Should you be heavily punished for afking when bullied?

Ramen226·Sep 6, 2017·2 votes·629 views

Preface: yes i muted chat. Yes i muted pings. I'm talking mostly about actions here. I'm not blaming riot for banning me because an automated system can't detect if a player is getting bullied, it's only a thought experiment.

Should a player that has a team flaming, mia, spamming, and target trolling be punished for leaving the game? Or, should a player who afk's from a game that has someone feeding be punished?

I'd like to reiterate that this isn't saying how the system SHOULD operate rather, if you were omnipotent and your day job was to dish out punishments, hat would you do about players being bullied in game?

Secondary question: If at least 2 or 3 members of your team are raging at you to afk and you do, should you receive a punishment?

41 Comments

DariusDemiurgeSep 6, 20173 votes

You signed up to play a match, you didn't play the match out.

Yes. To the guillotine with you rabble.

Ramen226Sep 6, 20171 votes

I signed up to play a game of league of legends, not to sit there and have my own team taunt me all game.

Playing league =/= letting people waste my time (or at least thats my perspective)

If the argument was that is it wrong to leave a match you're losing then i'd understand your logic, but the point i that we're (the other players in thee game with me) not even playing league at this point. They were fucking with me and there wasn't anything to do about it.

The sides are, yes it should be ok to leave a match if the other players are bullying you, and no its not ok because you'd be punishing players that aren't bullying you.

Nowhere in the gamaes I'm talking about is the main goal for the members of our team to destroy the enemy base. It degraded into them trying to annoy me, and me trying not to get tilted. THAT is not what i signed up for. (in my opinion)

jwebb0113Sep 6, 20171 votes

you shouldnt be subjected to the harassment and bullying ...

if you leave you cant report. so they get away with it.

no matter for why you leave you are subjected to the leave buster system

in games where i find myself in these situations i will just afk farm a side lane or jungle away from the team and action in game. refuse to play with and just let it end.

if it is bad enough i dont wanna be part of it i have the right to leave and afk game but i do so knowing im subjected to leave buster

Ramen226Sep 6, 20171 votes

There will always be toxic players though. Reporting might help someone else somewhere out in the ether avoid that specific person, but they'll more likely than not just get stuck with one of the other million and a half people spamming kys, afk, and running it down mid.

Normally i do essentially afk farm instead of quitting out though.

DrugothSep 6, 20173 votes

Leaving the game will always he frowned upon regardless of the circumstances. Remember, you can't report those players for harassing you if you leave the game.

ChermorgSep 6, 20172 votes

Also, there’s always a mute button...

Ramen226Sep 6, 20171 votes

I said i muted pings and chat. Literally the first sentence. Talking about actions

scazzmanSep 8, 20172 votes

{quoted}

Also, there’s always a mute button...

did you read the VERY FIRST LINE of the OP?

PapercutOmenSep 8, 20172 votes

they often dont read it, they skim so they can immediately find someway to "dismiss" it. It doesnt happen to them (or rarely happens to them) so its treated as a "Not -MY- problem" attitude, and thus dismissed/rejected/minimized.

Besides, OP finds a flaw in the perfect pristine community that is LoL So the sooner problems like this can be dismissed, the sooner people can go back to convincing themselves that Leagues community isnt winning the "#1 most toxic community" award on a daily basis. they can just go back to treating people like OP as whining fools who have no idea what they are talking about....

zPOOPzSep 6, 20172 votes

Well, once you fullmute, the flaming and raging should already stopped. As for gameplay toxicity, e.g. if someone follow you around or give the enemies your location, endure it, go afk farm close to base or something.

Tbh, i would rather sit through 20-30 more minutes of that toxic game simply pretend to actively trying to play (after a period of time, your death timer should be high enough for you to alt tab and go browse the board....if you know what i mean) and have the ability to report those players than go afk and lose the ability to report anyone at post game.

To answer your question though, in a perfect world, with an omnipotent LoL god, you should be able to kick the toxic shits out of game instead of forced to afk yourself.

KanzlerSep 6, 20172 votes

The mute button does wonders. Pity it does nothing against afkers.

If i only had 1 report, I would report the afker over the shit-talker.

zPOOPzSep 6, 20172 votes

What a waste of report....

Leavebuster will kick in whether the person is reported or not. Reporting for afk will go nothing more than what LB already automatically detected.

