If Azir were to undergo a mini-rework, here's what I think it should look like

EvanThomas··2 votes·588 views

So, I have a friend who mains Azir, and we were talking recently about what kind of a champion he is, and what the nerfs have done to him. Basically we agreed that he's in a rough spot right now. Why? It's due to the kind of champion he is.

TL;DR of next section: Azir is strong in too many areas at once. (Look for the place where you can start reading again if you want to skip this part. It's in parentheses.)

I came up with 4 categories that most carries fall into: Burst, AOE, Tankbuster, and Playmaker. However, it's not unusual for carries to fall into multiple categories. Here's an explanation of each:

Burst carries can combo together a string of abilities very quickly to do a lot of damage. Usually these carries need to access the backline to be effective in teamfights, as burst on a tank will not mean too much, assuming you are doing about average in this game. Assassins, Burst mages, Corki, etc. need backline access to be completely effective. Sometimes this just means waiting for the right moment to strike, sometimes it means going full ham and forcing your way to the backline. These carries usually peak mid game, but have early game strengths too.

AOE carries can do a decent amount of damage to multiple targets. Stuff like Ashe, Kalista, Viktor, etc. They are usually very effective; it's hard for them not to be. These carries specialize in mid to late game damage.

Tankbuster carries specialize in destroying tanks more quickly than other carries. Vayne, Kog'maw, AP Varus, (personally I think Lucian can be here if built right), etc. These are most effective late game.

Playmakers are carries that have CC, mobility, or oftentimes global abilities that change the tides of the fight, or initiate one. Ashe, Sivir, Jhin, etc. These carries don't specialize in any stage of the game, but are usually useful at every stage of the game.

Like I said, some carries fall into more than one category. Ashe is a playmaker and an AOE carry, as is Sivir; Jhin is a playmaker and a tankbuster; Graves is playmaker and burst. These are all ADCs, but you get the idea.

Now let's get back to what we actually came here to talk about: Azir.

Here's the problem with Azir: He fits rather nicely into all four categories. Burst: Soldier basic attacks, Q, soldier basic attack x2 and a carry is dead. AOE: All soldiers can hit multiple enemies in a line. Tankbuster: Azir can easily target tanks from a safe distance, and his itemization (Void staff, Rabadons deathcap, sometimes Liandry's torment) allows him to take down tanks fast as well. Playmaker: Azir's Shurima Shuffle (W-E-Q to dash far into enemy team, R backwards)

He's strong in all four categories. He also has poke, mobility, and zone control, and his soldiers can't be stopped unless you walk away from them. Even that is tough, because another core item on him is Rylai's Crystal Scepter. He's too strong in too many areas all at once.

You're attacking with a soldier, enemy jungler ganks. Summon another soldier to get out. You're attacking the front line on a teamfight and spot a flanker. Summon another soldier to zone him out. You're Shurima Shuffling in. You throw down your ult, knocking the enemy team backwards. Then you summon another soldier on the other side to start dealing damage again.

(Hey! if you read the TL;DR instead of all this text, you can start reading again!)

Because he's strong in all these areas, he's incredibly hard to nerf. No matter what part of him you nerf, he's always going to be strong in some category that empowers his other aspects, unless you nerf him far enough to not be strong in any of them. And that's what's happening now.

So here's my proposal. What if he was only strong in a couple categories at a time (meaning he has to choose what he wants to do at any given point in time)?

Here's the mini-rework that came out of that. I only changed Azir's W: Arise!

Currently, Azir's W, Arise! Runs on a stock system that can hold up to two soldiers at a time that recharges over 12/11/10/9/8 seconds. This is what is empowering him right now: the fact that he can summon two soldiers to do two different sets of instructions. So let's change that.

Proposed changes:

W: Arise! Cost: 40 mana + 1 sand soldier (No stock system anymore!) 450 cast range, 800 command range. No cooldown, but cannot be recast until Azir's sand soldiers expire. Passive: Azir permanently has bonus attack speed (unchanged from previous W) ... Active: Azir summons an untargetable sand soldier at the target location which stays on the field for 9 seconds, expiring twice as fast when within range of an enemy turret, and expires instantly if Azir moves too far away (1100 units). (Previously, Azir could move VERY far away from a sand soldier before it expired. I'll explain this change at the end.) NEW: Every 5 attacks with a soldier, a new soldier will appear next to the last one to be commanded, towards the direction it was commanded to attack in. When any sand soldier expires, any remaining sand soldiers will expire at the same time.

