I love playing with toxic teammates! NO SARCASM!

SirPurrr·8/23/2017, 12:34:20 AM·47 votes·2,739 views

I think the punishment system is totally broken in edge cases. It doesn't differentiate between toxicity and disagreement well. By default, it considers you the toxic player if you say something others are offended by even if they have zero objective basis. It encourages crybullies and stifles constructive speech because the AI is not smart enough and reports have too much power (with the accuser having no way of getting a fair trial or even a way to defend himself realistically - support will just parrot random banalities). If you say that someone's build is objectively wrong because it completely skips VS vs a team building MR, people get mad. They have absolutely no basis to get mad and that's a reflection of their inability to handle feedback (a sign of emotional immaturity). Just because you're direct and confident in your statements, others will often retaliate with "but you're 2-6" or "stfu I think this is best and idgaf what you want" or "let me play my champion and stop harassing me" (lol?). I've talked about it in many other threads before. It's a joke that crybullies can create so much damage and they're given a powerful platform through the report system.

If someone doesn't resort to personal attacks but is simply direct and honest, he is at odds with the game's report system. Those qualities are actively discouraged in this game. Even defending others from unfair abuse, such as saying "our jungler isn't your slave and spam pinging your lane as well as berating him in all chat will not help" is likely to get retaliatory reports. Riot is lying when they say that reports have no merit by themselves. It's patently false as other edge cases have shown especially as it relates to non-meta picks. Reports matter a lot and change the sensitivity thresholds. It still counts against you if there are a lot of other crybullies feeling offended by everything which isn't sugarcoated and super delicate. It's not even practical to meet that standard in a real time game unless you die a lot.

**However, the Honor system is a great idea. ** Positive reinforcement is just more effective in general. It empowers players and gives them something to aspire to. Psychological studies show the power of feeling a sense of empowerment/autonomy over and over. It's probably why positive reinforcement is far more effective and creates more lasting change instead of an annoyed fear response. More importantly, it's easier to recognize positive behavior and build a system around that with HUMAN INPUT (which is much more likely to be reliable for positive actions than negative ones since people aren't objective when they're pissed off (whether the emotion is justified or not)). Furthermore, if there is unfair bias in who is honored (maybe it's too often people champions with game changing ults.), it's still just a perk and not going to stop you from chatting or playing the game. Basically, the damage is far lower when there are issues and it doesn't stifle expression etc.

So WHY do I prefer playing with a few toxic players? It's much easier to get honored! :D **Toxic players give me a chance to rise to the occasion and demonstrate my emotional maturity. I can guide the team towards a more positive path Lux - it's like a minigame (think of it as trying to keep a car on the racetrack). ** If there are 1-2 toxic players on my team, I can try to defuse the situation. Even just being a normal player and not giving up often gets me honors for "tiltproof." When it's 4+ toxic players, it's a problem though. The team will be too bitter to honor anyone and I won't be able to defuse anything but that's rare.

37 Comments

Beas7ie8/23/2017, 12:42:41 AM16 votes

No no no. The system DOES NOT consider you the "toxic player" if you try to give some help or advice so long as you do it NICELY. If someone has a bad build saying something like "Hey blankity blank X isn't really good or him or her, maybe you should try Y item instead" even if they disagree and are like "STFU I'll build what I want" the system still won't consider you "toxic" as long as you were nice about your advice and/or don't constantly harass people about their builds.

Lock On8/23/2017, 6:18:24 AM8 votes

Shit-talking helps make the game a bit more enjoyable, in my taste. Those who don't want to hear it can mute, but I'll never understand the coddling babysitter mentality Riot has in their policy. I have a more enjoyable experience playing call of duty with fewer rewards and more whiny shits because there's hardly any restraints (should definitely avoid racism and whatnot, obviously.)

ModPeriscope8/23/2017, 12:54:00 AM5 votes

"Most of the punishment system is broken in edge cases"

I feel edge cases are probably a small portion of those reported, based on what we see on the boards.

If you like playing with toxic players, that's great! You're free to report or not report what you want.

rtbf2256182418/23/2017, 10:15:04 AM4 votes

Just got off a Riot Support ticket on a Chat Ban i had where i explained this exact issue and some of the Support workers told me to piss off and the others avoided the solutions/questions i proposed, just parroting their "Finality" of my punishment as if i was denying or something which i was definetly not.

Seriously frustrating.

Synnx78/23/2017, 10:09:19 AM4 votes

Remember when someone here got perma banned because he said to himself " Fuck me, i fucked up so hard this time! " . Riot unbanned him while also looking like shit

Zëd Lęppelin8/23/2017, 9:08:37 AM3 votes

Lol. You're probably the guy saying something like 'omfg this noob Janna, hasn't even got ardent censer pls uninstall and kys' then acting the victim and saying you're trying to give advice when you get penalised.

ChuShoe8/25/2017, 10:31:07 AM2 votes

Sorry, all I read was "yay, free key fragments!"

Joking aside, the spam pinging jungler and "the jungler isn't your slave" statement is all too familiar to me. If you're calling me, a jungler main bad, because you're feeding, grow some thicker skin, and try to do better, and play defensively until I can come and help you. It's not my job to win lane for you, I'm just supposed to make a play happen to the best of my ability.

