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/dev: New001 on competition beyond ranked

Riot·9/28/2016, 10:39:45 PM·2 votes·41,920 views

/dev is a new, ongoing series where League’s key leaders and decision makers share their thoughts on the game, its development, and anything else that may come to mind.

Hi everyone, New001 here, lead producer on League. Over the last year, you might have caught wind of the direction we want to take League -- to make League a global sport that lasts for generations. But it might not be clear what this direction actually means to us, or what we’re trying to get at when we talk about the idea of “sport.”

One way of explaining this is to say that we want League to offer meaningful competition at all levels. And, from my perspective, we’re currently falling short there.


Missing links

Today, League can actually feel like a few distinct competitive experiences:

  1. There’s the 1-30 experience: here you’re just trying to understand basic concepts and learn the fundamentals of the game.
  2. Then there’s ranked: shit gets real, you have to focus on improving, pay attention to the current meta, and widen your champ pool.
  3. And of course, there’s pro play: the highest tier of competitive League, which can sometimes seem like a completely different game!

There’s even more to it than that, but I want to talk about a specific underserved experience between ranked and pro play. Many of us will never be good enough to perform at the Staples Center, in the Mercedes-Benz arena, or in Sangam Stadium, but that doesn’t mean we can’t have competitive teamplay experiences that generate the same heart-pumping adrenaline, and bring the coordination, intensity, and highs and lows of pro play to everyone who wants to experience them. This type of organized play is something we want to deliver to players -- something that bridges the gap between #2 and #3.


The Rumble experience

At Riot, we have a longstanding tournament called Riot Rumble. Rumble takes place twice a year, lasts for a few months, and hundreds of Rioters around the world participate. Participants break into tiers by MMR, teams form and compete for the ultimate prize: custom jackets (and more importantly, bragging rights).

During Rumble, the atmosphere in the office changes. Rioters reorganize their lives around the tournament. We get serious about our champion pools. We stay late practicing specific comps with our teams. On match night it’s not uncommon to hear screams of victory and defeat around the office. The morning after, epic stories about wiping at Baron are traded in the halls.

Rumble changes the core game experience. Pick and ban phase becomes about banning out specific team comps, strategies, and specific team members instead of just taking out champs that happen to be powerful (it’s infinitely more meaningful to ban out the opposing jungler because you did your homework than it is to ban Zed because he’s strong, and it’s satisfying to feel the respect when you get banned). Teams get coaches. You scout, scrim, and review tape.

Playing with the same group over and over helps you develop a team identity. You find out if you’re better at pick comps or sieging. You work hard to make your comms more effective over time. You have rivalries. You build meaningful relationships and grow as a team. In Ranked play, I want to be Doublelift; in Rumble, we want to be TSM.

In Rumble I’ve had incredible team experiences that have deepened my understanding of League in a way I don’t think I could get from Solo Q. I’ve built stronger relationships with my teammates, have learned how to scout and scrim, and have been exposed to a beyond-Ranked type of competitive experience that gives a taste of pro play despite my non-pro abilities.

When I look at League from this perspective, I see a gap between ranked and pro play. We want to fill this gap. We want teams to grow together, succeed together, and fail together, even in Bronze. Basically, we want everyone who plays League to have an opportunity to experience this type of intense, coordinated competition.


Moving forward

The intent of this new series of dev blogs is to share our thoughts on a more philosophical level (we haven’t forgotten about our promise to update you on Season 2017’s ranked changes -- that post is coming in the next few days). So although we don’t have any specific organized play features to announce right now, it’s one area we are actively exploring and where you can expect to see us invest more in the future . We think this could be an awesome new addition to the current experiences League offers, and we hope we can share these types of experiences with our most hardcore League players.

I’ll be around in the comments for a bit to answer questions.

228 Comments

stealthbonger4209/29/2016, 7:23:39 PM55 votes

i feel like you were just bragging about how much fun you have playing in a tourney without really explaining how this pertains to the player.

