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I got banned for aggressively defending myself during a game?

Mushroom Dealer··3 votes·736 views

Hi Everyone.

To get to the point: I was permanently banned for being offensive with my communication with my team in a Ranked match. I feel that the reason for my ban was disproportionate with the punishment I received.

I was playing Janna support, with a Quinn jungler and Miss Fortune ADC. The game started off rough, with MF and I getting out-harassed. We were unable to produce a neutral zone of control during laning phase. There was a moment in the game where I re-engaged a fight with the enemy ADC, Tristana and her support, Sona. The reason for re-engaging was because Tristana had around 25% of full HP while both me and MF were at half % of full HP. Plus, I had my exhaust. So my hope was that MF would engage, but she didn't. And unfortunately, I committed myself 100% to that fight and died. I did not use exhaust because having realized MF was not coming and the fact I was going to die, it was better to save it for another fight.

I was upset at this but it wasn't too much of a problem. Now, I openly criticized MF in team-chat for leaving me hanging like that when I strongly believed in the idea that we would have came out ahead, if MF had assisted me. She argued back saying that "I should have used exhaust then". This bewildered me because the whole dependency on using exhaust was MF's cooperation to fight. If she was not fighting, why should I use it? And I do understand that she may not have realized I had exhaust and therefore could not understand the intention, but if your support is pinging the ADC and still fighting, there must be a very strong reason why your support would do that. Otherwise you would never have a game where you could pursue a fight with the opponent.

When mid-game approached, our midlane, Vel'koz, had been killed by the enemy Ahri and there was a huge wave pushing to the turret. I was walking towards my lane from base when this happened. I checked the minimap to see if there was anyone that could defend it and there was Quinn farming blue while mid was getting attacked. So I criticized her decision-making there. My point was this: Why go for blue buff when it can be taken at any time, repeatedly, when your turret, which only spawns once, is being attacked?

Then out of nowhere after a small skirmish botlane, Quinn randomly claimed out of nowhere that I was just another person that didn't "main support" and that I just picked Janna because it was an easy champ to fill. Quinn couldn't be further from the truth. I had ADC selected as my primary role, and support being my second role. Meaning, I did have intentions of supporting if needed. Not to mention I picked Janna because I sincerely wanted to help the team with peeling against the likes of enemy champions like Jarvan, Tristana, and Ahri. Yet, Quinn had the audacity to make claims without any evidence. That was just plain ignorance and represents troll-like behaviour to me.

Then when mid/late-game rolled along, the enemy jungler, Jarvan, managed to land his Q+E combo on Quinn, knocking her up. Since I was right behind Quinn when it happened, I was knocked up as well. I was repeatedly pressing my ult after being knocked up, hoping that I could repel Jarvan away as soon as I landed to save Quinn, but unfortunately she died in the process. And what do I get? A mocking "nice ult" from Quinn. I explained to her that there was no way for me to save her from that situation because A) had I ulti'd earlier to repel Jarvan's Q+E, he still had his ult ready to jump back in to finish the job. Not only that, Ahri was behind with ult ready to jump in at the opportunity to clean up. Now, I fully understand this is hypothetical now, but my point is that the enemy team would have likely finished Quinn off anyways had I ulti'd in time to negate Jarvan's Q+E combo. I also stated that I should not have used my ultimate there to save Quinn anyway. This was because IMO the ult was better used to protect the entire team, instead of using it to save Quinn when it was her own doing that made her get caught. But you know what? Quinn took it out of context and said that I was purposely "avoiding" helping to peel for my teammates when that isn't the least bit true. I did as best as I could given the unfair judgement and scrutiny I received from her.

They also decided to bash me for not warding our jungle at one point during the game. They somehow didn't understand that I can't be trying to defend midlane from 4 enemies and warding at the same time. My priority was to first deter the enemies away from our turrets with the rest of the team, and then resume warding duties when no active threats were present. But nope, Quinn and MF just decide to find whatever reason they can to blame me for losing the game.

The way Quinn and MF criticized me without any merit backing it up was almost like they were purposely doing it to annoy me. To spite me. Finding ways to aggravate me into reacting in a negative way - to which I unfortunately reacted. Yes I admit I was in the wrong for cursing and calling names. I can't blame anyone else for that. I'm just an emotionally-charged player at times. I get frustrated and it shows in my chats. But you know what? Who wouldn't get pissed by how much of a jackass these folks were behaving?

