Riot knows what you search on google...

Lord Dominator·Dec 31, 2018·43 votes·20,459 views

Just try these things out and see what happens:

Open any Browser.
Type in 'cheat engine' and then search for it. (cheat'ing' engine won't work)
Don't click on any link or download anything.
Leave the tab open.
Open a game in Practice tool (or anywhere really, although I do not recommend it). :)
Wait till second 3 of the game.
If you play on fullscreen... well, something's gonna hinder you closing the game, not that you'd want that, or maybe you do? :) Alt+F4 won't work :b

This is on the top of the EUW Boards right now btw.

. . .

Spoiler Alert: The game's gonna crash and you can't reconnect. :b

89 Comments

rujitraDec 31, 201826 votes

The League Client, as can any other program, has access to certain information about other programs running on your computer. This is used by most competent developers to enable compatibility concerns to resolve, prevent crashes, ensure memory is not corrupted or edited by other programs, and yes, to prevent cheating.

Lord DominatorDec 31, 201811 votes

That makes sense, just wanted people to know, cause, y'know, it's kinda funny.

PaladinNODec 31, 20182 votes

I'll go out on a limb here, and state that if this client prevents other programs or even features of other programs or even limit the client itself from running properly because certain search words, HEX values or other blacklisted / presumed cheats (that are not in any way interacting with the client) are found in these RAM scans, then that's not legal.

"access to certain information about other programs running on your computer" (i.e. read access) and automatically taking active, preventive measures without the user's knowledge or consent are 2 very different things.

I have read the EULA and ToS on this, but there it was just very generally phrased. I just applied the classic "we can do whatever we want, while you got no rights" view on it (considering we are just renting content here after all). So I'd really like some specifics here.

Or to be very specific myself: I got on occasion cheats, trainers, RAM injectors, screen overlays and HEX modifiers for other games running . Sometimes while the LoL client is running as well; forgetting about it in the profile screen, and not interacting with it.

Should I be worried? I don't feel worried, nor do I feel I should be worried.

Not like what I did here anyway, running LoL at 5760 x 1200 resolution through a simple .cfg modification: https://1drv.ms/u/s!AuFMZD__7mN2gTCl5GTrI1e6ijPF

rujitraDec 31, 20184 votes

Riot is allowed to do whatever they want to their client. If they want to force their client to close or not run when certain other programs are running, that's their right.

League does not, to my knowledge, interact with any other programs - it simply monitors the processes and memory and any action taken is by the league client on the league client.

PaladinNODec 31, 20182 votes

On its own, that fine. But then I do expect some proper error messages should the RAM scan detect something it doesn't like.

If the scans make the client fail to run because I got Cheat Engine (or other software) open, that's also fine - as long as the client informs me it won't run while certain programs are running. Obviously not by name - as that would be a long, ever-changing list - but by, if even probable, feature.

But here I suspect it's easier to just ban the person "for unauthorized 3rd party programs" (whether those programs interacts with the LoL client or not) than actually inform them of anything, as - as you say - it's their client, and as I say, we got no rights.

But I'm not concerned about any actual cheat accusations for this game. Yes, I've modded everything that could be modded here once upon a time, but Tencent have effectively killed off any such entertainment now.

RandomIsHereDec 31, 20182 votes

{quoted}

On its own, that fine. But then I do expect some proper error messages should the RAM scan detect something it doesn't like.

If the scans make the client fail to run because I got Cheat Engine (or other software) open, that's also fine - as long as the client informs me it won't run while certain programs are running. Obviously not by name - as that would be a long, ever-changing list - but by, if even probable, feature.

Actually, the message is kinda explicit https://image.noelshack.com/fichiers/2018/01/1/1546282301-screenshot-93.png

PaladinNODec 31, 20181 votes

Quite so, I'd say indeed.

I haven't seen that message before myself.

InfernapeJan 1, 20191 votes

I see it a lot. The game might randomly display that if you alt F4 it.

