How is it my fault when my ISP does maintenance?

Dogsparky·Oct 3, 2017·2 votes·1,649 views

I am curious as to why riot still thinks it is your fault when you get banned and you tell them in a support ticket what was going on, and yet when your ISP performs maintenance and shuts down your internet to do so, that is the players fault, in what way is it the players fault? and what they say is "well, it isn't fair to other players". it isn't fair when that person gets banned for something they have no control over, i don't lose internet, ever only when the ISP decides they need to do some stuff, that isn't playing with a bad internet connection so no one is playing knowing they will just get kicked out of the game because of the internet shorting out.

62 Comments

ModPeriscopeOct 3, 20176 votes

You mean, you got low priority queue? That happens over a series of games, not just one.

zPOOPzOct 3, 20174 votes

You do not get LPQ for a single game...

Also, it is very rare to even get banned from LeaveBuster or afk. If you actually get time banned from afk, your isp must have a very impressive record of maintenance...

No flash no lifeOct 3, 20174 votes

The way you think is exactly like how I used to think, and it took me a long time before I realized what was wrong with it. What you need right now is to step away from your own perspective and look at things from different perspectives to understand what Ventressredeemed meant.

I don't know if this'll help, but here's an example: 5 strangers, you included, are commited to buy 5$ priced package of drinks consisted of 5 bottles from a vending machine, each person paying 1$. Other 4 ppl tossed their coins in already, but when you took your coin out a wild goat jumps onto you, eats the coin and runs away. Is it your fault? Not really, you're a victim. But then the four others paid their share of cash already, so where's the drink they deserve? Why should they lose their cash because of one stranger who failed to deliver the coin?

We understand that sometimes misfortune falls upon you, and we believe it's morally forgivable. That is why one incident doesn't incur instant ban, and the small consequence is only there as a reminder that you should avoid playing when maintenance can potentially happen without prior notice. If it's happening more than once to the point where you're banned, that simply means there has already been too many players suffering as a result of your lack of presence from the game, thus - though you have our sympathy - we cannot afford to risk having more victims pile up.

OnlyYouCanHearMeOct 5, 20173 votes

Thank you so much for trying to help me explain this in a way that makes sense! And your example is a really good one, because in it, the ultimate cause of the people not having their drinks is the goat, which is like the ISP that shuts off the internet. But the person who ultimately has responsibility to the other four people is the person whose coin was eaten, because he is the one who made the agreement with the others.

OnlyYouCanHearMeOct 3, 20173 votes

While it may not be your fault that your ISP decided to perform maintenance and shut down your internet, it did create a much more difficult game for your 4 teammates. This can be anywhere from ruining the only match a player has time for, to costing someone their promotional series, all of which was completely out of their control, through no fault of their own, and was something they bore no responsibility for.

Like the others have commented, I'm a bit confused what you mean by banned. It takes more than one instance of leaving a game to be issued a ban by the LeaverBuster system. A first leave/afk will result in a warning issued by the system, a second instance in a short time frame can result in a player being played into Low Priority Queue for 5 games with a 5 minute wait time. Note, some instances of leaving, if the player has done so in the past, or if it is a ranked game, will bypass the warning and progress directly to the 5 minute LPQ. Continued leaves will increase the penalty to 10 minutes, and then 20 minutes, both at 5 games each. To even be considered for banning, you would have to have gone through at least 5 games of leaving/afking within a short time frame.

So, either you've had a lot of problems with your ISP, or you are referring to a low priority queue instead, or something else? If you are referring to the LPQ, Support is not going to take you out of it. While your ISP performing maintenance may have been out of your control, and may have been through no fault of your own, as it was your internet and your account that disconnected from the game, it was ultimately your responsibility. Any time we log into a match, we are committing to playing through to the end of the match, or are agreeing to face the consequences if we do not.

Edit: Fixed a number typo.

DogsparkyOct 3, 20171 votes

So punishing them for not going through with their game even though they can't do anything about it? you don't see it coming so when you go into the game you don't know when it will happen, so how is it my responsibility?

archerno1Oct 3, 20174 votes

{quoted}

So punishing them for not going through with their game even though they can't do anything about it? you don't see it coming so when you go into the game you don't know when it will happen, so how is it my responsibility?

