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Patch 7.4: Cho’s Fancy Feast

Riot··7 votes·50,387 views

Cho’Gath was our first Void monster, and it’s fair to say parts of his kit haven’t aged well. Last week’s patch brought a suite of adjustments that scrubbed some of the rust off of his ultimate, Feast. Missed the patch notes? We’ve got you covered.

TL;DR - Cho doesn’t lose Feast stacks on death and can earn infinite stacks off champs and epic monsters!
  •   R - Feast (click for tooltip)

    Ravenously feed on an enemy, dealing 300/475/650 (+10% bonus health) (+0.5 ability power) true damage to champions or 1000 (+10% bonus health) (+0.5 ability power) true damage to minions and monsters. If the target is killed, Cho’Gath gains a stack of Feast, which causes him to grow in size and gain 80/110/140 maximum health.

    Only 5 total stacks can be gained from minions and non-epic monsters.


    NOTES:

    • Feast stacks aren’t lost on death
    • No cap on stacks from champions or epic monsters
    • The bonus health ratio is new
    • Feasting champs doesn’t grant double stacks; feasting minions doesn’t refund cooldown or mana
    • Stacks grant less health. You’ll need eight stacks to catch up to the old six-stack bonus, at least three of which have to come from champs or epic monsters.

A Feast that wasn't filling

Across League’s history, Cho’Gath was the only champion who got numerically weaker from dying. Losing Feast stacks cost the bonus health they granted as well, making Cho that much more likely to die in the next fight. This left him in an unenviable spot: how do you feel great about a tank that can lose his tankiness? Short of “get so far ahead you literally never die”, that question had no good answer. The reverse-snowball effect had to go.

“Make Feast stacks permanent” was the obvious fix, but raised a small mountain of problems during testing. Feasts’s unreliability has been core to its design for years - everything from how Cho’Gath gains stacks to what stacks do has been tuned around the risk of one bad fight costing Cho hundreds of health points. With no other changes in place, perma-stack Cho would have been busted on release. The straightforward approach would have been to water Feast’s numbers down to ‘fair’ levels and call it balanced, but making Feast less exciting seemed... incorrect.

Feast now stacks infinitely if Cho chews his way through the biggest prey.

Fortunately, there was a solution that covered both the fairness and excitement problems. With stacks now permanent, stacking itself could be harder to accomplish. Tying it to a test of skill, rather than rote cooldown management, would in turn allowing us to remove the max stack cap. You read that right - Feast now stacks infinitely if Cho chews his way through the biggest prey on the Rift. We tossed him a few ‘safety stacks’ to ensure a Cho who falls behind can get back on his feet (otherwise we wouldn’t have solved anything), but he’ll need to eat a few objectives to break even with his pre-7.4 bonuses - let alone outscale them.


Modern dining etiquette

What does this mean for all you Cho players? First, Cho’Gath’s super-tank Late Game Fantasy™ comes at the cost of a squishier early- and mid-game. Stacking takes longer than before and stacks don’t grant as much health as they used to. Approach early fights with caution while you adjust to Feast’s new pacing - just because stacks persist through death doesn’t mean grayscreening is advisable.

Second, think carefully before cashing in your five minion/small monster stacks. Holding Feast’s cooldown for a gank isn’t as time-efficient as fast-nomming minions, but using R to secure an early kill keeps your safety stacks on reserve for occasions when low-health enemies might be harder to find. This is ultimately a case-by-case judgment call you’ll get a sense for over time.

Finally, Feast’s new bonus health ratio does a lot of work in teamfights. This is moreso the case for tank Cho players, but AP builds also join in on the fun once stacks start coming in. Take the ratio into consideration when deciding what to buy! (PS: If you’re looking to experiment with new builds - say, Titanic Hydra or Sterak’s Gage - remember that Practice Tool now exists! What a time to be alive.)


A single updated ability doesn’t solve all of Cho’Gath’s problems, but it goes a long way toward ensuring he’s got a place in a roster of 134 champions. Best of luck to all the Cho mains out there, and be sure to bring your appetite!

152 Comments

Destroyer Flynn35 votes

Chogath NOMNOMNOMNOMNOM

Final Raid Boss3 votes

i like this change but his animations and voice is still old

MaxPlnk8 votes

I love his animations and voice! He's so fun! "No. I do not live under a bed. Fool."

Mister Fishey31 votes

I love it. The whole "reverse-snowballing" thing was very FeelsBadMan, so I'm glad that's been changed. Something I've been saying since Sion's update was that if Sion, a zombie axe-guy, can be THIS terrifying, then Cho'Gath, THE TERROR OF THE VOID should be at least that scary, and with the release of the spookiness that is the Warwick update, the pressure is only getting higher for Cho to live up to his title. While this change doesn't necessarily fully close the scariness gap, it is certainly a step in the right direction. So good job!

