Patch 7.4: Cho’s Fancy Feast

Riot·2/27/2017, 8:21:08 PM·7 votes·50,387 views

Cho’Gath was our first Void monster, and it’s fair to say parts of his kit haven’t aged well. Last week’s patch brought a suite of adjustments that scrubbed some of the rust off of his ultimate, Feast. Missed the patch notes? We’ve got you covered.

TL;DR - Cho doesn’t lose Feast stacks on death and can earn infinite stacks off champs and epic monsters!
  •   R - Feast (click for tooltip)

    Ravenously feed on an enemy, dealing 300/475/650 (+10% bonus health) (+0.5 ability power) true damage to champions or 1000 (+10% bonus health) (+0.5 ability power) true damage to minions and monsters. If the target is killed, Cho’Gath gains a stack of Feast, which causes him to grow in size and gain 80/110/140 maximum health.

    Only 5 total stacks can be gained from minions and non-epic monsters.


    NOTES:

    • Feast stacks aren’t lost on death
    • No cap on stacks from champions or epic monsters
    • The bonus health ratio is new
    • Feasting champs doesn’t grant double stacks; feasting minions doesn’t refund cooldown or mana
    • Stacks grant less health. You’ll need eight stacks to catch up to the old six-stack bonus, at least three of which have to come from champs or epic monsters.

A Feast that wasn't filling

Across League’s history, Cho’Gath was the only champion who got numerically weaker from dying. Losing Feast stacks cost the bonus health they granted as well, making Cho that much more likely to die in the next fight. This left him in an unenviable spot: how do you feel great about a tank that can lose his tankiness? Short of “get so far ahead you literally never die”, that question had no good answer. The reverse-snowball effect had to go.

“Make Feast stacks permanent” was the obvious fix, but raised a small mountain of problems during testing. Feasts’s unreliability has been core to its design for years - everything from how Cho’Gath gains stacks to what stacks do has been tuned around the risk of one bad fight costing Cho hundreds of health points. With no other changes in place, perma-stack Cho would have been busted on release. The straightforward approach would have been to water Feast’s numbers down to ‘fair’ levels and call it balanced, but making Feast less exciting seemed... incorrect.

Feast now stacks infinitely if Cho chews his way through the biggest prey.

Fortunately, there was a solution that covered both the fairness and excitement problems. With stacks now permanent, stacking itself could be harder to accomplish. Tying it to a test of skill, rather than rote cooldown management, would in turn allowing us to remove the max stack cap. You read that right - Feast now stacks infinitely if Cho chews his way through the biggest prey on the Rift. We tossed him a few ‘safety stacks’ to ensure a Cho who falls behind can get back on his feet (otherwise we wouldn’t have solved anything), but he’ll need to eat a few objectives to break even with his pre-7.4 bonuses - let alone outscale them.


Modern dining etiquette

What does this mean for all you Cho players? First, Cho’Gath’s super-tank Late Game Fantasy™ comes at the cost of a squishier early- and mid-game. Stacking takes longer than before and stacks don’t grant as much health as they used to. Approach early fights with caution while you adjust to Feast’s new pacing - just because stacks persist through death doesn’t mean grayscreening is advisable.

Second, think carefully before cashing in your five minion/small monster stacks. Holding Feast’s cooldown for a gank isn’t as time-efficient as fast-nomming minions, but using R to secure an early kill keeps your safety stacks on reserve for occasions when low-health enemies might be harder to find. This is ultimately a case-by-case judgment call you’ll get a sense for over time.

Finally, Feast’s new bonus health ratio does a lot of work in teamfights. This is moreso the case for tank Cho players, but AP builds also join in on the fun once stacks start coming in. Take the ratio into consideration when deciding what to buy! (PS: If you’re looking to experiment with new builds - say, Titanic Hydra or Sterak’s Gage - remember that Practice Tool now exists! What a time to be alive.)


A single updated ability doesn’t solve all of Cho’Gath’s problems, but it goes a long way toward ensuring he’s got a place in a roster of 134 champions. Best of luck to all the Cho mains out there, and be sure to bring your appetite!

152 Comments

Destroyer Flynn2/27/2017, 10:47:53 PM35 votes

Chogath NOMNOMNOMNOMNOM

Mister Fishey2/27/2017, 11:09:39 PM31 votes

I love it. The whole "reverse-snowballing" thing was very FeelsBadMan, so I'm glad that's been changed. Something I've been saying since Sion's update was that if Sion, a zombie axe-guy, can be THIS terrifying, then Cho'Gath, THE TERROR OF THE VOID should be at least that scary, and with the release of the spookiness that is the Warwick update, the pressure is only getting higher for Cho to live up to his title. While this change doesn't necessarily fully close the scariness gap, it is certainly a step in the right direction. So good job!