Because you cant really prove your net went down. Anyone who ragequit can claim same

DogsparkyOct 3, 20171 votes

I have screenshots of my ISP directly telling me after my internet came up and they claimed that their internet went down during the time i was in the middle of a game, so yes i can "really prove"

archerno1Oct 3, 20175 votes

{quoted}

I have screenshots of my ISP directly telling me after my internet came up and they claimed that their internet went down during the time i was in the middle of a game, so yes i can "really prove"

Not really. Thats easy to fake

DogsparkyOct 3, 20171 votes

i have other forms as well, please leave this thread if you are calling me a liar

archerno1Oct 3, 20173 votes

{quoted}

i have other forms as well, please leave this thread if you are calling me a liar

It doesnt matter what u claim to have. Riot isnt gonna waste time investigating potentially fake evidence. It doesnt even matter, anything that happens on your account is your responsibility. You ruined game, you got punished. Deal with it

DogsparkyOct 3, 20172 votes

No it isn't, it isn't my responsibility to perform updates on my internet considering i have no control over it, i didn't ruin the game, my ISP doing that stuff does not then make me the person who ruined the game, yes it does matter what i claim to have considering all they need to do is contact my ISP and they will then say they were doing maintenance then, what you are saying is if you were around when someone got murdered and your finger prints were no where to be found at the scene and the cops arrested you, then you were the one who committed the crime essentially, even though the proof that your prints or DNA wasn't even near the guy who got murdered. i have proof and yet they don't acknowledge that, i have screenshots, i have a recorded call, hell even on their website they have the times that they were down for when they were doing this maintenance

DogsparkyOct 3, 20172 votes

Responsibility means taking ownership of my actions, if i did not do anything there was no action that meant i did anything with my internet or was playing with bad internet, then there is no responsibility besides riot understanding that i didn't do anything, just because they want to believe something doesn't mean that it is true, i can believe that riot is dumb but that doesn't make it true, especially to everyone else, well to most people, but that isn't exactly the point here where it is nothing i did or even bad internet but rather something that no one can control except for the ISP, look into the matter further and make sure for a fact that was in fact the case which is only a quick maybe 30 second google search for their maintenance time and there we go and it proves i did nothing

TerozuOct 3, 20171 votes

Actually all maintenance would be on their calandar. Maybe next time look at it.

DogsparkyOct 4, 20171 votes

It doesn't work like that with mine, only after it happens

BlutseucheOct 5, 20171 votes

Then change your ISP.

DogsparkyOct 5, 20171 votes

[{quoted}](name=End of the World,realm=EUW,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=iWpdwEch,comment-id=000500000000000000000000000100000000,timestamp=2017-10-05T16:01:47.769+0000)

Then change your ISP.

It isn't something that happens daily, read the damn comments

BlutseucheOct 6, 20171 votes

Happens often enough to get you into LPQ. Either fix this or stop playing if you dont want a LPQ.

DogsparkyOct 6, 20171 votes

[{quoted}](name=End of the World,realm=EUW,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=iWpdwEch,comment-id=00050000000000000000000000010000000000000000,timestamp=2017-10-06T11:40:37.864+0000)

Happens often enough to get you into LPQ. Either fix this or stop playing if you dont want a LPQ.

so you want me to fix my ISP doing maintenance? what am i supposed to do? run in through their wall like the kool aid man and say "stop doing maintenance" ? your argument is invalid

BlutseucheOct 7, 20171 votes

Ok, then quit playing LoL.

Noone cares why youre afk, it only matters that you are afk.

If you cant fix it, quit LoL then.

OnlyYouCanHearMeOct 3, 20172 votes

It's your responsibility because you chose to load into the match. As I said before, any time we log into a match, we are committing to playing through to the end of it, or are agreeing to face the consequences if we do not. It's not anybody else's responsibility to make sure that you are able to sit there and finish your match. It's yours. It's not Riot's. The entire premise behind the LeaverBuster system and LPQ is that players are not banned or punished overly harshly for extremely rare instances that are beyond their control. It punishes players for a pattern of repeated leaves.

