Boards›Player Behavior

The Huge Flaw in Riot's Punishment System

LookAdolfin··6 votes·1,791 views

Before I start this off, I would like to say that when it comes to forums, I have very little knowledge of them. I seldom visit them, and when I do, I almost never make a comment, much less create a whole "discussion," so I apologize if I sound like a pleb. I also want to say that this post isn't necessarily being made to help me get my account back, but it's being made because I know that there are other who have been wrongly punished somewhere. The whole point of this post is to emphasize that there NEEDS to be an appeal system for punishments. Even if my ban was somehow deserved, I know for a fact that there are people out there who have been banned without a valid reason. Also, if anyone thinks I'm just crying wolf, I have the chat logs (which only shows my side of the chat) that Riot sent me in an email that I can send to you. I would be happy to explain what every thing I said in the chat. Now, let us begin. (Skip to the ---------------------------------- if you want to skip my punishment story)

I wanna start this off by admitting to a truth: I was once a toxic player in League of Legends, and it took my account getting perma-banned to finally realize how toxic I was. (I wasn't toxic in the sense that I flamed people for doing bad, I was toxic in much, much worse ways. Believe it or not, I have always been against flaming, despite doing way worse things.) I have had a (short, I will admit) period of time to reflect on that behavior, and once I finally realized that I was creating a negative experience for other players, I no longer would communicate with players in the same way that I did before. So, I wanted to start again. I began using one of my alt accounts in place of my main. I worked hard to try to be a positive player, and from what I was able to tell, I seemed to be successful, (Although I will admit that I still can be a very annoying teammate to have on your team, since I use the chat nonstop.)

So I played a game of League today (on a different account than the one I am using right now), where I was in a game with 4 other people on my team who were all in a premade, and judging from what I could tell, they all knew each other in real life. I'm sure most of you know what it's like to be the "lone wolf" in a match where the rest of your team is in a premade, but for those of you who don't, the whole premade tends to be very rude for you, and blames you for every little thing, no matter if it really was your fault or not. The game started. I was playing Twisted Fate against Vel Koz, and I am not very good at dealing with Vel as the champion I was playing. The first thing I typed in chat was "Vel koz.... yay." So, I was getting wrecked in lane, and I asked the jungler, who was playing Hecarim "Hey man, I know you need to jungle, but I'm getting ****** over here." After I said this, the top laner, who was playing Fizz, started going off on me. I told him that if he was mad because he thought I was blaming his friend, that I wasn't blaming him for anything, I was just asking for a gank.

But the salt... just.... poured from there. Hecarim did give me a gank, but he died. I said nothing to him until I tarted getting flamed in the chat. (Whether or not the gank was good or bad or who was at fault is actually irrelevant, I'm just giving you context to the situation.) Now, I wasn't near him when he engaged, but that didn't stop him from blaming the situation on me and the top laner following suit. My exact response to this is as follows: "Blame me. GJ" He then asked me why I didn't follow up, and I told him nicely why.

He went on to tell me that I was just something along the lines of "a bad player" to which my response was "No offense, but when you play a little bit more, you won't blame your teammates like you just did." I don't remember the exact way I worded it, but it was in no way a rude manner.

After receiving salt a few more minutes, I did something I know you're not supposed to do and this is why I think that maybe some people can see why I was punished but to me it just seems........ eh.

I told the enemy team that I was getting flamed. I didn't insult them, I just pointed out to them that I was getting flamed. I believe my exact words were "So top and jungle are flaming me and they're both together" (While one can say that it's wrong to go to all chat, I didn't harass my teammates. If this is somehow against the summoners code and I just didn't happen to notice it, please let me know, but still, this isn't the only thing I want to discuss)

After the game ended, I asked the enemy team in post-game chat to please report the top laner and jungler. The 4 man premade jumped on top of me and all started reporting me in retaliation for daring to ask that. A 4 man premade can get away with flaming one person the whole game because they convince the enemy team of something and get them to report the one lone player, even if I was deserving of punishment, this stuff still happens.