[slayer-pantheon-thumbs]

Diodice2/28/2017, 6:58:11 AM19 votes

So Chogath can have infinite stacks but Graves can't have a cigar? I so done...

RainbowDerp2/27/2017, 10:52:42 PM17 votes

Playing against this late-game is horrendously broken, any champ that can do 1000+ TRUE DAMAGE to champions in a single hit is just absurd, Riot seriously needs to rethink this...

Godotº2/27/2017, 10:43:07 PM15 votes

Yay now i get to see a cho'gath every game [slayer-pantheon-thumbs]

Spoo2/28/2017, 2:23:49 AM12 votes

Let's face it, if you can't dodge Cho Q Nom you can't dodge a wrench. If you can't dodge a wrench, why and how are you still playing league?

Carnicore2/27/2017, 11:13:42 PM12 votes

Could we get a similar article for the Master Yi Meditate changes? Assuming you don't have anything else you wanted to talk about.

Lord Desert2/27/2017, 11:18:47 PM9 votes

Well he loses up to 360HP in the early midgame, with doubled stacking time and also doubled window of weakness. As a compensation we get a better and more reliable lategame. So we could call this a powershift, from less early and risky to safer but weaker until you hit lategame. I personaly am not a huge fan of it, but I especially dislike that he cant lose his stacks. It felt like it was a really important part of his kit!

I would suggest a middle ground type change: Let him keep the old stacking (2 on champs and 50% cdr on minions) until he hits 5 stacks. After that he only gains 1 stack from champs/epics. But he also loses 1 (maybe 2) stacks on death.

Yes this would increase the already overloaded R, but at this point that bit extra doesnt matter at all :D It also fits thematicaly: At first champs fill him pretty good and minions are delicious snacks, but later( at 5 stacks) minions dont cut it anymore and only epics and champs are nourishing enough for him to grow.


This powershift obviously doesnt bring him back from the 45% winrate void but if you would take a look at his Q Hitbox it could potentionally be the bait that is needed to bring him back!

See for yourself:

http://imgur.com/nT7MIID

Edit: No Testing Dummys were hurt by the tests!
..... Ok, maybe a little bit...

For the detailed version with a couple more problems check out this Bug report

SlayerXtreme902/27/2017, 11:11:38 PM9 votes

i played with cho early this morning was flipping busted

Mad Hit Monkey2/28/2017, 7:47:10 AM6 votes

NO MORE MAXIMUM CHO'GATH!

ONLY INFINITE CHO'GATH!

NaturesMayhem2/27/2017, 11:03:48 PM5 votes

Can't wait to put the practice tool to use and constantly eat the dragon.

Messiah962/27/2017, 10:16:33 PM4 votes

So, eat more champions is what you are trying to say?

XEodiaX3/1/2017, 3:32:14 AM3 votes

everyone forgot about Malzahar vs Chogath .

Richardohyeah2/28/2017, 1:18:37 AM3 votes

Ahri my time has come

Turtlesrock2/28/2017, 2:47:51 PM3 votes

I dont understand all the complaints in the comments... Is he stronger and better? yes of course. Is he OP and broken atm and unable to be dealt with? absolutely not.

GamingEelektross3/1/2017, 1:46:18 AM2 votes

If I may recommend a fix to his kit, make the passive matter better in the late game, or mildly rework it into something that helps early game while keeping relevance in the late game.

Nvayde2/28/2017, 4:57:59 AM2 votes

Chogath is sooooo effective now, at least in low elo. I have played about 10 games with him and I have a 90% WR with him. By 30ish minutes ill normaly have 9-12 stacks and float with around 4500-5500HP(this depends on wether I'm using him in jugnle or top). I don't build him as a mage because I think using him as a tank is more effective. Usually rush a 40%CDR build and after that you scale extremely fast and in teamfights you get knock ups and silences off quite frequently. Running GotU keystone ive found works the best. Also, if you top lane with him, starting item should be Corrupting pots for his weak early game mana pool.

YaJpTpOg4C2/28/2017, 12:53:49 AM1 votes

Another one for the bans.

P.S. When are 10 bans coming? Gonna need 20 by the time it comes out.

mdrsspike2/27/2017, 11:41:52 PM1 votes

Chogath was broken enough this is overkill.