So what will these changes do? Mainly, they'll prevent Azir from doing multiple things at once, like the examples I gave. (Right above the end of the TL;DR) However, Azir will still get increased damage from summoning more soldiers. Also, whenever a sand soldier expires, Azir will have to start over from 1 soldier again. This leaves bigger windows of opportunity for enemy players to counterplay against Azir. Also, let's take another look at those examples.

You're attacking the front line on a teamfight and spot a flanker. Now you have to choose whether to move your soldier(s) there to zone him, continue attacking in the hopes your team gets him, or use your ult to prevent the flank. You're Shurima Shuffling in. You throw down your ult, knocking the enemy team backwards. Now you must wait for your soldier to expire or for your Q to come back up before you can start dealing damage again. You're attacking with one soldier, enemy jungler ganks. Now you have to wait for the soldier to expire or walk out of range in order to summon an escape route. (This is why I decreased the expiration range on the soldiers, to allow for an escape if you give yourself enough time to walk away so the soldier expires.)

Also, keep in mind that when a champ gets a rework, even just a mini-rework, numbers are re-balanced. This rework, by itself, is a nerf, so imagine Azir was re-buffed to compensate for the rework.

I'd like to hear feedback on this. What are your thoughts? Also, thanks for reading!

6 Comments

Poske1 votes

Just because RIOT said that azir is in a broken place DOESNT mean that its true

We can also then argue Vayne is broken and needs a rework because she is opressive when she is good Le bl is broken and needs yet another rework because she is opressive when she is ahead while being able to do everything Syndra is broken and needs another rework because I have seen her From 100>0 with just r multiples times today without all spheres even reaching targets.

Riot has tendency to gut a champion call it opressive and never touch it again

Take a look at kalista. 1 SLOW and she doesnt even feel like a champion anymore. Could easly be fixed by putting slow removal on her Q or E Take a look at Mordekaisers. Needs to have 12301381203918239012 dmg to be viable due to no mobilty

Heck you can put syndra in so many categoris. AOE (Better then brands as a main of both) ranged stun, sustained dmg, Burst CC ...etc

The idea of just 1 soldiers which would ramp up is stupid.... if you want my opinion

EvanThomas1 votes

Just because RIOT said that azir is in a broken place DOESNT mean that its true

I agree. I didn't say anywhere that's why I thought he was broken. I've had extensive conversations with some friends of mine, one of whom is an Azir main, and we're basically in agreement that Azir is broken because he can do too many things at once.

Heck you can put syndra in so many categoris. AOE (Better then brands as a main of both) ranged stun, sustained dmg, Burst CC ...etc

Riot's reasoning here is that she's not broken because she's immobile. I don't know if I agree with that statement, but she certainly doesn't do everything.

The idea of just 1 soldiers which would ramp up is stupid.... if you want my opinion

I do want your opinion. But I would also like some reasoning behind it. I want to know if it would be broken beyond belief, underpowered, or if you just misread the post. So could you clarify why you think it's a bad idea? I'd like to know.

Thanks for taking the time to read and respond!

Poske1 votes

There are many champions who can do much and thats fine as long as they dont excell at everything Azir had broken beyond belief DAMAGE he wasnt broken he just had to much damage and RIOT Decided that he is broken. After his dmg got down he became a healthy champion

Its painful to see one of the best Riots champion releases getting a rework because they think he is broken

I dont like your idea generaly because it means you cant reposition your soldiers. You activate W enemy dashes? I guess you can follow up with q but then enemy moves a little and fk it ... You no longer can dps. Now you have to wait until your W dissapears?

You dont even understand how bad would this feel. Getting 2nd soldiers off would be irelevant since it would be near the first soldier... Whole no mana gating also removes counterplay not that anyone would care about gutted azir because thats what would happend if you do that

True Syndra is immobile. But so is Brand yet she does everything 2x times better then him. So is godamn veigar yet she does everything 2x times better then him OK veigar stun might be 2% better then hers in some cases

Now would you say problem is in syndra or in brand and veigar?