Now, after what above happened, I figured I was safe since Riot could see the in-game chat and would, you know, actually take time to read it. But it appears that nobody read that game's chat log at all, because within 15 seconds of getting reported, I was notified that I had a 14 day suspension, my first punishment on that account for anything other than afks. I have read and heard that an employee from Riot support reads the in-game chat, but I honestly cannot believe that this is true, assuming that statement is supposed to be accurate. There is no way an employee from Riot has between 15-30 seconds to receive AND review a case, and then decide on a proper punishment. This leads me to believe the punishment system is automated.

Now, even if you think that what I did was deserving of punishment, that still does not mean that there is no excuse for Riot not having some sort of appeal system with the punishment that they have in place. It made sense that they didn't have one when the Tribunal was still up and running, (I also am 100% sure I would not have been punished by the Tribunal) but it doesn't now that the Tribunal is down. Even if I was lying through my teeth about what I am saying right now, does that mean that Riot shouldn't have a fail safe system in place?

You can bring up the fact that only I think "0.2%" of players receive a suspension, so therefore it is rare for someone to be punished for little to no reason, but the problem with this argument is that we see innocent people get punished in the legal system today for crimes they did not commit, and there are fail safe systems in place to ensure that everyone is entitled to a fair trial and is innocent until proven guilty. Riot, on the other hand, doesn't care about taking the time to see if their system has flaws. As far as Riot is concerned, you are always guilty, and they can never be wrong.

Another point I can foresee people making is "You're obviously toxic because you have to have been reported a lot." I get reported a lot because I'm annoying. I'm not annoying in the sense that I'm salty, I'm annoying in the fact that I use the chat nonstop the whole game. Every 30 seconds there is a message in the chat from me, and this makes me one of the most annoying people you will ever have on your team. My teammates tend to abuse the report system and report me I guess as a way of trying to get me chat restricted so I'll shut up or something. This point is the only thing that is non-debatable. Even if I was deserving of punishment for this game, the rest of the games before that one were perfectly fine. Remember how there were people who were pardoned in the Tribunal because they received a lot of reports for nothing? Yeah, people do report others without a valid reason.

It;s truly amazing how people have this mentality that the report system is so perfect that there are no people out there who will abuse it.

I wish I had the chat logs for my previous 10 or so games before that but I do not. I only have that last one. If I did, it would help my case sooooooo much because people would be able to more clearly see how broken this report system is. It's similar to how the YouTube copyright abuse system (and other forms of false flagging) is (are) being used to hurt content creators who are doing nothing wrong.

Seriously, no system is perfect. There are always going to be mistakes, which is why there should be an appeal system. Either that, or the Tribunal seriously needs to come back.

30 Comments

Mystery Ghost3 votes

post reform card

[slayer-pantheon-popcorn]

LookAdolfin1 votes

Explain to me what a reform card is, and I will be happy to oblige. I have asked a few people and none have given me a clear answer. I've heard from some that it's the email you were sent by Riot when you were banned, but others have told me it's something you make.

It's disappointing that my entire argument was not addressed. Edit: I have realized that some things I said in the OP and were led to believe are inaccurate. Thanks to those who explained this to me, and I apologize for that Still, I have many other criticisms that still stand. (Edited at 11:38 PM 1/24) I have posted my chat log in one of the comments. Just look for the images. They aren't too hard to find, and are at the bottom of one of my posts.

LukeTheSheppy4 votes

{quoted}

Explain to me what a reform card is, and I will be happy to oblige. I have asked a few people and none have given me a clear answer. I've heard from some that it's the email you were sent by Riot when you were banned, but others have told me it's something you make.

It's disappointing that my entire argument was not addressed.

The chat logs that appear when you log into the client or that was sent to your email.

LookAdolfin1 votes

Thank you. I have the chat logs saved to a word document explaining the whole chat and what was said, and I will post them when someone addresses my argument.

Why am I doing this? So people will actually read what I have to say instead of rudely dismissing me. If you want to see what my argument was, go back to the line through the middle of the text and read down.