LeftyRaydyDec 31, 20182 votes

{quoted}

Riot is allowed to do whatever they want to their client. If they want to force their client to close or not run when certain other programs are running, that's their right.

League does not, to my knowledge, interact with any other programs - it simply monitors the processes and memory and any action taken is by the league client on the league client.

Look you say that but it's still our computer and we should know 100% what you are doing/looking for as we all know recently someone decided to run bitcoin miners secretly on people's devices. The fact that a google search could basically make your computer take a shit is not ok with me and riot needs to find another way to go about this.

SaelonJan 1, 20191 votes

{quoted}

The fact that a google search could basically make your computer take a shit is not ok with me and riot needs to find another way to go about this.

A google search doesn't 'make your computer take a shit' the anti cheat will raise a red flag if any file you have open has 'cheat engine' in the title. You're purposely trying to make this sound worse than it is. If this helps stop people who cheat I don't see the problem if the game closes when you type 'cheat engine' into Google, besides the curiosity of seeing it happen yourself I really don't see why you'd ever search for that unless you plan on using it.

KaishaDec 31, 20183 votes

{quoted}

Riot is allowed to do whatever they want to their client. If they want to force their client to close or not run when certain other programs are running, that's their right.

League does not, to my knowledge, interact with any other programs - it simply monitors the processes and memory and any action taken is by the league client on the league client.

This is untrue. There are all sorts of laws (depending on the region/country) that dictate what you can and cannot do. TOS/EULA does not mean sht.

Janna Me FiddleDec 31, 20181 votes

{quoted}

This is untrue. There are all sorts of laws (depending on the region/country) that dictate what you can and cannot do. TOS/EULA does not mean sht.

Actually, they can as you are merely borrowing/renting the right to use their licence of which they can modify/delete and remove at any time.

In the EU, all GDPR does is make it so you are privvy to what information they have on you and they cannot store or share that information without your consent....

Consent which you gave when you clicked "I Agree" on the amended EULA.

You can by law, revoke that agreement, however by doing so Riot will revoke the permission to use their licence (you can't play the game).

rujitraJan 1, 20191 votes

rujitraJan 1, 20191 votes

Show me one law, from anywhere in the world (any free country, i.e. not China, Russia, North Korea, etc) that limits the authority of a program to alter itself.

There is no law/court case that limits the ability of a program to crash or close itself if it does not want to run anymore.

KaishaJan 1, 20193 votes

You stated: "Riot is allowed to do whatever they want to their client."

I'm not saying it can't close itself, rather that it can't scan your system at will, or do what it wants with the information without your consent.

Also when you purchase software, there is a contractual obligation by the company, now RIOT can't close league if/when it chooses, but not all software can. If you paid for something and it doesn't work, you can request a refund or compensation.

Really what it can or cannot do depends on the location (so if you want specifics you'll have to be specific as well).

rujitraJan 1, 20191 votes

You don't purchase the software. It is provided free of charge.

They... really don't have any contractual obligation. Furthermore, you provide no basis for any law prohibiting programs from scanning other processes. In fact, this is probably not something that will be legislated - as it is the OS developer's choice, has no implications for privacy, etc, and is a competition factor. Data protection and privacy regulations only cover collection or storing of data. The League client is doing neither, it simply closes out if it detects other processes that are on its "list" or accessing its memory.

KaishaJan 1, 20191 votes

{quoted}

You don't purchase the software. It is provided free of charge.

You're 'moving the goal post'. You said: "Show me one law, from anywhere in the world (any free country, i.e. not China, Russia, North Korea, etc) that limits the authority of a program to alter itself.". You weren't referring to the RIOT client in that specific instance, but to any program in general. I was giving an example where a program might not be allowed to alter itself (in particular disable itself). Of course in RIOTs case since the client was not purchased its a different story. That said should a person be banned from the game and purchased content (skins, champs, RP, whatever) it may be possible to take RIOT to court for a refund (again, really depends on where you live).

