Why I can't play ADC

Lotus Fate·Dec 4, 2018·1 votes·2,007 views

Yes this has to do with player behavior, because in the Bronze to Gold levels, people still don't understand the Support role. And 90% of the time I play ADC, my support feeds and trash talks me regardless of how well i'm doing, and 100% of the time my support doesn't support.

I never have this problem in the other 4 roles, in fact I can do poorly in those roles and still haveless toxicity from my teamates. So why is my Bot game so cursed?

Every time I'm ADC, I get Lux support, Trundle, vel'koz. And they build damage items.

I've never played ADC in the last year with a soraka, janna, karma, sona, thresh, braum, taric, or even a zyra. Occassionally I'll get a leona, only to have them build spirit visage and front line without peeling whatsoever. They always flash in dash, Die in 2 seconds and blame me for "not having any balls" As a result they always, ALWAYS end up leaving lane, or stealing CS.

Despite this I'll still end the game going 8/2/8 or 5/1/9. I've even got a solo quadra kill in a 13/1/8 game a year ago and everyone was just being toxic, calling me useless.

Do I get mad? not in chat. The most toxic thing I'll say is "can i get some peels, please?"

Am I a bad adc? well... yeah I am. I'm genuinely trying to practice the role in draft games, but It's 1 of 2 roles that requires synergy from a teammate.

So here's my question. If your support is unable to stun, shield, buff, crowd control, and doesn't build any support items besides the starting gold item, and proceeds to blame YOU for the lane not going well. And you're not feeding, and you have a positive KDR with decent CS. Should they be reported?

21 Comments

KaiokoDec 4, 20182 votes

A lot of what you're mentioning simply has to do with the unreliability of players at those levels. A person who plays a non-damaging support will obviously not be able to deal damage reliably. If they get paired up with an ADC whose incapable of doing damage then they will suffer.

If you're still getting fed and climbing I don't exactly see what the issue is. The further up you go -- the more non-damaging supports you'll get. That being said with how high damage is so far this season; bottom lane really isn't too needed to deal further damage. Playing a supportive ADC or even a mage actually ends up being quite viable especially if you've got high damage in the other roles.

Lotus FateDec 4, 20181 votes

I agree with pretty much everything here. I'm a suport main, and I typically don't do damage because I'm focusing on defending my teammates. Ultimately it IS the unreliability of low level players, but because the support role is so unique (the role that's suppose to not do damage) it seems like it's forgiven when that player intentionally goes out of their way to leave the ADC alone.

My issue is the fact that people are so apathetic towards a the misuse of the role as an actual support. I don't care if they don't do damage. I don't even care if I lose. It's the mentality of never attempting to peel, feeding early, building a trinity force first item and blaming it on the adc, and because they don't type "kys" there's nothing wrong with that. This is in Gold by the way.

VreivaiDec 5, 20182 votes

[{quoted}](name=Lotus Fate,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=AXBWkAku,comment-id=,timestamp=2018-12-04T18:39:42.626+0000) And 90% of the time I play ADC, my support feeds and trash talks me regardless of how well i'm doing, and 100% of the time my support doesn't support.

I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess this is not even remotely close to true.

Telephone BoothDec 5, 20181 votes

{quoted}

I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess this is not even remotely close to true.

Yes, obviously exaggerating to make a point, which in my opinion, is dirty and only makes them look irrational in their logic.

AlzonDec 4, 20181 votes

If you add “zone,” “deal meaningful damage,” and “control objectives” to the list, then yes, that player is basically hindering you in every way.

Imperial PandaaDec 4, 20181 votes

If they are verbally harassing you, they could face punishment if reported.

However, I'm not going to tell you if you should report them or not as it is on you. I too suck at playing bot and realize it. Unless they are using slurs or something, I typically won't report as I just ignore it or mute them.

TulareDec 4, 20181 votes

Reportable? No, probably not. I feel your frustration, though. I, too, am a mediocre adc (my new role in the last season or two just 'cause the guys I play with don't like it). I've played a lot of support in seasons past, though. In fairness, as adc, I get a fair share of decent supports.

I agree that it's super frustrating, though, when a support barely even tries to play to the role. For example, a few games back, my Zyra support had a Haunting Guise and was getting ready to upgrade it to Liandry's Torment, but had never even upgraded her Spellthief's Edge. She went 0/8/3 and had a lower vision score than anybody else on the team.

I am patient and allow a lot of flexibility in different ways to play "support" but one way or another, the role has to play with a limited budget.

usul1202Dec 4, 20181 votes

The what's wrong with mage supports? Just because they aren't a buffbot or peelbot doesn't mean they aren't doing their job as your support...