[slayer-pantheon-thumbs]

Diodice19 votes

So Chogath can have infinite stacks but Graves can't have a cigar? I so done...

Soireal10 votes

graves vapes now

RainbowDerp17 votes

Playing against this late-game is horrendously broken, any champ that can do 1000+ TRUE DAMAGE to champions in a single hit is just absurd, Riot seriously needs to rethink this...

Godotº199 votes

Darius

H4X711 votes

Signed in just to upvote that.

Lord Sazuri5 votes

Same hereGnar

Autrah Fang46 votes

not to mention Chogath is a lot easier to counter than Darius as well... his only gap closer being his highly telegraphed Q that anyone with a brain can dodge, especially if they're any of the countless champions with mobility... and killing a champion with R doesn't reset the CD like Darius' does.

Shabada6419 votes

Just because Chogath can instantly delete only ONE champion per fight doesn't make him anywhere NEAR balanced...

But yeah, that Q is pretty obvious and easy to dodge, that is if you are not one of the 90% of marksmen that are completely immobile.Ashe Draven Jayce Jinx KogMaw KogMaw KogMaw KogMaw KogMaw MissFortune Sivir Ashe KogMaw Twitch TwistedFate Thresh Kennen Varus Jhin

Very few marksmen have any mobility: Ahri Caitlyn Corki Ezreal Kalista Kindred Lucian Quinn Tristana Vayne

500000000000000064 votes

I think you forgot KogMaw

Scrooch McSucc105 votes

Ah yes. Ahri. The most played marksman of them all.

Autrah Fang20 votes

{quoted}

Just because Chogath can instantly delete only ONE champion per fight doesn't make him anywhere NEAR balanced...

But yeah, that Q is pretty obvious and easy to dodge, that is if you are not one of the 90% of marksmen that are completely immobile.Ashe Draven Jayce Jinx KogMaw KogMaw KogMaw KogMaw KogMaw MissFortune Sivir Ashe KogMaw Twitch TwistedFate Thresh Kennen Varus Jhin

Very few marksmen have any mobility: Ahri Caitlyn Corki Ezreal Kalista Kindred Lucian Quinn Tristana Vayne

Darius does the same thing tho... don't know why you're singling out Cho now, when 1) Cho has always been able to do this and 2) Darius has also always been able to do this, and his resets every time he kills someone with it. not sure why you're complaining about just Cho. not to mention, there are quite a few champions that can instantly delete at least one person per fight from longer range, and more reliably.Annie Syndra Lux come to mind off the top of my head, and assassins can do it much more reliably as well, though they don't necessarily "instantly delete" people with their forced 2 second delay from the assassin update.

also, you don't need mobility to dodge Cho's Q, like i said in my post. if you have half a brain, and at least boots or a speed up, you can dodge it. you just have to pay attention. and when did i say anything about marksmen? which btw Ahri Thresh TwistedFate Kennen Jayce are not marksmen lol, and i think you're missing Azir Kayle Graves Teemo , who actually are classified as marksmen, and if you wanna go by the client, you're still missing Urgot Teemo Graves who are classified as marksmen there.

LHMYTmosbx5 votes

Don't forget about Garen

Shadowstarthe1st2 votes

Garen's isnt true damage unless your the villain which only on the most recent killer on the enemie team, you don't get to choose this ether...

Ivern a Tree Guy4 votes

well isn't that a relief seeing as he still shreds all of my armor with his e

SovereignMammal17 votes

The difference is Darius has to get 5 stacks on you before he does any true dmg. Cho just walks up and presses R

Exiles SoIace12 votes

darius has the true damage regardless of stacks

21st Legion15 votes

if you just walk up and ult someone it does the base amount of damage as physical damage. you have to have bleed stacks (at least one) to get true damage.

Copied from LeagueOfLegends.wikia.com

Active: Darius dashes to the target enemy champion and attempts to execute them, dealing true damage.

True Damage: 100 / 200 / 300 (+ 75% bonus AD)

For each stack of Hemorrhage on the target, Noxian Guillotine's damage increases by 20%, up to 100% increase in damage.

「 Bonus Damage Per Stack: 20 / 40 / 60 (+ 15% bonus AD) 」

If Noxian Guillotine kills its target, Darius causes all nearby minions and monsters to Fear icon flee in terror for 3 seconds and it can be recast within the next 20 seconds at no additional cost. At Rank 3, Noxian Guillotine's cooldown resets completely. This can occur multiple times in succession.

JustNaes30 votes

650 on champions, 1k on minions.