On a sincere note though, when I criticize someone, I try to make it constructive. I try to present my reasons/analysis for the criticism. I just want people to show some empathy and try to listen to the meaning behind it sometimes times instead of checking its face value. I have done my best to understand theirs, but I often find myself confused by their explanation due to a lack of apparent supporting arguments. What is there for me to work with in those situations?

I get it. There's a mute button. But why do I have to resort to such a measure? Is the community that far way from being civilized that we have to use crude measures like that? I care about helping players understand their weaknesses so they can improve on it, despite knowing I will probably never see them again. Maybe I have to work on my approach sometimes - but that's no excuse for Quinn and MF "reaching" for any reason they can use to blame me without any strong evidence behind it.

This to me is why I feel like a permanent ban was just too much. I can't possibly imagine how less of a negative impact Quinn and MF felt compared to what I had to go through during that game. At most, I feel like my punishment would have been more appropriate had it been a chat ban rather than an account ban.

I kindly and most sincerely urge that the Riot staff finds it in their heart and mind to re-visit the game that got me banned, and to re-consider the severity of punishment I received. Thank you in advance.

Regards, Mushroom Dealer

27 Comments

Mindspeaker4 votes

You whole post and reasoning is irrelevant There is never any "context" or "justification" for "defending yourself " responding to, reacting to any Intentional negative chat , action or play .

Also there is never any "context" or Justification to negativity commenting on something you simply don't like or what you consider "bad play" of any kind.

As for players blaming punishable speech and/or actions on other players - that is also inherently wrong

There is no such thing as being baited. You cannot use that as an excuse.

YOU ( the player) control and are responsible for your own actions speech.

No matter what anyone does or says in game no matter how bad

if YOU choose to respond to it in any way the YOU rightly deserve to be punished as well.

If you don't like how random people, don't want the "risk" of someone intentionally trying to disrupt the game ( intentional feeders afk verbal abusive leaverbuster avoiders) play then it's up to you not to join a random que ,

As for there is a INTENTIONAL feeder or afk just ignore them and play as you would if everything was fine and report them after the game . Take no action ,of any kind in retaliation or respond/ react to them verbally.

Also If a player disagrees and /or ignores the above guidelines and continue to break them remember every player is just GUEST of Riot no matter how much money that player spent on their account and their Privilege of playing in this game can and should be taken away permanently,

Riot Tantram (NA) - 2 years ago

A report flags a game for review. They do not establish guilt. The game is then reviewed for harassment, feeding, etc. This is why 'troll reporting' or 'gang reporting' do >not work. False or inaccurate reports are thrown out.

You cannot ever be punished for saying nothing .. unless of course it's for something gameplay related like feeding, afking or cheating. But, you can never be punished for >offensive language, hate speech or verbal abuse if you said nothing.

General Esdeath 3 votes

TL;DR

OP unless your "aggressive defense" was you smashing that MF mute button, you were guilty.

Pandemic Punch1 votes

To be fair, OP is admitting they are guilty. Their complaint has more to do with the severity of the punishment. Of course, most of our opinions don't matter in this regard since we don't know the history of OP's behavior.

Grim Reaper 82 votes

Chat log?

köibito2 votes

Listen buddy, the people responding do not care about you as a person whatsoever. They are rule slaves and will bow down to Riot because they only abide by the rules. I was perm banned because I called a trolling Nunu support going full AP a fa**ot. It wasn't right of me to do that, but trolling is no where near as bad as cursing at someone in the eyes of the Summoner's Code! Hopefully in the near future people will get harsher punishments for trolling. Chat restrictions are no longer a thing as far as I'm concerned. These new people don't know about it so they get confused when chat restrictions are mentioned. Check out my post and read it a bit?

Mindspeaker2 votes

{quoted}

Listen buddy, the people responding do not care about you as a person whatsoever. They are rule slaves and will bow down to Riot because they only abide by the rules.

it not about being a "rules slave" its about acting like a matrue positive CIVILIZED respectful member of the community.

Intentional trolling , reacting / or responding to anything you don't like including intentional trolls , raging over a video game,criticizing your teammates for ANY Reason etc etc etc

Is NOT Mature positive , civilized or respectful.

No matter what happens in game no matter how bad you think it is legitimate or not ......don't react it really is that simple ,

Pandemic Punch1 votes

So you agree that someone should be punished for calling someone a %%%% over and over and over?

