatrox. Let me explain.

What you are proposing, while interesting, doesn't solve Aatrox problems at all.

Aatrox is right now average. Not bad, not strong, simply average. Why ?

  1. As long as he has his infinite, strong, sustain, his other abilities (and base stats) will always be average in order to compensate for how strong Blood Thirst is. Also, inifinite strong sustain, without condition, makes him a toxic champion that can be extremely oppressive to face if for whatever reason he is ahead. Yes, you reduced the power of his sustain, but it is not enough. You have to get rid of it completely.

  2. What does Aatrox brings to a team ? Attention, I'm not talking about Aatrox being good in some specific MU. But what does he bring that is different from another Diving Fighter (reminder => for Riot, Diving Fighters are Jax Irelia JarvanIV XinZhao and Aatrox ) ? Right now, nothing. And this is why you only pick one of these champion when one of them is largely superior to the others (Aatrox in S3, Irelia and Xin in S4, Irelia in S5, Jax in S6 now but you only pick them for their RAW power because of all them are fairly close).

  3. Multiple AS buffs, while a necessity with his kit right now, is bad. To be correct, it FEELS bad.

What you are proposing is buffs and some minor tweaks. But this is not what Aatrox needs. Aatrox needs a quite large rework and his role needs to be defined. In my opinion, this is how I would see an Aatrox rework (I'm not giving a lot of numbers since I'm shitty theorycrafter) :

Base stats :

Since I'm getting rid of non-conditional infinite sustain and he will not have any armor/rm/health buff in his kit, buff his base health so that he reaches 2150 at lvl 18 at least.

Passive :

Get rid of the bonus AS. Increase his base AS by something like 35% at lvl 18. Although it's overall a nerf (55% at lvl 16 right now) it makes his power more constent and will help him a lot in attacking after he revives (right now, unless you keep your ultimate and use it after you revived, Aatrox is damn weak after reviving).

Also, change his health costs accordingly since I will delete the current version of Blood Price (no more infinite sustain).

Q :

The idea behind his Q is interesting but is poorly executed. Potentially, his Q is extremely strong. In game it is weak because the animation is simply too slow and therefore his Q can be interrupted by too many displacement effects with ease. Instead of buffing his Q overall while Massacre is active, Q should have its potential buffed while retaining its flaws.

What I think, is making his Q a channeled ability, like Vi Q. Aatrox immobilizes himself and starts getting higher and higher in the air, increasing the damages of his Q, its range, the duration of the knock-up and its knock-up radius. Q can be quickly reactivated to be used instantly but at a reduced efficiency (less damages, less radius and less duration, like his Q on live). Imo, a charged Q needs to have at least 800 range.

=> Such a change would make his Q a very powerful ability while still retaining all its counterplay. It would also create a gameplay-pattern a bit like a Fiddlestick (and this is very different from the others Diving Fighters) : you try to flank the ennemy team by avoiding the ennemy vision in order to unleash a devastating charged Q. But you need good positioning because you can't move while charging it and vision in order to do so. And you can still easily interrupt Q by throwing at him a displacement effect. Also, you can still use like on live.

To be clear, in any case, a charged Q, of course, HAS to be inferior to Malphite ultimate.

W :

Keep Blood Price like it is.

Completely rework Blood Thirst. Aatrox is supposed to be a DPS champion but since he is super-squishy, people like to play him as a burst champion (and he is very good at this in early and midgame, let's be honest).

Make Blood Thirst an active and passive ability. Aatrox physical damages inflict a debuff on the ennemy. You can stack this debuff up to X times for Y seconds. When you press W, Aatrox deals physical damages and heal himself for an amount based on number of stacks. Heal is increased by X% for each 1% of life he is missing. Heal is reduced against minions (but NOT against monsters in order to preserve jungle Aatrox).

=> Kalista-style ability but with a cap in order to prevent OPeness in very long trades. By getting rid of his infinite sustain, it allows more counterplay and it allows Riot to buff his other abilities too. Also, it emphasizes that Aatrox is a DPS champion because the longer you trade, the more damages you will do thanks to Blood Price but ALSO thanks to Blood Thirst. CD on W should be medium.

Also, since it is now an active ability, item 3078 can become a good item on him, especially with the new E (I'll explain why).

E :

I hate Blades of Torment current effects because "pew pew magic" does not fit with the fact that Aatrox is some kind of bloodthirsty God of War. But for the sake of clarity, let's keep it that way so that we can all understand how the reworked version works.

Change its damages to physical damages in order to open other build paths and reduce its Openess in lane (seriously, a ranged magic damages ability on a champion that deals mostly physical damages has always been a pain in the ass in toplane because you can't build against every type of damages in laning phase). Reduced a BIT its CD (you will see why). Get rid of its slow but add a little armor shred on it. Give it low base damages but high damages when combine with Blood Price. Make it work like Lucian Q.