I have nothing to hide and I genuinely feel I did nothing wrong, but that still doesn't mean I want there to be a chance of my argument for why there should be an appeal system being glossed over, like I said, this post isn't just about me personally getting suspended, and I don't want people to view it in such a way. Like I said, even if I somehow deserved this ban, so what?

Sona Ping4 votes

{quoted}

I have nothing to hide

Then don't hide your chat logs.

https://media.giphy.com/media/sJRH35D9tthE4/giphy.gif

We're waiting.

LookAdolfin1 votes

You seem to think you're on to something, when in reality you just didn't read what I said at all, and you know it. This post isn't just about me getting punished, that is only a quarter of the reason. How many times am I going to have to emphasize this? I must have said it around 7 times in the post, and I can't believe I'm still saying it now.

We're waiting.

Good! Since you are so eager to see the chat logs, you will address my point, right?

or not...

They're saved. They're waiting for you, so if you really wanted to see them, you would read what I have to say, and respond to it. I will send them the second someone addresses my point in full so I don't get straw-manned.

Also, if you suspect me of editing the chat logs when I do send them, I will screenshot the email and the chat log that was I was provided with on my account.

Sona Ping4 votes

{quoted}

You seem to think you're on to something, when in reality you just didn't read what I said at all, and you know it.

Good. You understand the point. Nobody cares what you wrote or how you are trying to rationalize it to yourself, just like how nobody cared in the hundred other threads from people who think they were innocent and wrongly banned because they only called their teammates worthless sacks of ___ which was totally justified because they died a couple of times.

The thing that all of these discussions are based upon is the chat log, which is not here. That's the problem.

HOWEVER! Because I am so gosh-darned-diddly generous; I will humor you.

iSpankedYourLane (NA) Why don't we have an appeal system? There should be an appeal system.

And this would accomplish... what?

Seriously. What would this accomplish? This isn't a legal system. This isn't some case that needs to be taken to a higher court to interpret an impenetrable mesh of laws. And you're appealing to the same people who ruled the judgement anyway! How does this go in your head? Because you know how this appeal would go?

rekturmomlstnite (NA): I was banned, it said I was being toxic when I wasn't! I want my account back! Riot Moderation: Alright, we will review your account. .... Riot Moderation: Upon reviewing your account, you were banned because you were toxic and berating other players. You were been banned for toxicity, and your chat is toxic so you are banned for toxicity.
[BAN UPHELD]

Do you get it yet?

If people are banned for being "toxic", then they are being banned for being toxic. If they appeal, they are going to be banned for exactly the same reason, because that's the reason they were banned in the first place.

And in the rare case where someone is being banned for some technical error, they can already send in an email to support.

Now, if you want to continue this pointless thread, you can post your chat logs and everyone will tell you that you were banned for arguing with your teammates and spending more time typing than trying to help your team.

https://media.giphy.com/media/SmpV6sKa1vBxm/giphy.gif

LookAdolfin1 votes

Good. You understand the point. Nobody cares what you wrote or how you are trying to rationalize it to yourself, just like how nobody cared in the hundred other threads from people who think they were innocent and wrongly banned because they only called their teammates worthless sacks of _ which was totally justified because they died a couple of times.

Well, with that I stopped reading your post, and I'm probably not going to read anymore from you. Why? Because your whole method of response is based off of stereotyping others. You may have had the best response to me in the world, but I'll never know because of your smug attitude and the fact that you make assumptions before the evidence is presented to you. I have even stated that I would be willing to accept the punishment I was given if I received a satisfactory explanation.

In short, I no longer care.

Sona Ping2 votes

The point was "the board doesn't care" and why, which you missed.

If you think you are being stereotyped, prove the stereotype wrong and post the logs.

LookAdolfin1 votes

I'll leave you thinking I didn't post them.

LukeTheSheppy2 votes

{quoted}

You seem to think you're on to something, when in reality you just didn't read what I said at all, and you know it. This post isn't just about me getting punished, that is only a quarter of the reason. How many times am I going to have to emphasize this? I must have said it around 7 times in the post, and I can't believe I'm still saying it now.

Good! Since you are so eager to see the chat logs, you will address my point, right?

or not...

