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On Ranked Rewards Requirements

Zeenic·10/7/2015, 9:32:30 PM·3 votes·1,559 views

Riot Recently made it official that those who have been banned within the 3 months prior to the end of the season WILL NOT receive ranked rewards. I take issue with this based on my personal experience, psychological principles, common sense, and here is why.

I was banned for 2 weeks starting August 27th and unbanned the 10th of September. I was toxic repeatedly, frustrated with trolls and feeders, and received a justified ban. I learned my lesson as it was an extreme punishment. However, keep in mind a few things about the way I was banned. I had not received any previous form of punishment, this was my first offense. Instead of informing me my behavior was not ok or acceptable I was hit with an immediate two week ban. No prior punishment, chat restriction, ranked ban, ect to reform my behavior in any way. This goes against escalating punishment and although the ban is deserved, any form of previous punishment would have informed me to correct my behavior and I would have done so in an effort to preserve my ranked rewards and experience the game in a better light. Instead, bam! Two week ban with no chance to prove reformation before the end of the season, thus an auto-disqualification from rewards, and no prior punishment to change my behavior before being dished the 2nd harshest punishment in the game. Poorly handled in my opinion but such is the way of automation, referring to the AI software now banning people. I think tuning should be considered to actually follow escalation

Secondly, ranked rewards were previously a positive reinforcement tool used to validate good performance. This has since changed as good behavior is now a requirement too. Thus rewards reinforce both good behavior AND good gameplay, not either or. Good, stricter requirements to earn rewards in an effort to tighten up behavior. I have no issue here save for the poorly thought out 3-month rule. Here is why. Riot is using 3 months as a blanket standard to prove reformation before the end of the season because it holds statistical validity in their studies. This is good. The bad part is riot claims most players are neutral and they already have high reform rates. This means If you are banned after August 11th, you have no chance to prove you are reformed, in what is my opinion an efficient but unfair, and poorly constructed behavior changing program. Bad because if most players are indeed neutral, it was frustration, bad day, troll, ect that weakened their resolve as they felt their need to be toxic. Bad because this largely neutral player-base, who reforms at a high rate, is being punished with a ban as well as a loss of ranked rewards, for the same action! A misuse or over exaggeration of psychological punishment principles. Let us use a real world reformation program, the justice system. The law forbidding double jeopardy. You cannot be tried for the same crime. In addition, what is the difference between a player whose ban is lifted 3 months and a day and a player whose ban is lifted 2 months and 29 days? One day. Yet riot sees one player as reformed and the other as still toxic. Is that fair? Would it not be more fair to give every banned player ranked rewards if and only if they have 3 continuous months of positive or neutral behavior? Let us draw a parallel to the justice system once more. When convicted, you serve time much like a ban. You serve time and are rewarded with early release based on CONTINUOUS good or neutral behavior. Please keep in mind if the goal is to reform behavior. To create a better environment, it should be a timeline not a time-limit that should be considered. The time limit was for player skill, the timeline is player reformation. What the current 3-month rule says is that Riot only cares to reward players who reform ON THEIR TIME-LIMIT and dismisses all those who reform after. 3-continuous months makes more sense if the whole player-base is being considered because, as i previously stated, the difference between two reformed players banned 1 day apart is just that, one day. You don't serve a longer sentence based on the timing of you actions, it is not in agreement with behavior reform.

In summary, sure I was banned and the system worked because I am no longer toxic. However, any previous punishment would have been a nice/fair warning to change my behavior before escalating my status internally to a 2 week ban, WITHOUT an equal ACTIVE escalation in punishment. Instead I am my first offense, like many others, resulted in BOTH punishing me with a ban AND punishing me with a loss of rewards WITHOUT prior warning. Lastly, if the goal is to create and mold a positive environment though a punishment and reward system, at least follow though on these principles fairly so that everyone has a chance to prove they reformed behaviorally by making it 3 continuous months and not 3 months before the end of the season. At the end of the day the concern is on player reform, but don't treat us like pavlovian lab experiments with uber harsh first punishments (lacking real escalation) and different groups whose rewards hinge on your preference of time an not the principle of reformation.

TLDR: Use escalation when throwing down the ban mallet to make the system more fair and catch/change all them toxic pricks before throwing them in solitary confinement. Double jeopardy, WTF MATE!? GIMME JUDGE JUDY INSTEAD. NO? FINE, GIVE US 3-months of continuous servitude to prove WE HAVE SEEN THE LIGHT. THOSE TOXIC TERDS BANNED ON TIME SURE GOT A CHANCE :O

34 Comments

SmokedAlmonds10/7/2015, 10:39:45 PM2 votes

I'm not arguing that it isn't the 2nd harshest punishment, im saying how many punishments are less or more doesn't matter.

Rewards are positive reinforcement, but losing reliability for rewards is a punishment. (I meant to say removal of rewards, not rewards)

You have a chance to demonstrate reform. You can avoid punishment next season and get rewards then. You may be reformed now, but you have not sufficiently demonstrated it.