Of course there's scaling, but its not exactly 1000

Also if you get nommed by Cho, you kind of deserve it if you you're not kiting the slow cho

SovereignMammal9 votes

Swiftys + Deadmans + Protobelt + Rylais = GL kiting Also, Once he reaches 5k health his ult does over 1000. If I remember correctly the exact number when I got one shot by an auto + ult was 1366

50000000000000005 votes

It's the same issue as the juggernauts. They are kited easily in teamfights.

SovereignMammal3 votes

But he can just flas past your frontline and ult your adc then wreck your backline.

500000000000000010 votes

That's just your frontline being useless. Cho'Gath is extremely prone to kite. Play him yourself and see.

Godotº15 votes

Yay now i get to see a cho'gath every game [slayer-pantheon-thumbs]

Alpenglow2 votes

that is gonna tilt someone over for example: me

Carnicore12 votes

Could we get a similar article for the Master Yi Meditate changes? Assuming you don't have anything else you wanted to talk about.

Zedex1 votes

he's not a comp champion, like Cho. God forbid Cho's out of flavor for a while now they have to post an article to bring this buff to light. But Yi won't get this treatment because hes never used in Pro Play.

Carnicore17 votes

Cho's been terrible in competitive play for a long time. Besides, this article has no obvious relation to pro play.

Not a mous4 votes

I think you forget the legendary Huni Chode Monster

Spoo12 votes

Let's face it, if you can't dodge Cho Q Nom you can't dodge a wrench. If you can't dodge a wrench, why and how are you still playing league?

SilenceOfHearts21 votes

you make me want to verse you with an ADC Heimerdinger

SlayerXtreme909 votes

i played with cho early this morning was flipping busted

Lord Desert9 votes

Well he loses up to 360HP in the early midgame, with doubled stacking time and also doubled window of weakness. As a compensation we get a better and more reliable lategame. So we could call this a powershift, from less early and risky to safer but weaker until you hit lategame. I personaly am not a huge fan of it, but I especially dislike that he cant lose his stacks. It felt like it was a really important part of his kit!

I would suggest a middle ground type change: Let him keep the old stacking (2 on champs and 50% cdr on minions) until he hits 5 stacks. After that he only gains 1 stack from champs/epics. But he also loses 1 (maybe 2) stacks on death.

Yes this would increase the already overloaded R, but at this point that bit extra doesnt matter at all :D It also fits thematicaly: At first champs fill him pretty good and minions are delicious snacks, but later( at 5 stacks) minions dont cut it anymore and only epics and champs are nourishing enough for him to grow.


This powershift obviously doesnt bring him back from the 45% winrate void but if you would take a look at his Q Hitbox it could potentionally be the bait that is needed to bring him back!

See for yourself:

http://imgur.com/nT7MIID

Edit: No Testing Dummys were hurt by the tests!
..... Ok, maybe a little bit...

For the detailed version with a couple more problems check out this Bug report

Mad Hit Monkey6 votes

NO MORE MAXIMUM CHO'GATH!

ONLY INFINITE CHO'GATH!

NaturesMayhem5 votes

Can't wait to put the practice tool to use and constantly eat the dragon.

Messiah964 votes

So, eat more champions is what you are trying to say?

Richardohyeah3 votes

Ahri my time has come

mychichi4 votes

Hey, don't get too cocky. As a cho main i can say that before his buff, i maid ahris rage quit and recently, a yasuo (not that hard got first blood and another kill on him and he left lul)

notice me Sin pi5 votes

cho counters yasuo tho

Turtlesrock3 votes

I dont understand all the complaints in the comments... Is he stronger and better? yes of course. Is he OP and broken atm and unable to be dealt with? absolutely not.

XEodiaX3 votes

everyone forgot about Malzahar vs Chogath .

Nvayde2 votes

Chogath is sooooo effective now, at least in low elo. I have played about 10 games with him and I have a 90% WR with him. By 30ish minutes ill normaly have 9-12 stacks and float with around 4500-5500HP(this depends on wether I'm using him in jugnle or top). I don't build him as a mage because I think using him as a tank is more effective. Usually rush a 40%CDR build and after that you scale extremely fast and in teamfights you get knock ups and silences off quite frequently. Running GotU keystone ive found works the best. Also, if you top lane with him, starting item should be Corrupting pots for his weak early game mana pool.

GamingEelektross2 votes

If I may recommend a fix to his kit, make the passive matter better in the late game, or mildly rework it into something that helps early game while keeping relevance in the late game.

mdrsspike1 votes

Chogath was broken enough this is overkill.

Cûb41 votes

All because you can't dodge his skillshots doesn't make it "overkill" [slayer-jinx-wink]

YaJpTpOg4C1 votes

Another one for the bans.

P.S. When are 10 bans coming? Gonna need 20 by the time it comes out.

Lapis3 votes

Apparently 10 bans are coming whenever people stop using the old client

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