They're saved. They're waiting for you, so if you really wanted to see them, you would read what I have to say, and respond to it. I will send them the second someone addresses my point in full so I don't get straw-manned.

Also, if you suspect me of editing the chat logs when I do send them, I will screenshot the email and the chat log that was I was provided with on my account.

Your point is about how the report system is flawed. Since you have the burden of proof, post your logs to strengthen your point.

LookAdolfin1 votes

Done

ModAttysu The Poro1 votes

{quoted}

Explain to me what a reform card is, and I will be happy to oblige. I have asked a few people and none have given me a clear answer. I've heard from some that it's the email you were sent by Riot when you were banned, but others have told me it's something you make.

It's disappointing that my entire argument was not addressed.

Usually you gotta send in a support ticket for your reform card, some people don't get them in their email.

LookAdolfin1 votes

As I said before, I will when someone addresses my point. This isn;t just about me personally getting banned. That's only a quarter of the reason.

(just checked and saw that this post was slightly older than the reply I made to the other guy. My apologies.)

ModAttysu The Poro1 votes

{quoted}

As I said before, I will when someone addresses my point. This isn;t just about me personally getting banned. That's only a quarter of the reason.

(just checked and saw that this post was slightly older than the reply I made to the other guy. My apologies.)

Ah it's cool :3

EndGamer113 votes

Yes, most of the system is automated. It works like this:

When an account is reported, be it by one report or 9, an "audit" of that game's chat is performed. The (very advanced and well-designed) system then goes through the logs of only the person in question and determines if they were poorly behaved. If the person has accumulated enough valid reports against them, then the first tier of punishment (out of four) is applied: 10-game chat ban 25-game chat ban 14-day ban permaban The process repeats until the account reaches permaban status: Once this happens, a Rioter will personally see if the account is worthy of a permaban. These systems have been in place for a while now, and are nearly perfect. For fringe cases, there IS an appeals system, Support Tickets, found by following the link at the top of the page.

If i missed another request of yours, please TLDR it out of this massive text wall and I will respond.

Otherwise, I would like to see your chat logs [slayer-pantheon-popcorn]

LookAdolfin1 votes

Thank you so much for taking the time to read what I said. It is more appreciated than you can imagine.

When you listed the tier of punishments, I have heard this from others on the forums. However, there is an issue I have with it: I mentioned earlier that I have had one of my accounts perma-banned (Which I deserved). This happened sometime last month, it may have even sometime early this month. Anyways, I was issued a 14 day ban sometime in November/early December. (I should mention I was also punished before this, but never in the way you listed, this was the second 14 day ban I received on that account) I had received two 14 day bans before my account was finally put to death. Another issue I have is that the account in question (the one that I mentioned in this post, I have many accounts.) never received any sort of punishment before this for anything other than afk penalties. No chat restriction, nothing. Just a straight up 14 day ban. I'll try to prove this in any way that I can if you want me to. Also, about the system going through only the chat logs of the reported person, while I do think people who retaliate in chat to someone flaming them should be punishable, someone needs to review the whole chat in its entirety. You may ask "If the person did nothing wrong, then why should they worry about the system going through only their chat logs?" The reason why is because certain things can be taken out of context. (I'm starting to sort of understand why I was punished.....but not really?) Although I seriously doubt this had anything to do with my punishment, I'm just saying that I could see someone saying something and it be taken out of context. For example, someone could be talking about themselves and how bad they are, then be punished for it.

I have tried to contact Riot support asking to directly speak with an employee from Riot support so I could get an explanation for why I was punished, but my request went unanswered, perhaps due to the way I formatted it. It also took 6 hours for me to finally get an email from Riot telling me that my account was banned, when before it took less than an hour.

About the appeals system: Some while ago, in an email from a Riot support employee, I was told that there was no form of appeals. (I honestly don't know if I'm allowed to show you that or not, but if I find out I am, I would show it if someone asked, but it would feel wrong to do so) I also read this on the support website. I'm not saying you're wrong about this, I'm saying that I have been told contradictory things.