Lotus FateDec 4, 20181 votes

I actually love mage supports. The problem comes with them taking CS because they don't like you, and building damage while making no effort to protect you from the khazix that constantly jumps on you in team fights. Lux support isn't bad, but not once, have I ever had a Janna, soraka, or karma. I don't know what it's like to have someone put a shield on me (outside of aram)

usul1202Dec 4, 20181 votes

While all of the "viable" mage supps (velk, lux, brand, zyra, xerath, etc) do have peel capabilities, you're not going to find reasonable usage of them until probably plat, maybe high gold. Those peel abilities are reasonably strong, but it's more of a subtle strength so it's less popular the lower the elo. I would recommend playing to your supports strengths (unless you're a lane controller like Draven) and use their cominant early power to spike yourself to where that peel is less relevant. That really is the shining point of mage supports in low elo, your ability to snowball 2 people through dominating 1 lane, so matching aggression between adc and supp is vital to using your strengths.

Taking cs... I'm sorry. Haven't seen it in ages but I know that's an elo thing. I wish I could have at least some advice.

You're not going to see many enchanter supps beyond nami really right now, the last nerf put them at 'slightly below average' and shieldbots aren't super appealing when they're not super strong. I would recommend finding a duo if you want to adc more in that environment, many supports are comfortable on those kinds of champs, but picking them in soloq is a risk. While you still have some agency, at some level you're putting the game in your adcs hands. Janna/lulu/raka/nami are great at buffing up those hands..... But sometimes your adc just sucks and your perfect lane play, clutch shields, and well timed bodyblocking means nothing because your partner won't freaking right click. And that's frustrating. And thus, people gravitate off of those champs in soloq. But, if you're duod, theres trust there that you can build on and pick based on, which may be what you're looking for.

Kei143Dec 4, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Lotus Fate,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=AXBWkAku,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2018-12-04T19:19:00.915+0000)

I actually love mage supports. The problem comes with them taking CS because they don't like you, and building damage while making no effort to protect you from the khazix that constantly jumps on you in team fights. Lux support isn't bad, but not once, have I ever had a Janna, soraka, or karma. I don't know what it's like to have someone put a shield on me (outside of aram)

If you position yourself well that he can't get a lead to 1 shot you, then you are fine. Afterall, assassins are about burst you and get out. If they can't burst you, then you've won half the battle.

The problem with many low elo marksmen players is that they don't know how to play on the edge and maximize their outputs while still defending themselves.

K6 can jump on you and don't HAVE to die. Stay with your minions and stay together so you aren't in isolation. Get a GA and get a phantom dancer instead of your shiv.

If an assassin has a dirk and is targetting you, it's ok to get a cloth armor or chain vest. Those would build into your GA anyways and greatly mitigate their lethality.

In Pregame, you can get bone plating, scaling hp rune, Adaptive dmg / atkspd on row1, armor on row2, scaling health for row3.

You know your support isn't playing a shield bot, so plan accordingly. Afterall, if you are dead, you can't deal dmg.

Lotus FateDec 4, 20181 votes

i don't get picked off easily. that's why i get flamed. I'm playing safe and NOT feeding. it's only in the late game where in team fights bruisers and assassin will walk right up to me and essentially 1v1 me while my teammates just pretend I don't exist. Even though they're right there fighting a tanky maokai.

I don't think you understand the situations i'm in where my support is a trundle and flashes in past the enemy blitzcrank + full minion wave to attempt to engage a miss fortune. going 0/4/0 eight minutes in and blaming me for not pushing the wave up enough. I don't feed. I just never have a support that is there for me, ever.

Kei143Dec 4, 20181 votes

When you play too safe, it's frustrating for the supports as well. You need to do your job to trade, zone, and wave manage. You can't expect your support to do all the work. Playing safe doesn't always mean playing good.

Then comes the point of you can't CS properly, you don't have gold and thus you essentially just become a walking ward.

When I see that my marksmen is useless, I don't hesistate in taking CS, as that gold is more effective on me as a mage than my partner.

When I play support, I get so happy when I see a good marksmen. When I play bot lane, I get happy when I see a good support. But those players that know what they are doing are far and few.

I should play more normal draft picks instead ranked draft. Maybe positional match making will pair me up with more capable bot laners.

Lotus FateDec 4, 20181 votes

when I play support i don't go 0/4 at 8 minutes and then blame my adc for it.

I also play support champions when I support.