What I mean by "working like Lucian's Q is :

Lucian's Q can be used on ennemies in 500 range but the spell travels up to 1100 units.

Aatrox's new E would be more or less the same : 150 range for use, but travels up to X units.

Aatrox's next AA unleashes two converging ennemy waves at the target location, dealing X physical damages (low amount and low scaling) and shred the ennemy's armor for X% (low amount, no scaling at all). When a proc of Blood Price is ready, Blades of Torment will consume Blood Price, increasing its damages (high base damages, high scaling) and its armor shred (high amount, no scaling).

=> There are multiple objectives with such changes : reduced its spammability in lane (in order to harass without risk, you need to a minion and to position yourself well). Reduced its average power, but make it very powerful when you are using it in combination with Blood Price (damages ARE NOT based on W level, so that you have the choice depending on the lane or if you are top or jungle, to max out E or W). Again, like the new Q, there is a good amount of counterplay, but if you can hit with Blood Price, the reward will be huge. The armor shred is there in order to give a utility that isn't movement-related since his Q is potentially extremely powerful in this subject. Also, since it is an AA modifier, it would proc item 3057 .

R :

I have no idea lol. I think it definitely needs a full rework in order to be something more interesting than a steroid with some AP damages on it. But I still don't know how to rework it.

Overall, I think that this rework better than your (no offense) because :

  1. It allows more items (especially offensive ones). Since Aatrox has now 3 active abilities and one being an AA modifier, item 3078 could be interesting. item 3071 would also be a good item (right now it's average at best) because reworked Aatrox would have 2 AOE physical damages abilities + his AA and therefore, he could apply the passive to multiple ennemies quickly. Since now he has more active abilities (and with good scaling !), CDR is now also a good stat on him and he isn't over realiant on AS anymore. Raw AD items and AS items are still good items on him but at least, now, he has more options !

  2. Aatrox has now a gameplay-pattern that revolves around flanking the ennemy team (like Fiddlestick) for a potentially incredible engage. He provides also an armor shred with his E. He is overall less toxic and a bit less strong in lane and early game, but it is compensated by having the possibility to be rewarded for doing good stuff through decision-making, vision and positioning.

  3. I would pick Jax for his strong split-pushing and duelling power. I would pick Aatrox for his strong teamfights presence and if I lack good engage or in combination with other good engages (Aatrox charged Q into Malphite ultimate and knocking-up the whole ennemy team ? Could be a funny thing :D).

Some Punk Husky11/11/2016, 7:18:31 AM1 votes

What I feel like one of the problems with aatrox is is that he's too polarized to be good in one situation for an expensive build. He is a 1v1ing split pushing sword wielding festering parasite of a split pusher, whom, if somehow gets ahead with laning phase cheese. will take way too many resources to eliminate kind of like a tryndamere, but playing like a diving fighter. I know Riot has stated where they fail on aatrox is delivering on his theme, that he doesn't really feel like a demonic ancient warrior.

this is too small scope, mechanics of his kit can't just be rearranged or adjusted things need to be moved, redone, reconsidered and reworked.

with how aatrox is an inspirer of war and a commander of armies, whichever army he favors really, any army that will give the greatest massacre and legendary battle, it would make sense for that theme that aatrox isn't a split pusher, but a rallyier of troops, a diving fighter equipped for a 5v5 and the means to survive it, he could still have sustain in his kit, but what if like brands damage excels in grouped combat, what if aatrox's sustain excelled in group combat. (to a point where the aatrox is an unkillable warrior if he plays the 5v5 correctly)

one of the biggest things in aatrox's kit that I feel kind of defines his problems is dark flight, this ability, it clunky as an escape and it sucks when it gets interrupted, but when it lands it feels really good and it's one of the few instances aatrox's delivers on just his visual and thematic aspects, in my honest opinion of course. what I thought would be cool is if you somehow brought dark flight in as a mechanic of the ultimate, like the aoe is bigger but with still the same knock up radius, and along side him landing, what if aatrox sets a stage for a battle with a zone that say maybe makes enemies within the field transfer some damage dealt as health for a short time, either directly to aatrox like a hecarim W or maybe a buff for the whole team as whoever did the damage.

then he could just use some work in his design after that, maybe like, make him hybrid, cut his ap scalings a bit, but give him something else on his passive or a new passive, like say ap translated into attack speed and a bit of lifesteal, aatrox does like guinsoos, it's just too expensive and there's too much in his core that needs to be filled with other item slots. you could make bloodwell instead of a fall down and get back up being way weaker than before, you could make it like a steraks where he stores health from abilities used and damage done into a bloodwell that when you reach a critical ammount of damage you break out into a stronger state with bonus ad and attack speed, as well as a decaying shield based on your bloodwell, maybe breaking any CC when it initiates.

I'm not trying to think of balanced ideas really, as most of that comes from numbers and mechanics tweaks, these are just suggestions for a much more thematic and ambitious redesign which honestly I think your rework kind of lacks.