Narzal8/23/2017, 11:39:54 AM2 votes

I agree with the title, but not the honor wait for weeks, months to get a reward feeling feel, saw the patch for honor, thought it was going just to allow you to honor multiple people or the enemy, nope, just notify you if you missed honor cause you exited the lobby fast, like everyone usually does... and was utterly disappointed.

The notification was really used for when you got a flurry of variety of honor and that everyone thought out who to honor usually based on what you said at the end lobby and what you built at the end of your bad game, let's be real here, honor sucks. it'll never be good as the old one and it seems very forcedful of players to act good when they just aren't honest with themselves like the toxic players, eventually they'll explode and all that honor is meaningless cause you lose all of it for being reported by those with no emotional intelligence.

The report system is like a trial, where anything you say can and will be held against you, so you just have to silver tongue everything or joke around teasing the haters, also I'll be honest with you, the way you worded it defused bothers me, generally I see you as smallfry (lol I'm sorry) when you come between 2 people arguing like settle down u 2, I strive to know who would win the heated argument for entertainment purposes because it's just enjoyable.

Sure you may have calmed them down a bit, but they are tense, on the edge you know, holding back because of you getting in the way, you didn't inspire them to focus/play better, there's not always going to be a person for them to be defused since they didn't over come it. and the 4+toxic players, if you can't beat em, join em to lead em and make the most of it, I had this Draven and Swain doing badly, getting flamed by their team telling him vision is gonna make you win bs, and he said something Confucius like. My team told that we need vision to win, so here I am,Vision is the key to a pathway of Victory, while the swain said, and here are the salty rivers of my people, to guide us along the elusive way, 6item 2049 &item 3070 lol

TwitchInMyPants8/23/2017, 8:37:21 AM2 votes

Eh I think they might be a little harsh with reports but I'd rather that than there being no issue with keyboard warriors typing at each other instead of playing with their flame bringing down the morale of the team

No one should be in trouble for suggesting builds or playstyles, its simply suggestions and in some contexts can be bossy behavior, but that's not "unsportsmanlike" conduct. However I think saying "Wow you suck" would qualify as negative behavior, shouldn't be banworthy but that negative behavior should escalate into being harassment if you're just going on and on and on about how a specific teammate is terrible and should uninstall and whatnot. Even if you aren't attacking anything about their character or insulting their intelligence, you're insulting their gameplay without being constructive and repeating that over and over is a targeted, negative behavior.

I see people regularly be like "Wow I called someone bad/said gg ez and got banned" and that's rarely ever the full story, but if you do that all the time it makes sense it would escalate since you're regularly being negative. Personally though I think it should only become a ban when targeted harassment is the problem, I know mute exists but it doesn't stop you from remembering what you just read and some players have qualms about muting because they don't want to cut communication in a team game. Believe it or not the changes Riot has made has gradually made the League community less toxic, maybe they can pull the sensitivity of reports back but they've gone mostly in the right direction from what I can tell.

MagikarpIsBoss8/23/2017, 8:01:16 PM2 votes

I just got a 14 day ban because of one game. 2 people on my team were toxic as hell for no reason. One was feeding and the other was calling the others and I racist shit the whole game. Because I was annoyed (the one that was feeding was doing it in my lane vs a draven, which made the game hell for me) I did say some "toxic" things. According to what riot told me, they said to ignore it and report them. Its pretty hard to ignore someone inting your lane on purpose. I checked and these players got no ban. However, I got a 14 day ban for toxicity from one game. My worst insult was probably calling them autistic or something like that. Apparently with no prior punishments that is bannable but being racist and inting is perfectly ok? I even got honored by the other player in the game (one person also went afk) so it was only the two people being toxic that reported me. I didnt say much in all chat either so no one on the enemy team would have. I got a 14 day ban from two false reports in a single game. If you think that Riot's ban system is fair/ reasonable, the I have no idea what to say to you.

ModKnightsKemplar8/23/2017, 5:48:16 PM1 votes

I appreciate a direct, honest player. There's a fine line between that and a rude player, though. The line between "direct" and "rude" is often hotly contested, in my experience.

Being direct can be a negative thing in the right (or wrong?) context. Direct criticism for a teammate that isn't doing well is in that category for me, and I appreciate Riot trying to make a more positive experience for people. I would love to see a specific example of punishment for a player that is just being "honest and direct" so we could have a real case study to discuss.

HentEye8/23/2017, 5:55:03 AM1 votes

The report system actually decides to take action on reports if the user says a trigger word(s), and based on prior offenses.

PinkSalt8/24/2017, 1:54:14 AM1 votes

This is all too well written and too true, Riot NEEDS to look at this. This cannot be ignored! I personally think riot should give those an option to talk to the person who decided to ban /punish them for being direct (not even passive aggressive) Rather than keep themselves hidden and make us run to support who, quite frankly, never seem to sympathize or even attempt to understand what exactly went down. I was just in a 9 day argument (awful) in a post with a person who couldn't comprehend literary context, which I think is very important. Which is why the support system REALLY needs to understand it, too.

Praiseful8/23/2017, 4:36:17 PM1 votes

Then How about spam ping? Yes u can mute the ping, but it gets annoying when i see one teammate spam ping for every game. It its just tired to deal with. -. -