They... really don't have any contractual obligation.

They do as soon as you purchase RP points, or skins, or spend real money on anything...

Furthermore, you provide no basis for any law prohibiting programs from scanning other processes.

I can't give a specific law because you haven't specified where we are talking about. US, Canada, Aus, UK, Korea??? Every place has different laws.

In fact, this is probably not something that will be legislated - as it is the OS developer's choice, has no implications for privacy, etc, and is a competition factor. Data protection and privacy regulations only cover collection or storing of data. The League client is doing neither, it simply closes out if it detects other processes that are on its "list" or accessing its memory.

What do you think 'collection' of data entails? Collecting of data includes scanning memory.

You're just making random sht up claiming all sorts of nonsense claims. Just because its in the EULA or TOS doesn't mean it'll stand in a court of law. Its FAR more complicated than what you seem to think...

rujitraJan 1, 20191 votes

They do - they have a contractual obligation to give you the content you buy. That does not mean you've paid for the content.

Anywhere. I don't care where. You won't find one anywhere.

Collection means where it would be viewable by Riot. Riot never gets the data - thus it is not collected - merely examined.

KaishaJan 1, 20191 votes

{quoted}

They do - they have a contractual obligation to give you the content you buy. That does not mean you've paid for the content.

Content you buy IS content you've paid for...

Anywhere. I don't care where. You won't find one anywhere.

You really have no clue do you.

Collection means where it would be viewable by Riot. Riot never gets the data - thus it is not collected - merely examined.

You don't get to decide what it is or isn't, that's up to a court of law. So unless you have a law degree...

AladoronJan 1, 20191 votes

Collection means where it would be viewable by Riot. Riot never gets the data - thus it is not collected - merely examined.

And how do you know this? Also how can Rito examine the data if it doesn't "get the data"? Do you know this check is run client side?

DrCyanideJan 1, 20191 votes

{quoted}

And how do you know this? Also how can Rito examine the data if it doesn't "get the data"? Do you know this check is run client side?

If you want to know if the check is happening client side or server side, use Wireshark or some other packet sniffer. Start League with no programs open, don't move for 15 seconds, then quit the match. Then start up Chrome with a bunch of tabs open, start League, don't move for 15 seconds, then quit the match. The traffic should be nearly identical if it's done client side, but there should be a lot more packets sent if it's remote.

Honestly, I could see Riot going either way with this one. It's easy to send the client a few phrases to search for and die on, but if you suspect someone is cheating then you'd want to know what their program is called, which means you'd want it returned to the server.

AladoronJan 1, 20191 votes

Not a bad idea, but Rito could easily send the list of open window titles in one single packet, and get back a simple bool to crash or not. So checking for simply the number of packets is not surely a good idea. Checking the whole size of the communication might work better, but i'm still not sure.

One could disassemble the exe, but that's just too much pain in the ass for a beginner like me.

And the main point of the question was how HE knows it. Since I clearly doubt he did any backcheck on his statement, he just spreads any kind of BS he thinks of in the defense of Rito. Or at least this is how his other comments looked like for me.

AladoronJan 1, 20191 votes

That said should a person be banned from the game and purchased content (skins, champs, RP, whatever) it may be possible to take RIOT to court for a refund (again, really depends on where you live).

It might be a bit OFF, but when I first encountered this problem, I've tried it multiple times, and I did not get banned for it. So simply having the Cheat Engine, a folder or a site open just terminates the program (hopefully) and does not earn you a ban (for me it didn't)

Hexs FortuneJan 1, 20191 votes

{quoted}

Riot is allowed to do whatever they want to their client. If they want to force their client to close or not run when certain other programs are running, that's their right.

League does not, to my knowledge, interact with any other programs - it simply monitors the processes and memory and any action taken is by the league client on the league client.