Mindspeaker1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Dr Delusional,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=ATWLjIt4,comment-id=000500000000,timestamp=2017-11-04T11:43:59.447+0000)

So you agree that someone should be punished for calling someone a %%%% over and over and over?

yes If you call anyone anything negative ( including sarcasm) you should be punished depending where you are in the punishment tier and the severity riot puts on your offence, yes that could mean perma ban

If you you respond to anyone saying or doing anything you don't like legitimate ( verbal abuse feeding afk) or otherwise ( simply what you think is a bad play ) you should be punished depending where you are in the punishment tier and the severity riot puts on your offence, yes that could mean perma ban,

if you actually have to ask you obviously don't understand riots rules or anything I have personally posted to explain riots rules

Eternum Nocturne2 votes

aggressively defending

http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/facebook/000/993/875/084.png

Xidphel2 votes

SMASHES THE MUTE BUTTON AGGRESSIVELY

Sarutobi2 votes

aggressively defending yourself? Were you somehow aggressively pressing the mute button or something?

Pandemic Punch2 votes

Sorry OP, you have been dehumanized it seems. No one is reading into it that much and not caring at all.

Mushroom Dealer1 votes

I want to post the game-chat as well, but unfortunately Riot only allows me to copy&paste what I wrote during the game. I don't find this fair itself because you're only able to evaluate based on one part of the equation. You need to see what Quinn and MF wrote to me to understand the bigger picture clearer. So until I can somehow pull such a log, I will refrain from posting my own game chats. Sorry but I hope everyone understands my reasons.

ShinkoMinori4 votes

Who cares what the others said tho, you are accountable for what you do disregarding the reason for you to do it.

Grim Reaper 81 votes

I dont like but he is right, that is unfortunately the flawless system XD

Barley1 votes

Riot has made a good system out of that. You SHOULDNT need to post what other players have said. I haven’t read through your whole thing, but, honestly, you need to mute people you don’t like and move on

Troll for Trump2 votes

That's a poor system, as shown with the Tantram baiting cases.

While those cases are extremes, the idea is the same; context is necessary before you pass judgment, in any similar scenario (such as a court).

While Riot likely won't change the current system, that does not make it right.

In regards to muting, covering your ears will not get rid of the noise. Mute all you want, you'll just get tilted next game, until you start muting everyone at which point you might as well go play a single-player game.

Chermorg4 votes

As others have already said, there is nothing in their chat or game history that could justify toxicity by you. That's why Riot only provides your logs - it doesn't matter what others say, it isn't taken into consideration (barring extreme cases of provocation such as "say x or i troll" where x is something toxic).

Pandemic Punch1 votes

Until that someone calls you a %%%% repeatedly and you end up punished while they are not. Punish all or punish no one :)

Kei1431 votes

not gonna read through all that, but I guess you were aggressively counter attacking ?

Modi1 votes

You "resort[ing] to such a measure" as the mute button is the expected behavior. Mute & report. Retaliation is not acceptable behavior. It isn't acceptable in elementary school, it isn't acceptable in middle school/junior high, it isn't acceptable in high school, nor is it acceptable in college/university. Guess what? It isn't acceptable in a job either. Retaliation (or as you said "defending myself") is not acceptable in any context anywhere.

Mushroom Dealer1 votes

Okay so based on the majority of feedback so far, the right approach is simply to mute players and move on. Are you kidding me? You want me to submit to people that have shown a tendency to bait someone into becoming angry? In principle, that's analogous to staying silent and letting a bully have his/her way. Muting doesn't solve the problem. It _avoids _the problem. It passes the problem to someone else, who may end up in the same situation as I have. Muting and reporting players for such behaviour is an ineffective way to dispose these types of players too, since you'll never see the scope of how toxic they are until you begin to react to them. Their power is reliant on their victim responding to their messages.

Sure, if everyone in the world muted the person, there would be no way for him/her to exert their power. But what makes more sense? Forcing everyone that makes contact with such a player mute them, or having this person muted on the server-side so they can't interact with everyone else?

I didn't start a random Solo/Duo Ranked game looking forward to rebutting a troll's bait. And to say that I shouldn't play Ranked if I can't deal with such things is absurd. Why should I let someone else's behaviour dictate what I can or cannot play? There is a fundamental concern that needs to be addressed with the regulations/system of the game if people like me have to resort to such actions.

Because Honestly, as good as this tribunal system may be for some cases, it clearly does not effectively address the type of issue I'm describing here - which to me is one of the deeper issues that need more attention in the league community. Unfortunately, it doesn't look like it is an easy task to solve for Riot, but to have a victim of this issue get punished too? That's just downright frustrating.

