Is inappropriate player behavior purposefully vague so that players are not able to play the system?

obsesse·Aug 10, 2016·1 votes·625 views

Over the years Riot has provided much useful information about punishment and other restrictions. I've appreciated much of this information, but recently I've found myself wondering just how well the current system works. This curiosity mainly stems from my perception of League being one of, if not the largest player communities in video games.

I do not envy Riot for the incredibly daunting task of correcting player behavior. I do, however, appreciate clarity and data in all forms. The information I am referring to include: how many reports, and types, leading up to each tier of punishment; time in between punishment; number of reports by average player

Does Riot fear that giving clarity about this will lead to players purposefully forgoing what they know will lead to punishment?

13 Comments

KüramaAug 10, 20162 votes

After being reported for a few games, the system will then investigate the player's chat logs and if numerous insults / toxicity is detected, the system will punish the player.
Reports are validated by the system, meaning any false reports will be thrown out and the false reporters' future reports will be taken less seriously by the system.
There are 4 tiers of punishment for toxicity.

10 game chat restriction
25 game chat restriction
2 week ban
Permanent ban

It is possible to skip the first or the second tier depending on the level of toxicity detected.

There are 5 tiers of punishment for Leavers.
5 minute 5 game Low Priority Queue
10 minute 5 game Low Priority Queue
20 minute 5 game Low Priority Queue
2 week ban
Permanent ban

It's not possible to skip tiers for Leavers, but increased leaving will result in faster tier escalation.

There are 2 tiers of punishments for intentional feeders
2 week ban
Permanent ban

It's not possible to skip tiers here either.

obsesseAug 10, 20161 votes

After being reported for a few games

This is vague.

the system will then investigate

This is vague.

investigate the player's chat logs and if numerous insults

This is vague.

toxicity is detected

This is vague

Reports are **validated **by the system

meaning any false reports will be thrown out

I could go on!

Maybe my initial post was not very clear either and that's on me. I was trying to highlight specific things in the punishment system that we haven't been given, but the information seems useful to players.

Like if people stop harassing others in chat because they know after 4 reports they will get banned, then it seems like the goal of the punishment system is accomplished.

KüramaAug 10, 20161 votes

It doesn't matter how many reports a player receives after 1 game. If it's 1 or 9 reports, it does not hasten punishment for the reported player.

Kei143Aug 10, 20161 votes

Riot actually did say that they fear the toxic people would game the system if they knew how many games to be toxic and then back off in toxicity before punishment.

Which is why they currently don't release that information.

I'm in disagreement with their choice as I feel like people inside the "decay phase" will just shut up, and will aid in reducing toxicity.

obsesseAug 10, 20161 votes

Those players might even notice that they win more games when they are quiet!

I might even enjoy some of these players in their "decay phase" as you put it; my alternative is simply muting them so they don't bother me anyway.

ModPrandineAug 10, 20161 votes

You've pretty much answered your own question here. Yes, there are some things that Riot purposefully keeps vague and unclear so that the less than savory players don't try to game the system and skirt around the edges of guiltiness and innocence. From the Tribunal FAQ:

Why doesn't Riot post a list of rules for what you can be banned for? We believe in giving the community what it needs to define itself and that includes what is acceptable or unacceptable behavior. Any rules provided by Riot Games could unnecessarily influence the community.

From Ulanopo's Knowledge Base:

The Summoners Code is too nebulous. I need to know what I cant say.

Riot is never going to tell you because people will use that information to skirt the edge of impropriety. Heres a simple list of things that will almost always get you punished:

Criticizing anyones skill.

Any racist, homophobic, sexist or ethnic slur.
Spamming. (A good rule of thumb is never say anything more than twice.)
Asking for reports.
Threatening, blackmailing or bullying your team in any way. This specifically includes any reference to going AFK, feeding or aiding the enemy.
Anything that could be construed as you not doing your best (Im not helping bot any more!, for example).
Whining, especially if its about your team not surrendering.

Basically, you should avoid anything you would not say at the funeral of a loved one or during the interview for your dream job.

obsesseAug 10, 20161 votes

This is amazing imo. I made a general post almost entirely in response to this post while I was mobile.

I think the playerbase would benefit from strict guidelines on how to act; this would give new and old players alike a universal system of measurement to abide by. It's very weird to say things like "nice flash" and have people take it very offensively, while other groups of players consider that polite pvp banter. While everyone knows that "you fucking scrub" is unacceptable, I don't think everyone is aware that requesting reports is bannable as well as giving constructive criticism on builds as it can be taken as passive aggressive without context.

Deep Terror NamiAug 10, 20162 votes

giving constructive criticism on builds as it can be taken as passive aggressive

There's a clear difference between constructive criticism and being a jerk. If someone says they don't want your criticism, just stop giving it, and if you can't say it in a respectful manner don't say it. Players that get punished for giving their so-called "constructive criticism" aren't being respectful about it at all.

obsesseAug 10, 20161 votes

You guys have made some great points that I want to highlight but right now I'm on mobile so it's a bit difficult.

There are some things against the rules that I've only just learned today, after playing for 4 years lol.

Also it seems that by letting the community determine toxic behavior we set ourselves up for an inherently toxic community that exists somewhere near the ambiguous line set by the people YOU interact with.

This also creates different metas of toxic levels, with some players allowing more toxic behavior in normals and ARAMs as opposed to ranked games. This, to me, is a huge problem.

KüramaAug 10, 20161 votes

Toxic behavior is treated equally in all modes be it on the Treeline, Rift or Abyss. This includes Co-op VS AI games as well.

Co-op VS AI, Twisted Treeline and Howling Abyss are typically less stressful and less toxic than SR.

obsesseAug 10, 20161 votes

I'm not disagreeing with you at all, I'm just pointing out some of the attitudes I've come across.

I've seen toxic behavior go relatively unnoticed (or players report the person who says report xxx for AFK instead of the actual AFK person) because "It's just normals man I'm not reporting anyone"

ModPrandineAug 10, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name= sepuuku,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=xvjuL25g,comment-id=000200000000,timestamp=2016-08-10T04:32:51.208+0000)

I'm not disagreeing with you at all, I'm just pointing out some of the attitudes I've come across.

I've seen toxic behavior go relatively unnoticed (or players report the person who says report xxx for AFK instead of the actual AFK person) because "It's just normals man I'm not reporting anyone"

Honestly I hate people like that, the ones who say stuff like "it's just 'insert game mode here' so who cares?" I mean. Those kinds of people I've found are not worth your time trying to argue or reason with honestly as nothing you say or do will change their minds sadly. As long as you're reporting the troublemakers when you see them then you can rest easy knowing that at least you've done your job.

obsesseAug 10, 20161 votes

Man I agree with you 100%!

I try to win every game I play, why the hell wouldn't I? I enjoy League more than almost any game I've ever played and I've lost and won plenty of games. Sometimes I play ARAM (or One For All) and it's clear from the get go that this will be a tough game, but if we get First Blooded or something I won't just automatically AFK because the game is unwinnable.

Plus, I have friends who actually value their stats in normals games/ARAMs/Treeline. Whenever a buddy has never lost a game (after 100!) on Tryndamere, it's fucking awesome. I don't care if it's on Treeline, or ARAM, or whatever! If I found out that her first loss came from a kid AFKing because "it's just ARAM chill," I'd be pissed!