Can you clarify what you mean by banned? And have you thought about contacting your ISP to see if they can give you a schedule on their maintenance times? Most of them can.

DogsparkyOct 3, 20171 votes

I mean within the past month or so my ISP like 3 times in a row decided to perform maintenance and blamed it on hurricane Irma, and no, it isn't my responsibility in this case when i go to play a game, it isn't anyone's, but i would expect riot to at least go and say "well he didn't actually leave and his internet isn't the problem it is the fact that his ISP deactivated the internet they provide for maintenance" but no, they blame it on the user and decide well he said he would be there for the game when he joined.

it is like banning them if some guy comes into the persons house and shoots them in the leg while they are playing or something and has to go to the hospital, that is not their responsibility to continue playing the game if their life is on the line, that is no one responsibilities but at least unban the person in this case something out of their control something that no one but their ISP can predict happens and yet they still say it is my responsibility, are argument here is really not that strong considering it can't be anyone's responsibility to play a game that physically and literally cannot be done due to problems out of their hands, maybe if someone knew that their internet was bad or they have a bad router and yet they still try to play and blame it on their ISP that would put the responsibility on the user to get a better router or do something to fix their internet connection, but that is not the case here and nothing can be done when it happens

OnlyYouCanHearMeOct 3, 20173 votes

You are still overlooking the fact that no one is ever banned for one, or even three, times leaving a game. To be banned by the system you would have to have left considerably more matches.

And yes, it is your responsibility. I will repeat myself for a third time. Any time we log into a match, we are committing to playing through to the end of it, or are agreeing to face the consequences if we do not. While I can understand your frustration, it is ultimately YOUR responsibility. If this has been done by your ISP three times, then you should have taken the initiative after the first time to contact them and ensure that they notified you prior to shutting off your internet. If you did not do that, then you cannot say that you had no way of knowing that it was going to happen.

DogsparkyOct 4, 20171 votes

So people are facing the consequences for doing something they didn't do? That areguement couldn't be more invalid than the world is flat,and yes I have Contaced they still don't notify me, I have said I have contacted them to see what happened, do you not read my comments?

OnlyYouCanHearMeOct 5, 20172 votes

You are facing the consequence for something you didn't do. You didn't finish those matches. Yes, I am reading your comments, but the story is only coming out in bits and pieces over time, which makes it difficult to figure out exactly what happened. And as I have said multiple times, you do not get banned through LeaverBuster for 3 instances of leaving. Three left games will, if you've never left any other matches, push you into the 20 minute Low Priority Queue. You wouldn't be anywhere near a banning at that point. So, what else happened?

HalcyonDwellerOct 3, 20171 votes

If you hadn't had a history of disconnecting this wouldn't have been a problem. Leaverbuster gives everyone a few chances where it overlooks a DC because Riot knows that ISP outages and other unusual shit happens. You used up your chances already by leaving other games of your own volition.

Consider it a delayed punishment, and learn from the experience. If you don't waste your chances by breaking the rules, you won't be punished for leaving again when an accident actually occurs.

DogsparkyOct 4, 20171 votes

And yet I have never actually left a game on my own, it all has been ISP trying to get better internet coverage throug maintence so outages don't happen again, don't accuse me of leaving games unless you know what happened

HalcyonDwellerOct 4, 20172 votes

If your ISP consistently causes you to DC then it isn't a suitable ISP to play league of legends through. Whether you intend to or not, demonstrating to Riot that you repeatedly ruin others' games with your poor connection is grounds for punishment / suspension in Riot's eyes.

DogsparkyOct 4, 20171 votes

they haven't started doing this since hurricane Irma hit they are blaming it on hurricane Irma, and considering i literally can't get any new internet here i am stuck wondering when their next maintenance is that is if they aren't done

HalcyonDwellerOct 4, 20171 votes

If they are the only option for internet provider and they are providing crappy service I'm fairly certain you can take the issue up with anti-trust laws. They will probably get in trouble and be forced to warn you ahead of time for planned maintenance in the future.