It's pretty disturbing to know programs like League of Legends have the capacity to monitor my processes without asking each time before hand. Does the client need to be active to do this or is the monitoring activated at system start up?

rujitraJan 1, 20191 votes

To my knowledge the check is only active when the game client (not the "air" client/patcher/whatever you call it) is running.

But this really isn't new, it may be the first time you've heard of it but processes being available to other programs has been a thing for at least a few windows generations. It was originally designed for compatibility which is arguably the same as cheating - if a program were to interfere with the usability or compatibility of an older program, the program could have a controlled crash instead of an uncontrolled one or poor user experience later.

DanksleyDec 31, 20187 votes

Rito just wants to know where the best Ahri fanart is.

What's hilarious is that cheat engine really isn't useful for League ... its not like champs are sent to the client while they should be in fog, or that you can lock your HP / mana to full or change your cooldowns. Maybe visually, but the server won't honor it as Riot had that happen once before with 0-CD flash and plugged that gap.

Cheat engine to me is more for fucking around with values in singleplayer games but maybe I am wrong.

MyrmironDec 31, 20183 votes

[{quoted}](name=Hi Im Danksley,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=5grHajmf,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2018-12-31T02:47:52.980+0000)

Rito just wants to know where the best Ahri fanart is.

What's hilarious is that cheat engine really isn't useful for League ... its not like champs are sent to the client while they should be in fog, or that you can lock your HP / mana to full or change your cooldowns. Maybe visually, but the server won't honor it as Riot had that happen once before with 0-CD flash and plugged that gap.

Cheat engine to me is more for fucking around with values in singleplayer games but maybe I am wrong.

Nope, that's exactly what cheat engine is used for. Add to that that it's only a google search.

Hellmaximus1Dec 31, 20182 votes

Any competent developers knows how to protect from the simple program of Cheat Engine, plus since mid 2011 Riot made Client function server side.

Cheat Engine can't be used on League of Legends or its Client.

MyrmironDec 31, 20182 votes

{quoted}

Any competent developers knows how to protect from the simple program of Cheat Engine, plus since mid 2011 Riot made Client function server side.

Cheat Engine can't be used on League of Legends or its Client.

Why would a dev feel the need to protect their single player game from cheat engine? Also you're coirrec t which makes this even more ridiculous.

AladoronDec 31, 20181 votes

[deleted]

Velzard of KozDec 31, 20181 votes

No, he's right. Adjusting single-player game is exactly Cheat Engine's purpose. As such, searching for it doesn't need to mean you are planning to cheat in LoL game. So banning over it or causing crash is ridiculous (as long as it is not just for the word Cheat), because:

It shouldn't work on LoL
Player who would seek for it like that might seek for it for another game given its purpose

AladoronJan 1, 20192 votes

No, he's right. Adjusting single-player game is exactly Cheat Engine's purpose.

I'm sorry, I might have missed that we are not in the LoL forum, which is basically a multiplayer game. "Hi Im Danksley " said, that you can not do these stuff in LoL, and the next guy said, this is exactly what cheat engine is for. But nope, cheat engine is not for this in LoL. So he was wrong.

I'm quiet sure with Cheat Engine, you could also set the skins on YOUR computer. Lock champion portraits on the last position where it was seen on minimap and things like this. So Cheat Engine is not entirely useless, but you can not do the game breaking things like you can do in SP games.

As such, searching for it doesn't need to mean you are planning to cheat in LoL game. So banning over it or causing crash is ridiculous (as long as it is not just for the word Cheat), because:

Totally agree with this. Rito's system is trash in this sense.

AladoronDec 31, 20182 votes

You could still lock champion portrais on minimap where they were last seen. Show some trigger events when the enemy has low enough HP to die in your combo etc...

While it's not as useful as for singpleplayer games, where everything is on your computer, you can still make some advantage of it.