Problem is in brand and veigar which have dogshit design that they overlap so easly Brand is AOE combo mage (Whos AOE is insanely pathetic) and he has like 2 relevant combos EQWR,WREQ)

Syndra brings same things on the table veigar does. Except I guess she can fk up any jungler lvl 1 ( New jungle)

MuffledGarbage1 votes

I think the biggest problem with this rework you proposed wouldn't be that it'd be too easy access to Azir's soldiers directly but that he would ramp up an insane amount in fights.

Normally Azir players now would get maybe 10-20 soldier attacks in a fight.

With this rework you'd cover his greatest weakness right now...

Even with the 9 second lifespan of an Azir soldier

you'd give him accessibility to his soldiers of which right now he has SOME but he can't always throw all his soldiers out with no care in the world since he needs to save them up because of the Ammo in case he needs to escape. Not even mentioning the mana costs for Azir's combos.

Doing this would create a larger problem than Azir already has (which is not really that much)

Azir's problems right now are that he can poke you while having to take an extremely small risk and that he snowballs as hard as a Darius or a Yasuo.

His risk:reward ratio is very small risk for medium reward right now which creates a power distance and is overall not fun to play against but very satisfying when you catch him away from his soldiers

EvanThomas1 votes

Normally Azir players now would get maybe 10-20 soldier attacks in a fight.

While this may be true, let's take a look at the maximum number of attacks that he can get off in the lifespan of the soldier (9 seconds).

Azir's base attack speed is .625. Add 25.5% attack speed (levelling up), 60% attack speed (W passive), 50% attack speed (Nashor's), and maybe even some attack speed runes and the mastery (17.5%). That equals 1.58 attack speed. In 9 seconds, that is a maximum of 14 attacks.

0 attacks: 1 soldier 5 attacks: 2 soldiers 10 attacks: 3 soldiers 14 attacks: soldiers reset to 0 because they expired

So even though you can get up to 20 attacks in a teamfight, the soldiers will reset to 0 at somepoint during the teamfight. Also, the teamfight may start while your soldier is halfway to expiring, meaning you'll have to start at 1 soldier again even sooner than 14 attacks. (This is usually true when Shurima Shuffling, too. You'll have to wait for Q cooldown or wait for the soldier to expire.)

Also, this is assuming you're attacking 100% of the time during a teamfight. Remember, if you're attacking, you have no backup soldiers for an escape, because there's no charge system. You must wait for the soldiers to expire or walk out of their range to summon a new one. You have to choose your current action very carefully during any point in the teamfight. Also, if you do decide to change your current action, this opens a window of opportunity for the enemies to go in.

you'd give him accessibility to his soldiers of which right now he has SOME but he can't always throw all his soldiers out with no care in the world since he needs to save them up because of the Ammo in case he needs to escape. Not even mentioning the mana costs for Azir's combos.

Maybe you misunderstood, as the rework to his W would actually take away ANY accessibility to spare soldiers, as he has none. It doesn't work off a charge system anymore. You summon one soldier, which may summon more close to it if you attack, but you have to wait for those soldiers to expire before you can summon another. Or maybe I misunderstood. If that's the case, can you clarify?

Thanks for taking the time to read and respond!

MuffledGarbage1 votes

I didn't make it too clear on the soldier accessibility. My bad.

I meant that since right now the rest period in between his combos can vary from 0 seconds to upwards of 10.

By giving him a soldier system that makes it possible to where the ONLY rest you get is when his soldiers are away from you which means he can endlessly kite you. Made even more problematic with Rylai's (although Rylai's has it's own problems) it would still be a problem if he ALWAYS have a soldier ready after they expired since as you said it's 3 soldiers basically at the end of a fight.

So for the most part when those 3 expire he can summon another one and it'd make azir even more safe than he is now and give him a huge increase in power over time and the only requirement is we autoattack someone 5 times.

I'd say at most it should be late-game where he's summoning 3 soldiers in a fight

So changing it to ramp up with the level of the skill would be an optimal fix to make this work.

Azir would still have the problem of being too safe though, if you wanted to fix that well uhh... that's not really what your rework does from what I can tell.

Another possibility is that I misunderstood the writing (I do that sometimes) and so I misunderstood you which made you misunderstand me.

and it was a big chain of misunderstandings like a comedy or somethin.

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