DogsparkyOct 4, 20171 votes

I AM NOT RUING GAMES. i am not the one doing anything to my internet, that doesn't mean i am ruining games, if i clicked leave game in the options menu, then yes i would be ruining a game, but if i literally sit there and do nothing, then i am not ruining anything, by your logic you are ruining my life by coming up with BS like that "you are ruining games", but in reality you aren't

HalcyonDwellerOct 4, 20173 votes

Your account stopped participating in the game, no? That is all that really matters in terms of the game being ruined. It doesn't matter how, only that it did happen. And consistently.

Stop taking this personally, I'm not Riot, and I'm not accusing you or judging you. I'm simply explaining how the system works currently and explaining how it could be affecting you.

DogsparkyOct 5, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Your account stopped participating in the game, no? That is all that really matters in terms of the game being ruined. It doesn't matter how, only that it did happen. And consistently.

Stop taking this personally, I'm not Riot, and I'm not accusing you or judging you. I'm simply explaining how the system works currently and explaining how it could be affecting you.

then it needs a new system to figure out what went wrong, was it the ISP going down, or data packets from the router stopped or what, it just stupid how it is the player being punished for something that literally shouldn't be an issue, riot shouldn't punish those who everyone once in a while has an ISP goes and does that type of stuff you cannot predict, if my country all of a sudden started being bombed by north korea (just using as an example) would it still be my responsibility to stay in the game or should i go and find shelter and help so i don't die in real life, the game and in fact nothing is more important than someones life so why should someone get banned because they were fighting for their life?

HalcyonDwellerOct 5, 20172 votes

If you can calmly propose a new system that is likely to work, and that would not be exploitable, I will support the idea.

Right now you're just exaggerating though. The system accounts for the possibility of a few instances of accidental or life threatening situations that would cause or require a DC. Anything past those few instances is considered a consistent problem and Riot blocks people for that because it affects games.

It's not just about you, it's about the potential teammates who's games could be ruined if you become disconnected.

DogsparkyOct 5, 20171 votes

{quoted}

If you can calmly propose a new system that is likely to work, and that would not be exploitable, I will support the idea.

Right now you're just exaggerating though. The system accounts for the possibility of a few instances of accidental or life threatening situations that would cause or require a DC. Anything past those few instances is considered a consistent problem and Riot blocks people for that because it affects games.

It's not just about you, it's about the potential teammates who's games could be ruined if you become disconnected.

Oh it isn't about me, but there are still a few times not just with me where it may happen a few times in a row each day, like one day my dad has an heart attack, then the next day my sister just got mugged and then all of a sudden an earthquake or something

HalcyonDwellerOct 5, 20173 votes

I mean no offense but that sounds absurd. The chances of all of that happening to one family in such a short time span are extremely low.

Add that to your mention of hurricane Irma. It's as if you're just making up excuses.

I'm starting to think you're pulling my leg.

DogsparkyOct 6, 20171 votes

{quoted}

I mean no offense but that sounds absurd. The chances of all of that happening to one family in such a short time span are extremely low.

Add that to your mention of hurricane Irma. It's as if you're just making up excuses.

I'm starting to think you're pulling my leg.

i am not saying that happened to me i am saying there may be reasons in which why something like that would happen. and whether you want to believe it or not, my ISP has blatantly and openly said " we have shut down internet due to hurricane irma" just because you say it isn't true doesn't make you right, so go do some god damn research

HalcyonDwellerOct 6, 20174 votes

So you brought up a bunch of irrelevant excuses that never happened as hypothetical reasons in order to claim that Riot should account for multiple emergencies in a short time span... The likelihood of that much misfortune in such a short time span is absurdly low, and thus it is not sufficient evidence to make such a claim.

I'm sorry dude, but I already explained it:

{quoted}

If you hadn't had a history of disconnecting this wouldn't have been a problem. Leaverbuster gives everyone a few chances where it overlooks a DC because Riot knows that ISP outages and other unusual shit happens....