Also, I don't know how you would define what is and what isn't a fringe case (Mainly because as of writing this I have had zero sleep over the last 2 days, and I can't comprehend much of anything right now). The appeals system should be open to everyone who was reported, and someone should look at the chat at its entirety.

You addressed my point, so I will bring out the chat log.

Let me emphasize this first: I would be willing to accept my punishment and never again make a post in this manner if I can get a satisfactory explanation as to why what I did was unacceptable.

Here is the chat log with me explaining what was going on (The explanations will be formatted like this) :

NOTE: ALL I DID WITH THIS IS EXPLAIN WHAT WAS SAID TO ME. Please read so context will be given. I am not using the commentary to justify what I said, only to explain

http://puu.sh/mInXX/5539aee040.png

Here is the original chat log (Without my name)

http://puu.sh/mIpuo/7e31b4f777.png

If I have done any wrong or abusive in the chat, please let me know because I seriously cannot see what I am doing that's wrong.

Faceplow2 votes

See, that wasn't so hard, more believable now.

If I were you, if this was a 14 day ban, I'd seriously just pop my enter keys off my keyboard and unbind any keys that open chat. Pings work just as well as a universal tool and language.

The system does work well, but here is where it gets challenging, especially if you've already been in trouble. Think of it, like probation.

  • It's just this account has already has at least 2 issues with toxicity. (Prior to this ban) *This is your 14 day suspension, which puts you in the "High Risk" area (to see how well you've reformed.) *Any kind of chat related report is probably scanned using an automated system that looks for "hot" words *There is a very small window to "reform"

You probably got reported, since you've already been chat restricted and you're account is in the "escalated" area. So when you used swear words or said "%%%" multiple times (even though you were quoting someone else), it probably set off those red flags in the automated system and it just autobanned you.

I'm speculating that this is how it works, but seems pretty logical to me. You might have a decent case to appeal. :)

LookAdolfin1 votes

The thing is, I have never been punished before on the account in question for anything other than afks. I will admit that some people dislike my summoner name, but that wasn't why I was punished.

Sorry I was a bit rude in responding to you. I was frustrated, but that doesn't make it excusable.

Faceplow1 votes

I would assume since you quoted a pretty "hot" word that is very commonly used in this game, it probably automated and really escalated the punishment.

Again, I'm just speculating, I don't know for sure. Like I said, I'd appeal and see what happens.

EndGamer111 votes

Anyways, I was issued a 14 day ban sometime in November/early December. (I should mention I was also punished before this, but never in the way you listed, this was the second 14 day ban I received on that account) I had received two 14 day bans before my account was finally put to death.

If three months pass inbetween punishments, your account will "drop down" a tier. That may have happened inbetween the first and second 14-day bans.

Another issue I have is that the account in question (the one that I mentioned in this post, I have many accounts.) never received any sort of punishment before this for anything other than afk penalties. No chat restriction, nothing. Just a straight up 14 day ban. I'll try to prove this in any way that I can if you want me to.

"Extreme" cases will instantly escalate an account to a higher level, skipping tiers.

Also, about the system going through only the chat logs of the reported person, while I do think people who retaliate in chat to someone flaming them should be punishable, someone needs to review the whole chat in its entirety. You may ask "If the person did nothing wrong, then why should they worry about the system going through only their chat logs?" The reason why is because certain things can be taken out of context. (I'm starting to sort of understand why I was punished.....but not really?) Although I seriously doubt this had anything to do with my punishment, I'm just saying that I could see someone saying something and it be taken out of context. For example, someone could be talking about themselves and how bad they are, then be punished for it.

The Talking about youself is allowed ("Wow i'm bad, i misplayed there"), while talking about others is pnished, and the system can differentiate between them.

About the appeals system: Some while ago, in an email from a Riot support employee, I was told that there was no form of appeals. (I honestly don't know if I'm allowed to show you that or not, but if I find out I am, I would show it if someone asked, but it would feel wrong to do so) I also read this on the support website. I'm not saying you're wrong about this, I'm saying that I have been told contradictory things.