ChermorgSep 6, 20171 votes

It actually does use reports to cement edge cases. Basically if the system is on the edge as to if it was afk or just erratic movement, it'll use reports to decide yes they were afking basically or not.

Ramen226Sep 6, 20171 votes

Not talking about chat. Talking about action

Zed geniusSep 6, 20171 votes

Yes, those players should be perma-banned

Ramen226Sep 6, 20171 votes

Which players? The one who leaves because his team is annoying him or the players doing the annoying? And why should they be perma banned when they aren't making the game a worse environment?

Zed geniusSep 6, 20171 votes

the ones who rage quit in games

Ramen226Sep 6, 20171 votes

Why should players who leave ruined games be permabanned?

Someone is going through games actively ruining them via intentionally feeding, griefing etc, but the player who is actively avoiding toxic behavior is the one that needs to be banned?

LauchmelderSep 6, 20171 votes

Yes, you should get punished.

Ramen226Sep 6, 20171 votes

What's your line of reasoning for that?

LauchmelderSep 6, 20171 votes

You queued up for a game so you're gonna play it. If you go afk you are deliberately handicapping your team, which is against the rules.

Ramen226Sep 6, 20171 votes

You're ignoring the people actively ruining the game, and instead focusing on the player avoiding and choosing not to give in to the people wasting their time.

Someone runs down lanes the entire game and another person quits because they don't want to sit there for 20 minutes waiting for the game to end. Why would you say the person who leaves the ruined game should be punished?

LauchmelderSep 6, 20171 votes

Because he is breaking the rules. If you don't agree with the rules...

The door is over there ->

Just because that guy robs the Bank I want to get a loan from doesn't give me the right to punch his teeth out. I can try to stop him from leaving with reasonable force (reporting in lol)

Ramen226Sep 6, 20171 votes

"just because someone is robbing a bank doesn't give me the right to punch his teeth in"

Except... you can...

The funny part is that punching a guy in the teeth who is robbing a bank would more be akin to drop hacking or whatever. My solution to just leaving would be if someone is robbing a bank i walk out of the bank.

And here we go again with "you broke the rules the door is over there" and you STILL ignore the other guy ruining the game. The game is unplayable at that point, why should i be punished for not playing?

LauchmelderSep 7, 20171 votes

I don't ignore the other guy, I report him. And I will report you for destroying our already handicapped chance at winning even more.

A 4v5 is winable, a 3v5 just because you think you can afk due to your own selfish decision of 'he destroyed my game' is not.

The first guy destroys the game for 3 players and you and you destroy the game even more for the other 3.

Ramen226Sep 7, 20171 votes

the first guy ruined the game for 4 people. And i understand wanting to report me for afking if your line of reasoning is because "we can still win."

And if i know winning is still possible I'll definitely play it out 9 times out of 10. But the tenth time when its the scenario of guy runs down lanes until he isnt worth gold and then either afk's or griefs in other ways where I decide its not worth it to waste time and energy on a clearly lost cause.

But once again if i feel that a win is anywhere near possible (or if its ranked ill play it out nomatter what) then of course it'd be dumb to afk.

LauchmelderSep 7, 20171 votes

There is a major flaw in your line of thought:

You are NOT who decides if a game is winable or not. That is up to a democratic vote in your team.

If your team decides to open mid (everybody on your team votes for it) you are free to do so.

If even one person disagrees to opening a lane you either play it out or try to surrender.

PapercutOmenSep 8, 20172 votes

But you are really missing the point. The players harrassing him decided to stop trying to WIN the game. They feel its more fun to run down mid, intentionally sabotage their teammates, do ANTYHING to intentionally cripple their own teammates. At that point they are no longer trying to win, they have decided that they dont want to win. I have played in the past against a vayne who stole kills from everyone, got into the enemy's base. Then intentionally threw the match because, in her own words "This team doesnt deserve the win" all because the team wouldnt bend over and kiss her ass.

and players like the ones spoken...Good luck with TRYING to surrender, Please dont BS with this idea that a player that intentionally feeds, flames and harrasses, spends the entire game trolling. Dont tell me they have never intentionally voted "NO" On surrender, NOT because they want to win, NOT because they think we have a chance. They vote NO for one reason: To KEEP YOU IN THE MATCH. The longer they can keep you in the match, the longer they can hold you hostage, the longer they can intentionally push your buttons and do anyting they can to make your game as miserable as possible. whats their favorite line "No surrendering: You are trash so you can suffer for it" or something along that line "suffer for how bad you are" So if you have players intentionally working thier best to make you as miserable as possible. Stop acting like these same bullies are going to give you a choice. The longer they can hold you hostage, the more they can do everything in their power to make your game a living hell and send you into your next match tilted and ready to pop.