WatchThePowerJan 6, 20191 votes

[{quoted}](name=Hi Im Danksley,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=5grHajmf,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2018-12-31T02:47:52.980+0000)

Rito just wants to know where the best Ahri fanart is.

What's hilarious is that cheat engine really isn't useful for League ... its not like champs are sent to the client while they should be in fog, or that you can lock your HP / mana to full or change your cooldowns. Maybe visually, but the server won't honor it as Riot had that happen once before with 0-CD flash and plugged that gap.

Cheat engine to me is more for fucking around with values in singleplayer games but maybe I am wrong.

that's not quite what happened, people found a way to modify their runepage file and take the same rune 6(?) times.. their data has always been server side, but apparently they didn't have a system in place to verify rune pages :V

Tuition FeeDec 31, 20186 votes

... I re-read the ToS, and I think it's a bit scary. "We obtain info from third parties if you use their services in connection with Riot services (such as linking your Facebook account with the Riot services via the Add Friends feature)."

I'm going to assume this happened because I'm logged into LoL boards? Gonna test out what happens if I log out + go on incognito.

Corrupt HeartJan 1, 20192 votes

[{quoted}](name=Tuition Fee,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=5grHajmf,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2018-12-31T04:44:56.957+0000)

... I re-read the ToS, and I think it's a bit scary. "We obtain info from third parties if you use their services in connection with Riot services (such as linking your Facebook account with the Riot services via the Add Friends feature)."

I'm going to assume this happened because I'm logged into LoL boards? Gonna test out what happens if I log out + go on incognito.

I did the same trick with incognito (Google Chorme) and the same "Cheat Engine" crash happened. This is worser than going to your own bathroom knowing someone is watching with CCTV there and you don't know monkaS

Tuition FeeJan 2, 20191 votes

Jesus Christ... Better delete that search history, buds.

RallerenPDec 31, 20186 votes

Of course, that's basic anti-cheat. Any anti-cheat software scans your computer for cheats. One way of scanning is accessing your open windows and looking at their titles.

Quite literally any piece of software on your computer has this ability natively from Windows. Windows provides this information. They barely have to go looking for it.

So suggesting that Riot 'knows what you google' is extremely misleading. But I guess 'Riots Anti-cheat knows what programs you have open' isn't nearly as clickbaity a title.

ı Sona ıDec 31, 20186 votes

It is actually pretty disconcerting to think that Riot's programs are reading your browsers. You could have sensitive information up and they are collecting that data.

[sg-lux-2]

Corrupt HeartJan 1, 20191 votes

[{quoted}](name=ı Sona ı,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=5grHajmf,comment-id=000b,timestamp=2018-12-31T21:21:35.501+0000)

It is actually pretty disconcerting to think that Riot's programs are reading your browsers. You could have sensitive information up and they are collecting that data.

[sg-lux-2]

Hmmmm, same. My biggest fear if (not likely) Rio...i mean Tencent sells that data. That's another but unlikely concern.

MyrmironDec 31, 20185 votes

rofl you're correct, i just tried it. that's fucked up.

The DreamwalkerJan 1, 20194 votes

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F9rBzKJxbOk

Vandiril did a whole video on this.

Lord DominatorJan 1, 20191 votes

indeed.

14daysuspensionkDec 31, 20183 votes

Have you confirmed this? I wanna see you record it.

Lioness RampantDec 31, 20183 votes

{quoted}

Have you confirmed this? I wanna see you record it.

https://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/aayvu4/lol_reads_your_browser_tabs_is_this_a_gross/

ResolutionDec 31, 20183 votes

Am I the only one not comfortable about Riot being able to see our search history/files on our computer?

It looks like they collect our FB and mobile data as well if we have either friend finder or league messenger installed? See something in the terms of service about collecting information from third partys... why do you need information about me that isnt League related?

No offense but with how many companies are selling our information atm.. anyway to opt out of Riot collecting information on you?