RIot is very strict about repealing permabans. While you can submit a support ticket to appeal, it is very unlikely it will be repealed. I may be wrong, this is what I have heard from the various red posts around the forums.

Also, I don't know how you would define what is and what isn't a fringe case (Mainly because as of writing this I have had zero sleep over the last 2 days, and I can't comprehend much of anything right now). The appeals system should be open to everyone who was reported, and someone should look at the chat at its entirety.

Fringe cases would be errors of the system or special "zero hour" occurances. For example, the Curse Voice happenings. When the policy was created, Riot gave everybody currently using the (then illegal, since made legal) program a chance to stop using it, and nobody was banned for a while until Riot had given everybody fair time to stop using it.

If I have done any wrong or abusive in the chat, please let me know because I seriously cannot see what I am doing that's wrong.

Remember, it is rarely 1-3 games of chat that factor into a ban, although only 1-3 are shown. Spots in the provided logs that may have caused trouble:

"mate I'm getting f*** in the a**" - Not bannable, but still, try to avoid it. "f***" - see above "When you play the game more you'll learn that was a bad idea" - reeaaaaally cutting it close. Prob still not bannable "What are you like bronze/silver?" - Try not to rank call, its really low-class -.- "you didn't call us f%% at the beginning" - f%% is a hugely punished word. Steer clear of it as much as you can. I don't know if the system looks for context or not with this word or just flags it on sight because of it's weight. "when someone calls you a f%% for not picking a tank" - ^^^ "they're obviously trolling" - idk on this one, usually this is worded much more strongly in other threads. ""wtf tf u noob"" - may have confused the system a bit. /shrug

Your chat seems relatively tame this game, but remember that it was multiple games that get you punished. If every game you play ends up like this or worse, that may be enough to get punished.

Advice: Try to stay out of arguments with your team, keep it on friendly banter or game callouts (ward, group baron) and such.

EDIT: Since you mentioned in the OP that you\might be inexperienced with thread-making, I have included a post-evaluation below

Overall: 7/10 Pros: No all-caps, well written, no raging in OP or comments, paragraphs. Cons: Kinda harsh title that PBM will tend to downvote, wall-of text-ish with no TLDR

LookAdolfin1 votes

RIot is very strict about repealing permabans. While you can submit a support ticket to appeal, it is very unlikely it will be repealed. I may be wrong, this is what I have heard from the various red posts around the forums.

Keep in mind that was also a different account. (I'm sure you already know this) I was not trying to repeal my permaban, I knew I deserved it, however the Riot employee I was speaking with thought that was what I trying to do. I was simply asking for more information.

"When you play the game more you'll learn that was a bad idea" - reeaaaaally cutting it close. Prob still not bannable "What are you like bronze/silver?" - Try not to rank call, its really low-class -.-

I sort of understand how someone can take offense to this, but I assure you I honestly meant nothing bad by it. I was asking an honest question, because it usually makes me feel better when I know I'm being flamed by low elo players. (I'm a low elo player as well) I even said "no offense" to clarify to my teammates that I wasn't trying to be hostile.

"when someone calls you a f%% for not picking a tank" - ^^^ "they're obviously trolling" - idk on this one, usually this is worded much more strongly in other threads.

I'm too braindead to understand what you mean. Can you elaborate?

Your chat seems relatively tame this game, but remember that it was multiple games that get you punished. If every game you play ends up like this or worse, that may be enough to get punished.

Please explain to me if there was a way I could obtain chat logs for previous games. I honestly cannot remember anything inflammatory/negative I said in the previous games, ALTHOUGH there was one game were I called someone a SJW, but nobody seemed to be angry about that, and the person I was talking to worked it out with me in the post game chat. I know this doesn't stop it being from reported or stop me from being punished, the reason I brought this up is because I seriously doubt I was reported that game.

However, I do remember being reported in retaliation for asking the enemy team to report in the post game.

EndGamer111 votes

Keep in mind that was also a different account. (I'm sure you know this I was not trying to repeal my permaban, I know I deserved it, just the Riot employee I was speaking with thought that was what I trying to do. I was asking for more information.

I see, much more clear.