EvilDustMan1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Mushroom Dealer,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=ATWLjIt4,comment-id=0007,timestamp=2017-11-04T10:55:34.768+0000)

Okay so based on the majority of feedback so far, the right approach is simply to mute players and move on. Are you kidding me? You want me to submit to people that have shown a tendency to bait someone into becoming angry? In principle, that's analogous to staying silent and letting a bully have his/her way. Muting doesn't solve the problem. It _avoids _the problem. It passes the problem to someone else, who may end up in the same situation as I have. Muting and reporting players for such behaviour is an ineffective way to dispose these types of players too, since you'll never see the scope of how toxic they are until you begin to react to them. Their power is reliant on their victim responding to their messages.

Sure, if everyone in the world muted the person, there would be no way for him/her to exert their power. But what makes more sense? Forcing everyone that makes contact with such a player mute them, or having this person muted on the server-side so they can't interact with everyone else?

I didn't start a random Solo/Duo Ranked game looking forward to rebutting a troll's bait. And to say that I shouldn't play Ranked if I can't deal with such things is absurd. Why should I let someone else's behaviour dictate what I can or cannot play? There is a fundamental concern that needs to be addressed with the regulations/system of the game if people like me have to resort to such actions.

Because Honestly, as good as this tribunal system may be for some cases, it clearly does not effectively address the type of issue I'm describing here - which to me is one of the deeper issues that need more attention in the league community. Unfortunately, it doesn't look like it is an easy task to solve for Riot, but to have a victim of this issue get punished too? That's just downright frustrating.

No. You mute and report, they get punished and either are forced to reform or stop playing. Baiting is getting punished.

As you said, reacting to trolls gets them started. So don't react.

BeatzBoyFTW1 votes

Who said mute or report is a one-sided option when you can just do both ffs....

Pandemic Punch1 votes

I honestly don't know what Riot expects us to do when they don't punish people for hate speech despite proof, reports, and multiple support tickets. Eventually we will have to take it upon ourselves to deal with an abuser who is attempting to verbally abuse us or our teammates. It is unjust that the real aggressors/toxic players go unpunished while the people who defend themselves (or teammates) get bans as their first punishment ever.

This is why consistency is important. Without it, Riot is just unintentionally building a more toxic environment. They end up banning the defenders and letting the offenders roam free. Offenders are more likely to view their account as expendable too.

It doesn't help that Riot Support sucks in these cases. They aren't going to listen to this kind of reasoning if you have been punished. They just quickly jump to the conclusion that you are just another toxic player. Six years of good behavior seems to be irrelevant to them. It isn't like you become a monster who is going to terrorize all of your future games just because you finally have one bad game in six years. Nothing like saying nothing in chat until the first thing said to you is "%%%%". Then you respond in a derogatory way ONCE while they continue to use it only to have you banned while they receive no punishment at all.

For the lack of stronger terminology, there is some fuckary afoot. They grant you no justice or equality despite the proof. Even if the OFFENDER /toxic player deserves it significantly more.

SAL T1 Shaker1 votes

On a sincere note though, when I criticize someone, I try to make it constructive. I try to present my reasons/analysis for the criticism. I just want people to show some empathy and try to listen to the meaning behind it sometimes times instead of checking its face value. I have done my best to understand theirs, but I often find myself confused by their explanation due to a lack of apparent supporting arguments. What is there for me to work with in those situations?

I agree with you on that point. It's frustrating when you're literally just trying to coach someone, and it ends up biting you in the ass. It's totally not worth it though dude, i've tried. Just mute, report and move on. It's just not worth your heart health. The less you type the more you play, the more you play and focus the more chance youll play better than them. Just focus, farm like a god and carry your team.

ModPrandine

If you received a permanent ban then it means that you've received a 2-week ban and at least 35-games worth of chat restrictions but still failed to improve your behavior enough to avoid receiving a punishment.

Now this wall of text can be quickly summed up as "I retaliated and got punished for it". Regardless of how other people are acting their poor behavior does not excuse your own as retaliation (aka the "they started it" excuse) doesn't fly here. Next time if you see someone just using the chat to be verbally abusive just mute them, report them and move on rather than give them the negative reaction that they want to see. You may not like using the mute button but using it allows you to focus on the game and not the flame war.

P.S. Please post your entire unedited chat logs here in their entirety if you're actually looking to discuss your ban.

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