Casmpnk9/29/2016, 8:06:50 PM28 votes

Hi...um this might seem as a silly or pointless question but I was wondering if you see any potential gaps between even ranked and the 1-30 stage...I realize that it can be filled with tons of normal qs, arams, special events you throw, and even bot games, but even though I love the heck out of this game I unfortunately cannot dedicate enough of my time to actually pick up on the aspects of the game that I am struggling with.(Namely: Summoner's Rift). I have a young family that I am also highly dedicated to and I find it hard to balance time with them and time with League. The time I get to spend on LoL is very touch and go as of right now and I have to seize every opportunity I get with a vengeance. I also try to only go into 5s with a few players I've met through the game and we don't get to coexist in the game that often as our lives differ. I have been trying to practice like crazy regardless of these conditions and I feel that I am steadily getting better in those areas, but I wish there was a faster way to pick up on things. While I can't play League to help develop my skills I try to do things like watch other players, research things about the game I don't quite understand or further my knowledge of the things I do. Although these methods do help it is a rather slow process and I learn more from a physical experience than a visual experience. My whole point to this is have you guys considered maybe hosting training sessions or offering something for the in-between players so that you could catch them up to the competitive play style? Something like this would be excellent for people like me who can't just grind the game out until they are good. It would also break away from a lot of the more negative experiences of the game like toxic players and stressful emotions coming from often failing thus leading to straying away from almost anything "competitive" like. I realize a lot of this is probably just some rambling but I hope my message is something maybe you'll consider while looking for ways to further develop the game and truly make it a "competitive sport". Even tennis has "training camps".

Odinswrath9/29/2016, 7:41:02 PM23 votes

I feel like this should be leading into something. And my hope is Voice chat. It has to be done for the ranked experience to level up in this game and to be on par with it's competitors.summoner 12

DrCyanide9/29/2016, 8:17:31 PM17 votes

Over the last year, you might have caught wind of the direction we want to take League -- to make League a global sport that lasts for generations.

I keep seeing these statements, but I feel like you need to specify what you mean.

There are two types of "generational" games: Pokemon style and Sports style.

Pokemon style is what League looks like it's currently aiming towards. People are introduced to the game with X pokemon/champions, they get into it, they play, then Y new pokemon/champions later they leave for a while, never to come back. Any thoughts they have of coming back are mostly nostalgia, and counteracted by Z new champions that came out since they last left. It's too much to really get back into, so it's abandoned.

Sports style is what has been described by Rioters in some other articles, with fathers teaching their sons about the game. Real world sports are pretty resistant to change, staying constant enough that the father doesn't have to go and read a manual on what changed in the last 10 years. The positions aren't reworked, the balls don't change, the field/court doesn't change, these things are static. Could you imagine how confused someone would be if they went back to playing Baseball, they step up to bat, and the enemy team had 3 pitchers, first and third base were flipped, there were only two strikes allowed, and you were out if you didn't skip between bases? Yet similar changes happen in League every class update or preseason.

If League wants to take on the "sport" title for real, then there needs to be a way for someone to walk away from the game for years, come back, and between champion select, the loading screen, and "minions have spawned" get caught up on what their champion wants to do, what their allies champions want to do, and what their enemies champions want to do. Even if all those champions were released after they left the game, that should be the standard League holds itself to.

You can assume players will remember they need to last hit, take towers, kill inhibitors, kill the nexus. That's the core of the game. You can assume they'll remember that Summoner Spells, Items, Runes, and Masteries exist. You can't assume they'll know anything else about the game, because everything else about the game changes too frequently. You need good in game documentation that's very simple to digest.

Covert Ops Gnar9/30/2016, 7:26:48 AM13 votes

Riot, I really HATE how you stopped sponsoring community-hosted tournaments. I used to play in tournaments all the time, I have Triumphant Ryze, it was lots of fun meeting new people, and I won tons of RP.

I wish there was something along those lines. Solo queue ladder is for try-harding, normals is for messing around and trying new things, and then there was tournaments, where I could focus on my team-oriented competitiveness and making acquaintances through the community.

I feel that a huge part in teamplay was taken out when those were stopped. I wish something like it would return.

xSilentNightx9/30/2016, 12:26:27 AM12 votes

"Then there’s ranked: shit gets real, you have to focus on improving, pay attention to the current meta, and widen your champ pool." - Riot Games

"Shit gets real" True Until someone pulls a teemo support.

MaddogMedinaJoe9/29/2016, 7:19:52 PM11 votes

do you think there could be a system where you can keep leveling up like to level 100 or higher, and just have it so ranked is unlocked at level 30?, I've been playing for almost 4 years and have over 3000 (just normal not including any other game mode, or ranked) games played and I'm still just level 30 feels kinda bad.

Vanescere 9/29/2016, 10:07:48 PM10 votes

I fell in love with this game a long time ago. The first name I made was a joke and I didn't think much of it at the time. Then I got out of Bronze and into Silver. Soon after that I reached into Gold and thought I was hot shit. Then, all the way to Platinum Division I. It was an awesome feeling to have come so far. My point, is I've spent quite a bit of time climbing the ladder, and I don't believe you need to be Challenger for someone to care about what you have to say.