"What are you like bronze/silver?" - Try not to rank call, its really low-class -.-

I sort of understand how someone can take offense to this, but I assure you I honestly meant nothing bad by it. I was asking an honest question, because it usually makes me feel better when I know I'm being flamed by low elo players. (I'm a low elo player as well) I even said "no offense" to clarify to my teammates that I wasn't trying to be hostile.

Like I said, cutting it close. Some people more inclined to be offended might not like what that statement implies.

"they're obviously trolling" - idk on this one, usually this is worded much more strongly in other threads.

I'm too braindead to understand what you mean. Can you elaborate?

the ^^^ means "see the above thing". As for the other statement, what I meant was that other ragers usually use stronger language. Popcorn abounds!

Please explain to me if there was a way I could obtain chat logs for previous games. I honestly cannot remember anything inflammatory/negative I said in the previous games, ALTHOUGH there was one game were I called someone a SJW, but nobody seemed to be angry about that, and the person I was talking to worked it out with me in the post game chat. I know this doesn't stop it being from reported or stop me from being punished, the reason I brought this up is because I seriously doubt I was reported that game.

However, I do remember being reported in retaliation for asking the enemy team to report in the post game.

I suppose you might be able to use a support ticket to request additional logs. I have never needed to, so I wouldn't know.

LookAdolfin1 votes

I just read over that statement you quoted (Which I wrote) a second time, and my God, the lack of a complete set of parenthesis there really made my horrible writing worse than what it already was. I'm going to rewrite what I said because it was horribly written and hard to read/understand.

Like I said, cutting it close. Some people more inclined to be offended might not like what that statement implies.

I get what you're saying, and while I don't think I could (or should) be punished for saying that, (If I recall you also said you didn't think I could have been punished for this) I won't say something of that nature in future games.

I suppose you might be able to use a support ticket to request additional logs. I have never needed to, so I wouldn't know.

Thank you. I will try to contact Riot support with this information and post the results if allowed.

LookAdolfin1 votes

I have contacted Riot support over the last week trying to get more information. I sent an email basically asking if I could see more chat logs than the one I was shown and I also made it clear that I wasn't asking for my suspension to be revoked, just looking for more information. (After thinking about it, I think it's possible that maybe I could have done something else in a game that I forgot about.) It took forever for me to get an email back from them, and when I finally did, it looked like it was written in less than a minute (My email wasn't particularly long either), and basically said "Just look at the chat log we sent you. That was what resulted in a 14 day ban." I responded back to them, basically saying that nobody I have shown this chat log to (I showed this around to people on other websites, I forgot to mention.) and while there people that said I may have came across as rude, nobody, if anyone, really seemed to say that this alone could have resulted in a 14 day suspension, and most people didn't even think that this alone would have resulted in a punishment at all. (I know that this doesn't matter, but I mentioned that to get my confusion across) I asked again if I could at least see the chat logs of other games if possible, and I also asked if this game alone did result in a 14 day ban, could someone could explain to me exactly what I did/said that was wrong.

After waiting a whole day for a response, I got an email from a different person explaining to me that my case was being transferred to a "Player Behavior Specialist," and that my request would be addressed there.

It has been 2-3 days (I don't remember exactly) and I have yet to receive any other emails from Riot Support. I know Riot Support deals with a ton of other people, but I don't understand why 2 days have passed with no word. The only other support team I can think of that responds to me in the same manner is Microsoft's.

From what I understand, one of the reasons the PBM exists is to let other players explain to you why you were punished, but let's be honest, nearly nobody is doing that. They just click on the post and see I said something negative about Riot's punishment system and make their own assumptions without addressing anything I say. It doesn't even seem to matter if I'm being reasonable or not (Or even the length of my post), I'll get dog-piled either way. I'm fine with people disagreeing with me so long as they are reasonable, but when you disparage what someone said without even taking the time to hear it, you're basically white knighting at that point. (I don't even know who I'm ranting to in this paragraph, but whatever) That's generally the problem with all communities. There will always be white-knighting.