LauchmelderSep 8, 20171 votes

I'm not missing a point.

If you afk because someone is trolling you are the exact same shithead to the rest of your team as the troll.

Ramen226Sep 9, 20171 votes

Which i can understand with and sympathize with that.

On the other hand it's not a game of league of legends anymore when 20% of your team has devoted their resources to the other side. People tend to forget that when one player is trolling that not only reduces your teams resources down to 80%, but often times will boost the opponents resources by a similar amount.

If I were playing a pickup game of basketball, and one guy started to dick around and jump to the other team, NOBODY blames you for walking away. (this is a situation that has happened to me.) Me, everyone else on my team, and as a matter of fact everyone on the other team left and started a new game.

I get your sentiment about it's being rude to the other members of your team, but its faulty reasoning because nowhere in the real world do you find this same line of logic in play.

STEG0Sep 6, 20171 votes

As an extreme example I found myself in a game a while ago with what seemed like a group of friends being extra hateful, primarily on a neo-natziesque tangent. I simply don't want to be associated with that kind of behavior and have no desire to spend my free time playing a game on the same team with people capable of that kind of hatred regardless if they are muted or not. I left because for me that was the right thing to do and Riot I'm sure made an automated record of my leave.

It's punishable but that's only so the game doesn't break from people leaving to often. It's not morally wrong to leave a match if that's what you feel you want to do. There are lots of situations that can come up where the right thing to do is to leave the match and the only thing that keeps you in is threats that your account will be punished.

Fake MasksSep 6, 20171 votes

if all 4 of your teammates heavily harass you, no you shouldn't be punished. But remember if only 1 or 2 or even 3 members do it but the others are just trying to play a game and win then yes you should be punished.

You can always just ignore them unless they literally inting it shouldn't be a problem.

SatanixSep 6, 20171 votes

You should always try your best to finish the game, because without finishing the game, there is no way for you to report anyone. With that being said, I'll let you know I've reported countless people for various reasons, rather it be discriminatory, racist or simply leaving a game, those reports add up. However I think there is a flaw. If it's just you that reports a player, nothing happens. But if more than one person reports the same person, they are punished by the tribunal (if they still call it that). Please try your best to stay in game, because it affects all of your team mates as well who are playing along side of you.

DrCyanideSep 6, 20171 votes

Should a player that has a team flaming, mia, spamming, and target trolling be punished for leaving the game?

The first 3 there are already in-game solutions for via mutes. The 4th is significantly harder to detect, since what's considered trolling changes so frequently.

Or, should a player who afk's from a game that has someone feeding be punished?

I think this one comes back to identifying an intentional feeder vs someone who's playing poorly. Extremely hard for an automated system to do, and we've seen too many humans on the Boards who fail at the task as well.

I'd like to reiterate that this isn't saying how the system SHOULD operate rather, if you were omnipotent and your day job was to dish out punishments, hat would you do about players being bullied in game?

If I was omnipotent, I think I'd have a better understanding of what drove those people to troll or intentionally feed, offering them the same forgiveness I'd offer the person who left.

Secondary question: If at least 2 or 3 members of your team are raging at you to afk and you do, should you receive a punishment?

I think you still should receive a punishment, simply because you have the tools to stop being subject to their raging. Those 2 people raging don't reflect what the others think of you or your performance.

Ramen226Sep 6, 20171 votes

I'm mostly talking abouit the 4th one

Talking about people who say they're going to run down mid or that they are actively trying to throw the game. These people type it in chat that they're going to do X action to try and ruin the game.

I meant more as if you had the power to act as judge jury and executioner over every single league game happening at the same time, not necesarily omnipotence. My fault for not articulating clear enough.

And as for the "tools to stop being subject to their raging" my tools are to afk farm and do nothing until the other team finally gets to our base. Which is still being subjecct to their rage because not i have to actively waste my time for the next 15-20 minutes when instead i could press quit game and go do something that feels 10 timees as rewarding until its over.