I had an idea, and I hope Riot would consider something like it. The Ranked system we have right now, I feel, is at its most unfair. Often times some party of however many is making or breaking your day, and you're just kind of caught in the middle. Before, there could, at worst, only be a duo. Yet, now that number is unlimited, all the way to Five. But you're in... solo...queue. My point is I often feel like I'm the only one "solo," and it makes the climb even harder when your own performance matters less and less. I play out of my mind a lot. I can carry really hard and do a lot of great things, but if you don't win it's all for nothing.

But I can lose a game and still get an S rating on how I did. So, why not have a system where you accumulate points based on how well you play. I know it'd probably be difficult as the system has already gone through so much change. My idea is the number of LP you would get could be determined by what you contributed to your teams win/loss. So, if you have a situation when you play out of your mind great, you should be rewarded for your advanced play. Say that person gets 18 LP. On that same team, a trundle top lost his shit and fed 22 kills. So even though that adc played out of his mind they still lost. That trundle should lose...35LP. My point, is that it's about how you're playing the game and what you're contributing to your team. When you operate under the black and white of just winning and losing in a queue which is supposed to recognize individual performance, shouldn't your performance matter? We conflate this with saying "get good, and if you're good you'll win" and yes, most often times that is true. You will win. But how many games can you think where it only took one person's shitty performance to cost you the game. YOU didn't do anything. You grouped with the rest of the team waiting; and that one moron cost all of you a win. I think I'm rambling but the point remains the same.

In a five premade--ahem, Ranked 5's, winning should matter, that's what it's all about; it's league at its most insane. But in Solo Q, you shouldn't be judged by the people around you, and in this season I feel the least impactful. I feel the game is pre decided and I just have to go with it. We developed a way for someone who doesn't know you to gauge how good you are with given champions, so why not extend it a little further to have that be reflected in ranked; by your performance. This will even go as far to combat a lot of behavior problems with the game. People want to play great to get their S Ratings and tokens... Imagine if you could instill that same drive into everyone in the Ranked queue. You can, and I think you should. Riot was definitely onto something with that and I think it could really make the game better if they kept with it.

Thanks... sorry this was long.

ocampony9/29/2016, 7:19:51 PM9 votes

So, from a strictly competitive view, is Graves now a stronger champion than Gragas because Graves stopped smoking and Gragas hasn't?

Øwl9/29/2016, 8:44:05 PM8 votes

This might not be a bad place to bring back up sandbox as a potential option. features that are designed with teams in mind will certainly encourage more teams to form. That being said, of course sandbox has a lot more potential than that, and I understand there have been reasons in the past for leaving this kind of thing out. But, going into a game and being able to specifically practice midgame, late game, csing without waiting the first minute or even without actually "waves," things like this open up the chance for learning and developing macro game that currently is incredibly inefficient to practice. half an hour of scrimmages to recreate the mid game or late game situation your team struggles with, when these are players putting in insane amounts of time. I just think this has the potential to do two major things. one, encourage learning macro play, which in lower levels you kind of imagine as occurring mid and late, when team fights occur, you know, after laying phase, and so on. the second, is it creates a way of effectively practicing solo skills, whether with mechanics, finding more effective ways of putting vision control to use, etc. I'm sure I'm beating the dead horse here, but a sandbox mode with options to start with X amount of gold, and x amount of cdr, x level, etc, opens up so many opportunities for both solo players and team players. Features like this would help drive and encourage team play more, and this conversation is a good time to revisit this, knowing teams often complained in the past about not having access to something easy to use to do this stuff. thoughts?

Bravera9/30/2016, 3:00:02 AM8 votes

Your mentioning tournament play actually gave me a great idea... tournament draft!!!

So you go into tournament draft, you can pick up some friends or go at it solo... You start at the first bracket, and if you win you move onto the next bracket, where you will face a team of players who also defeated their first bracket...

You can either pick up new team members or continue with the team members you already have(and earn a teamwork bonus for playing multiple games with them)!

Working your way to the top bracket, lets say 6 or 8 wins in a row?

If you just so happen to beat the tournament draft! Well great rewards would await your pallete.

I believe this would accomplish multiple things, briding that gap between ranked and competitive gameplay, creating a stronger community, keeping players interest, and rewarding players for teamwork...

Just think about how amazing it would feel to win a tournament draft!