You used up your chances already whether by leaving or by getting DC'd (it doesn't matter to Riot nor your teammates who suffered because of your connection) and your account was deemed too unreliable to allow into any more games with teammates.

DogsparkyOct 8, 20171 votes

{quoted}

So you brought up a bunch of irrelevant excuses that never happened as hypothetical reasons in order to claim that Riot should account for multiple emergencies in a short time span... The likelihood of that much misfortune in such a short time span is absurdly low, and thus it is not sufficient evidence to make such a claim.

I'm sorry dude, but I already explained it:

You used up your chances already whether by leaving or by getting DC'd (it doesn't matter to Riot nor your teammates who suffered because of your connection) and your account was deemed too unreliable to allow into any more games with teammates.

then blame the ISP not the person, the person did not disconnect, they suffered but i had nothing to do with it, you have no argument here

HalcyonDwellerOct 8, 20171 votes

There IS no argument here. Riot's policies are clearly outlined. All I did was explain them.

{quoted}

You used up your chances already whether by leaving or by getting DC'd (it doesn't matter to Riot nor to your teammates who suffered because of your connection) and your account was deemed too unreliable to allow into any more games with teammates.

DogsparkyOct 9, 20171 votes

{quoted}

There IS no argument here. Riot's policies are clearly outlined. All I did was explain them.

their policies shouldn't matter, if i was getting bombed by north korea, would it still be my responsibility to stay in the game despite nuclear bombs going off outside my house?

HalcyonDwellerOct 9, 20171 votes

If you hadn't disconnected consistently prior to that then no, it wouldn't count against you.

We're done here. I'm not wasting any more time explaining this to you. Take it up with Riot or get over it. The policy is there for a reason. People would abuse disconnecting if Riot didn't have it that way.

Either propose a better solution or let it go.

DogsparkyOct 9, 20171 votes

{quoted}

If you hadn't disconnected consistently prior to that then no, it wouldn't count against you.

We're done here. I'm not wasting any more time explaining this to you. Take it up with Riot or get over it. The policy is there for a reason. People would abuse disconnecting if Riot didn't have it that way.

Either propose a better solution or let it go.

i never said it happens every day, it only happened three times yet that means a ban apparently

HalcyonDwellerOct 9, 20171 votes

3 warnings seems fair enough to me. Honestly it's not Riot that you should be pissed with. In your position I would legit get a lawyer and have them call the ISP. maybe read the ISP's Terms of Service first to make sure that they did actually make a commitment to you to provide uninterrupted service.

YerroFeverOct 4, 20171 votes

You have to have a prior history of DCing to have this happen. I once got hit by a punishment because of Verizon's crappy internet cutting out fairly frequently and once I swapped ISP's and stopped DCing, even when I do get the random DC, I don't get hit by leave buster because I'm not disconnecting once every few days anymore but now disconnecting once every few months.

The reason why is because Riot can't tell if you're disconnecting your modem or if your ISP is really f-ing up.

DogsparkyOct 4, 20171 votes

No, just my ISP constantly wanting better internet so they do stuff like this during a thunder storm or something or some big natural disaster, and what is hard to tell if my ISP is doing maintenance by doing some research for less than 2 minutes and go to their website and see "oh hey they did maintenance that day, it is all over their website, he wasn't lying" or just taking 5 minutes to call the ISP themselves, so yes you can tell that it is the ISPs fault and not the modem, your argument is invalid

YerroFeverOct 4, 20173 votes

{quoted}

No, just my ISP constantly wanting better internet so they do stuff like this during a thunder storm or something or some big natural disaster, and what is hard to tell if my ISP is doing maintenance by doing some research for less than 2 minutes and go to their website and see "oh hey they did maintenance that day, it is all over their website, he wasn't lying" or just taking 5 minutes to call the ISP themselves, so yes you can tell that it is the ISPs fault and not the modem, your argument is invalid

No, the expectation that Riot spend time baby sitting every single account that disconnects to see if it's an ISP issue or you unplugging your modem is unrealistic.

It's an inefficient use of their time. They have better things to monitor than your ISP status.