I'm not sure what I expected coming here. I read other posts by people before I made the OP, and I saw that anyone who held a negative opinion of Riot's punishment system (whether reasonable or not) was also dog-piled, but I still made a post anyway.

Faceplow2 votes

It's quite entertaining when people who get into trouble are always saying that what they did was justified.

But it wasn't my fault I degraded people, cursed at people, called people names, I have no self control. They all made me do it.

LookAdolfin1 votes

Here's another guy who didn't read a word I said. Please, find the part when I said that "what I did was justified." Find the part where I said "They made me do it." Find me those parts please. When I finally do show the chat log, you'll see I degraded NOBODY.

Your whole response is just you stereotyping me as the League player who says "Man **** these teammates, they're toxic as hell. **** you! ****you! And **** you!" when that wasn't what I did at all. I threw out a whopping total of zero insults the whole game. Stereotyping someone before you even know what occurred is wrong on so many levels. Your whole stance is "You're guilty before proven guilty" (sic)

It's quite entertaining that you have no idea what this post is about. I said....soooo....many...times that me getting banned is only a quarter of the reason I made this post. I even believe I said that if I did deserve this punishment, that it wouldn't change anything I said in the latter part of the post.

This is why there can't be progress in the community. Because the community stereotypes everyone who has a criticism of their lord and savior Riot games. Look at this comment section. I have said that I would provide the both the original chat log and one where I detail what ws said the second someone explains to me why there can't be an appeal system, and when someone explains to me why it took 15-30 seconds for my case to be "reviewed." But it seems as if the League community doesn't want to address criticism of their favorite company, because Riot does no wrong, and they feel as if they should never question their practices, so they do the things like you just did.

Go look at the bottom half of my post. That is the part I want you to address. Give me an argument, and I will show the chat logs.

Faceplow1 votes

Well, it's kind of like getting a trial and getting convicted. Even if you appeal the ruling, ATM you are still technically guilty until someone overturns your conviction.

And no I didn't read all that, I seriously doubt anyone else posting here or later will read it. It's a 1500 word essay of how the system failed you. All it contains is your word against Riot's and those who reported you. There is no evidence.

100% of the time after people TRULY post their unedited chat logs it becomes clear and obvious what you said wrong.

This story, is just the same as all the rest of the people who've been "wrongfully" accused. That's all I was saying.

LookAdolfin1 votes

And no I didn't read all that, I seriously doubt anyone else posting here or later will read it. It's a 1500 word essay of how the system failed you. All it contains is your word against Riot's and those who reported you. There is no evidence.

Sorry if rationality is a bad thing? I don't know what to say. If you don't want to have a meaningful discussion, stop responding to me. It's pointless to respond to someone who craves discussion with stubs like this.

100% of the time after people TRULY post their unedited chat logs it becomes clear and obvious what you said wrong.

Which is part of the reason I came here, to see if I really did do something wrong. All I can think of that I did was congratulate people for flaming me. Maybe someone else can see something that I did, or explain to me if and why that was wrong/against what the community finds acceptable. I have posted the log, both the original and one with commentary. (The one with commentary does not say "Well, you know, I cursed at my teammates, but they deserved it, so I would suggest reading it." No, I just said what I was told and highlighted how I responded to it. I didnt edit the chat, you can see it in full. I just made sure to describe what was said to me.

This story, is just the same as all the rest of the people who've been "wrongfully" accused. That's all I was saying.

Except for that fact that....... you know what? I've been repeating the same statement over and over again. If you don't realize it yet, that's your fault.

Sir NightenGale1 votes

I have to hand it to you mate, you hit the nail on the head with this. The main reason why I don't play league as much anymore is because of the reasons you listed, not to mention god forbid if you get a connection issue then the automated system punishes you as if you abandoned a game on purpose. I have been lucky to not be reported or banned ever, but, all I see is Riots "statistics" on how "Toxic players have been reduced by (x)%!!" and its lies, I see so many toxic players. I did a test to see, what I did is I would say "Hello, how is everyone?" in champ select and then see how it was responded to, astonishingly either no one responded or if they did they would say "stfu" or "f**k you". This system does not work.

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