Kei143Dec 5, 20181 votes

Just because they aren't Riot defined supports doesn't mean they can't be played as supports.

Sion and Sejuani are awesome supports and they were certainly not designed to be in the support role.

Also, there are times you can go 0/4 and it will be the bot laner's fault. Not always, but it can happen.

Kei143Dec 4, 20181 votes

Death is the best peel.

ı Sona ıDec 4, 20181 votes

Well, ADC doesn't actually require synergy, it requires spatial awareness.

There is no ward, should I be pushing? There is a ward but I have no flash, should I be pushing? There is a ward, I have flash but their engage is really dangerous, should I be pushing? There is a ward, I have flash, but my support backed, should I be pushing? The lane is frozen and we're all at full health, should I be pushing? I have no legitimate reason not to simply last hit minions, should I be pushing? I don't feel like I can trust my support yet, should I be pushing?

The answer to everything is NO, stop pushing, stop forcing fights, and just focus on last hitting. I don't care if your support engages 20 feet in front of you where you can't possibly reach them in time, don't follow them to your own death.

Play. With. Tactics.

woodvsmurphDec 4, 20181 votes

Played this game since season 2 or 3. Started as support because that's where the noobs went at the time and because people spent most of champ select shouting about whether it would be first pick or first call to determine roles - unlike now where we have a nice autofill system to help avoid us being at each other's throats so often before the game even begins.

I can say without a doubt that it is FAR more common to have an adc with no clue how to play than a support with no clue how to play in bronze, silver, and gold elo.

Adc's either tend to blindly auto-push the wave constantly and keep in perma-shoved in so as to invite the enemy jg and mid to camp them for easy kills, or they play overly passive and only last-hit when they should be abusing an advantage in laning phase before they get outscaled. The latter results in their support getting poked out and never being allowed to play agro or return damage onto opponents because the adc simply fails to punish with aa harass/poke like they properly should. The former results in either the adc or the support (or both) dying over and over and falling behind due to ganks. And when the support dies to save the adc from the bad situation the adc put him/herself in, the support gets blamed for being bad/getting caught even though they could have escaped at the cost of the adc's life and chose instead to protect their carry.

Adc's don't tend to ward, or they use wards carelessly. Supports can't keep up enough vision alone 24/7 especially before they get sightstone support item quest completed.

Not all supports are meant to babysit adc's. Some supports like leona aren't made so much for pealing as they are for engaging for their whole team.

Support items are not always the best items for a support either. A leona with item 3800 or item 3742 is far tankier and more threatening to the enemy team than a leona with item 3109 . And if you don't have a reliable dps champ that's worth putting knight's vow on, then it is better to not buy the item at all.

And supports might be better off taking some cs in different situations. Maybe it's better to clear a wave and reset it by bouncing off tower before you get back to lane so you aren't overextended. Or maybe they're trimming it to set up a freeze. Or simply last-hitting minions when you aren't there. All those are valid reasons for them to take cs beyond simply stacking taragon's.

I can't count how many times I've had adc's lecture me or constantly pinging me to back off when I'm literally 1v2 spoon feeding them advantages in lane. Or get my adc off to a 2/0/0 or 4/1/0 start only to have them play like a complete ape the second I leave lane, continually die stupidly when I'm walking back from base, and then never be in lane when I'm there. How many games I've been told to just leave because I'm bad or left because I realized how much of a waste it was to babysit for a crappy adc, then gone mid and snowball my midlaner in no time even if it's 2v2 vs enemy jg and mid.

And kills don't mean everything friend. You can have amazing kda and still be costing your team the game through stupid play. If you aren't leveraging your advantage or your cs sucks or whatever, you are doing your team no good and just a walking shutdown for the enemy team. Rotations, map pressure, being in proper position AHEAD OF a teamfight rather than showing up late and taking all the credit for work others have done and paid the price for... that matters far more than mere kda. Not saying you are a bad adc or anything, but just giving you an outsider's perspective on some of the things other roles and players have to consider. The more you understand about what your teammates' goals and needs are, the better you will become as a player.

Lotus FateDec 4, 20181 votes

this post is about how supports will not pick support champions, feed 4 kills early, then CS. and blame it on the adc without anyone caring. A leona with item 3800 would be a miracle because I've never seen that other then when I play Leona.

Telephone BoothDec 5, 20181 votes

If ANYONE throws any blame your way for a lost lane, or lost game, yes its reportable.

IanSilangDec 5, 20181 votes

This is why I main support and bot. The off chance I get Bot instead of support (In my elo, there are a lot of support mains) I know that the support main is competent enough.