Toxic Teams/Queue Dodging

AnubisDeathtouch·Nov 21, 2019·3 votes·1,788 views

After all these years the various aspects of the leaverbuster system are still completely mismanaged. While queue dodging can be annoying, and there should be limits in place, it's much better for everyone of people are allowed to dodge to some degree rather than forced to play games they don't want to play. If someone wants to be angry and salty about not calling ADC first, I'd rather they just dodge than play the game and grief the entire time. If they dodge they wasted one minute of my time and it isn't memorable, if they ruin the game they wasted 20-30+ minutes of my time and ruined my game experience. Likewise, there were times when the random party was acting so toxic in champion select that I chose to dodge. If the team is screaming at each other before the game even starts, that is not an indicator that following game will be a wonderful experience. Better to do everyone a favor and dodge, so that we can go our separate ways and start over. Which would be fine, except that the punishment for queue-dodging, whether purposefully leaving or getting disconnected or the client freezing up, scales very quickly. The five minute wait after dodging is a perfectly adequate restriction, it will make a person a person weigh the options, to wait between game attempts or play with a toxic team. When you scale the punishment up each time they dodge in a day, it quickly gets to the point where it's no longer worth trying to play. No one is going to sit there and wait an hour between games.
On a side note, it's also kind of an issue that the only button to report toxic players is in the post-game screen. What if they're being toxic before the game even starts and then someone leaves? What if the client crashes after the game ends, or you're just so frustrated that you accidently skip past it? A pre-game report button that also gives you the option to dodge without being punished would go a long way toward solving these issues. Some people would abuse it, but people can already file false reports just because they don't like people and I'm sure you have a way to deal with that.

TLDR: The system sucks. Punish toxic people, not players trying to avoid toxic people. And don't punish us for your client issues.

3 Comments

rujitraNov 21, 20192 votes

it's much better for everyone of people are allowed to dodge to some degree rather than forced to play games they don't want to play.

"My team comp is shit, I don't want to play this game". No. It's not "much better". It's much worse, as it makes matchmaking useless and the ranked ladder instead of being a measure of skill becomes "who can game the system the best".

If someone wants to be angry and salty about not calling ADC first, I'd rather they just dodge than play the game and grief the entire time.

So you're talking about blind pick? Great news - role calling isn't a thing - people can go whatever role they want. You're expected to talk and compromise with your teammates. You calling it first means jack shit.

Which would be fine, except that the punishment for queue-dodging, whether purposefully leaving or getting disconnected or the client freezing up, scales very quickly.

Because "computer issues" or "emergencies" don't happen multiple times in a row. Period. And dodging is not a tool to get out of a game just because "I don't like it". Period.

When you scale the punishment up each time they dodge in a day, it quickly gets to the point where it's no longer worth trying to play.

Yes, this is the design. You either stop dodging outside of the limited true use for it (i.e. an IRL emergency or a computer crash), or you get punished to the point you don't want to play anymore. Congrats, you've proven that dodging should stay the way it is because it's working on you.

What if they're being toxic before the game even starts and then someone leaves? What if the client crashes after the game ends, or you're just so frustrated that you accidently skip past it?

Riot Support is happy to take reports outside of the client for you.

A pre-game report button that also gives you the option to dodge without being punished would go a long way toward solving these issues.

Absolutely not. It would not solve anything, and it would cause many more issues re: gaming matchmaking and increasing queue times for everyone.

Some people would abuse it, but people can already file false reports just because they don't like people and I'm sure you have a way to deal with that.

They do - it's called reviewing the reports and throwing them out if they're wrong. How do you "review" a dodge after it already happened? How do you compensate the other players in the game for the abusive dodge after they already have to go back in queue and wait longer? You can't.

TLDR: You are the problem here that requires dodging be the way it is - not the dodging system. Maybe if people like you didn't try to abuse dodges to get out of games simply because you don't like them then there could be a little more lenient system for those who truly have unfortunate issues. But since people like you will abuse dodging like this, the system is designed to, as you say, make it not worth playing for you.

AnubisDeathtouchNov 30, 20191 votes

Well that was a long, condescending response that fundamentally misunderstood many of my points...

I don't dodge. In the last few months I've dodged exactly two times. I wasn't really talking about me.
If you go watch some diamond/plat/challenger streamers, you'll find that "dodge a lot" is common advice for moving up solo/duo, because they know that toxic teams, and players with absolutely no desire to cooperate with a team, can make a game very hard to carry, even when you're high-ranked duo.
in part, yes, I'm talking about blind pick. Irrelevant now, I suppose, since it's been invaded by bots. But my point, clearly, wasn't that I didn't get the lane I called, it was that sometimes people don't get to play the role they want and instead of talking, collaborating, or compromising with their teammates they just scream and bitch and grief. I've seen this happen in draft pick and ranked as well, though far less often; despite being locked in as a particular role, people will just decide they don't want to do it and lock in for a different lane, no discussion, leaving your team without a vital role. This is the kind of behavior that I'm talking about. Clearly your assuming I'm the salty person that I was talking about, and that I want to dodge because I didn't get my lane. Not the case. Period. Most of the time I play FIll, or in blind pick I just wait to see what the last remaining role is. WHAT I AM TALKING ABOUT is toxic players who get upset over little things during champion select and make it obvious to the rest of the team that they're going to be screaming and crying, and possibly griefing, for the entire game. I think I can speak for most players when I say: we came to play LoL, not babysit a child having a tantrum.
Every single time I've gotten these escalating punishments for dodging, it was because of client/ server/ internet issues. Your idea that these issues can't happen twice is absurd, especially when it's a Riot-side issue that you can't do anything about (like the recent post-update client bugs). Like I said, I don't dodge. How is someone who does not dodge getting dodge timers? The system is broken, that's how.
You seem to think people can't adapt to any change in the system at all. In fact you just seem to assume the worst about everything.
a common argument seems to be this "Don't do anything that MIGHT slightly increase queue times!!!!" It takes two minutes to get into a game; why are you so dead set on being able to rush into terrible games instead of fine-tuning a system where you have a little more patience and a much better game experience?

TLDR: Maybe you should try to you understand what a person is saying before you spew condescending bs at them. Your attitude is toxic. YOU are the problem.