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Trash talk in solo queue: the great debate

Calixto·2/15/2018, 6:09:36 PM·2 votes·1,167 views

Hey everyone,

So I'm currently in the middle of writing a piece for Riot's EU League of Legends site about the concept of "trash talk" as it applies to solo queue/normal play outside of the competitive scene. Obviously there's already been a ton of debate on the subject: some think it's a vital part of the game, others think it should be done away with. Some prefer to mute everyone right off the bat actually, others actually enjoy the banter. But I wanted to hear a bit more perspective from you:

Do you trash talk in your LoL games? If so, why? If not, why not?
In your personal experience, what kinds of interactions qualify as “trash talk”?
Is there a point where trash talk crosses the line into toxicity, or is it toxic by default?
How is trash talk different when a pro player does it vs when someone in your game does it?
Do you think trash talk has a place in the League of Legends community, or is it something that should be done away with?

Let me know what you think - if I'm thinking of including your words in the piece I'll make sure to hit you up first.

10 Comments

Jo0o2/15/2018, 6:20:30 PM3 votes

I'll take a shot at this.

Good trash talk, for players that want to do so, should highlight specific plays and comment on them _once. _ If something crazy goes down, you can mention it. Repeating yourself throughout the game verges on harassment and spam. Good trash talk should be easy to shake off, and not be designed to make somebody feel shitty about themselves or the game. A mature individual should be able to laugh at being the target of good trash talk. The motivation of good trash talk should be to exult over your own victory.

Examples:

"Nice try!" when your opponents fail a dive. "BOW THE FUCK DOWN" when you make a huge outplay. "Feel free to visit again" when you win a 1v2 gank situation or similar.

Bad trash talk involves harassment, commenting on a player's general skill, or making personal insults. It's all well and good if you can laugh this off, but the motivation of bad trash talk is to lessen people's enjoyment of the game or make them feel worse about themselves.

Examples:

"You should uninstall" or "refund your skin" after winning lane. "GG EZ" after winning the game, with the possible exception of if it's been a huge struggle and you're clearly joking. Or any of the above "good" examples being used constantly or even spammed.

I believe in League, as well as RL sports and other competitive games, we should all have the potential to have fun in a given match. I trash talk when I'm feeling jubilant about how circumstances have transpired, but never in a way designed to make my opponents feel shitty. Of course, if they DO feel shitty, such is life, but that's not my main goal. Does that make sense?

YokoNomi2/15/2018, 6:28:02 PM2 votes

Trash talk is speculative. It all comes down to whether or not the people involved are on a mutual understanding with the conversation, and as to whether or not they generally accept this kind of behavior. Obvious differences of toxic trash talk and common trash talk aside, I feel like this is impossible to answer definitively. If we're talking entirely on the basis of trash talk, this will always vary from player to player, as everyone takes a conversation in their own way, whether it be good or bad. It's impossible to have a clear answer, because of that little issue.

The real question is whether or not the person who dislikes the trash talk willingly makes that known, and whether or not the one doing the trash talking acknowledges and backs off. If they do, it's good. If they don't and are aware of that targetted player's disinterest, then it may as well be considered toxic behavior at that point.

Sorry if my sentencing structure is weird. Admittedly playing Monster Hunter World while typing this.

ModKnightsKemplar2/15/2018, 10:31:47 PM2 votes

Good trash talk can only happen when rapport has already been established between players. If you go in game quietly, make a huge play and then start talking smack afterward, that's in poor taste imo.

If you start the game with some sick smack talk and it's well received, then you can continue imo. But good trash talk, like many other things in life, can only happen if both parties are agreed on it. A good way to ensure that you're well received is to hype up the silliness. If I'm trash talking you on Taric, I'm gonna say something like "you seemed rather dazzled by that play, Draven. You okay over there? ;)"

On a personal note, I don't mind a bit of trash talk, but I rarely initiate it.

Modl Ryden l2/15/2018, 10:22:44 PM1 votes

Those are some good questions and I'd happy to answer them.

No I don't trash talk in my games unless the enemy team provokes. My take on trash talk is that if you can't talk the talk then don't even try. Nothing screams low self esteem than someone 'trash talking' only to be shut down because they couldn't keep up.
Anything along the lines of, "get good", or "my champ is better than your champ" as in blind pick where you mirror match or, "did you like that fancy play? (like a flash ulti or something). It's a constructive form of trash talking in a way that promotes the other player to get better without tearing them down.
When KYS, gg ez and ?? get's spammed on all chat through a macro. The macro alone is reportable.
Trash talk in solo queue or in casuals is astronomically different than pro players. Pro players whether it's LCS or the Challenger ladder, they know each other on a more personal basis, as they are seen playing against or with one another so frequently through their streams and stream hosting, or onstage where later they will come in contact, face-to-face, at the end of the match, so trash talking is their way of joking around and keeping things competitive.
I supposed, it's been deeply rooted in all PvP games and it's a way for players to vent off their real world frustrations. But it's gotten to the point where it's considered funny on all mediums, twitch, in game, discord, youtube, to tell people to kill themselves over the internet. Which is something I'm against and should be a punishable offence as it's similar to that of people provoking others to commit suicide irl where there have been a few cases that ended with the provoker being jailed for assisting in the other persons death. Having players reported on the news to have committed suicide because a community that unjokingly shoves it in their face isn't a reality I'm willing to face.