Chaotic Sage10/7/2015, 9:58:02 PM2 votes

Okay to start, the word 'fair' here is subjective. In Riot's eyes this could actually be an extremely generous offer as, keep in mind, they could have easily made it season long as a further punishment to those that received bans. Heck, I would have thought that that was extremely fair. People don't deserve rewards if they're so negative that they got banned. As for your ban reasoning, Riot has stated that if the behavior is deemed toxic enough the early stages of punishment will be skipped and immediate suspension will happen. Now about the law part, pretty sure you had to be sarcastic here cause applying a law like that to a private corporations in house justice system seems pretty silly. All in all just seems that you were toxic, got banned, have since reformed and are now salty that you got banned and are being denied rewards. Probably should just make a support ticket so a Riot behavior person can tell you their specific reasoning.

SmokedAlmonds10/7/2015, 10:00:39 PM1 votes

{quoted}

Riot Recently made it official that those who have been banned within the 3 months prior to the end of the season WILL NOT receive ranked rewards. I take issue with this based on my personal experience, psychological principles, common sense, and here is why.

I was banned for 2 weeks starting August 27th and unbanned the 10th of September. I was toxic repeatedly, frustrated with trolls and feeders, and received a justified ban. I learned my lesson as it was an extreme punishment. However, keep in mind a few things about the way I was banned. I had not received any previous form of punishment, this was my first offense. Instead of informing me my behavior was not ok or acceptable I was hit with an immediate two week ban. No prior punishment, chat restriction, ranked ban, ect to reform my behavior in any way. This goes against escalating punishment and although the ban is deserved, any form of previous punishment would have informed me to correct my behavior and I would have done so in an effort to preserve my ranked rewards and experience the game in a better light. Instead, bam! Two week ban with no chance to prove reformation before the end of the season, thus an auto-disqualification from rewards, and no prior punishment to change my behavior before being dished the 2nd harshest punishment in the game. Poorly handled in my opinion but such is the way of automation, referring to the AI software now banning people. I think tuning should be considered to actually follow escalation

The punishment escalation has already changed since then so I'm not sure that's really worth discussing anymore.

In your specific case maybe a lesser punishment or even a warning could have been enough but millions of people play this game and what best fits the most people is more important than individual cases. I also don't feel like "whats the least possible punishment that would work" is worth all that much thought, just a little to "lets not go way overboard". and I think 2 week ban easily falls short of overboard.

It being the "second harshest punishment in the game" is a silly way to describe it. If a 15 day ban existed that wouldn't make a 14 day ban any less harsh. You got banned from a game for 2 weeks and had to play your next favorite game or play on another account with less stuff.

Secondly, ranked rewards were previously a positive reinforcement tool used to validate good performance. This has since changed as good behavior is now a requirement too. Thus rewards reinforce both good behavior AND good gameplay, not either or. Good, stricter requirements to earn rewards in an effort to tighten up behavior. I have no issue here save for the poorly thought out 3-month rule. Here is why. Riot is using 3 months as a blanket standard to prove reformation before the end of the season because it holds statistical validity in their studies. This is good. The bad part is riot claims most players are neutral and they already have high reform rates. This means If you are banned after August 11th, you have no chance to prove you are reformed, in what is my opinion an efficient but unfair, and poorly constructed behavior changing program. Bad because if most players are indeed neutral, it was frustration, bad day, troll, ect that weakened their resolve as they felt their need to be toxic. Bad because this largely neutral player-base, who reforms at a high rate, is being punished with a ban as well as a loss of ranked rewards, for the same action! A misuse or over exaggeration of psychological punishment principles. Let us use a real world reformation program, the justice system. The law forbidding double jeopardy. You cannot be tried for the same crime. In addition, what is the difference between a player whose ban is lifted 3 months and a day and a player whose ban is lifted 2 months and 29 days? One day. Yet riot sees one player as reformed and the other as still toxic. Is that fair? Would it not be more fair to give every banned player ranked rewards if and only if they have 3 continuous months of positive or neutral behavior? Let us draw a parallel to the justice system once more. When convicted, you serve time much like a ban. You serve time and are rewarded with early release based on CONTINUOUS good or neutral behavior. Please keep in mind if the goal is to reform behavior. To create a better environment, it should be a timeline not a time-limit that should be considered. The time limit was for player skill, the timeline is player reformation. What the current 3-month rule says is that Riot only cares to reward players who reform ON THEIR TIME-LIMIT and dismisses all those who reform after. 3-continuous months makes more sense if the whole player-base is being considered because, as i previously stated, the difference between two reformed players banned 1 day apart is just that, one day. You don't serve a longer sentence based on the timing of you actions, it is not in agreement with behavior reform.

Punishments disqualifying people from season rewards was not new, they did the same(very similar) thing last year. You are right the line is arbritrary, but the line has to be somewhere. You have to choose some metric. I do think some other option like played X amount of games between your punishment and the end of the season without incident. But really I think any punishment during the season should disqualify you. In a perfect world maybe there could be an hour interview with people to see if they have reformed, but we dont.

This has nothing to do with double jeopardy. Its a punishment including multiple things. Just like the law, you can get like jail time and a fine. Probably even a better example would be Having a felony removing your ability to vote. You comit a crime, get punished and released. Later when an election happens you can't vote.

Kãtãrinã10/7/2015, 10:22:34 PM1 votes

Are there any eligibility requirements for these rewards outside of ranked results? Yes, some players are ineligible for rewards because of negative in-game behavior. This applies only to the 2015 season. Here are the details:

    • Players with bans or chat/ranked restrictions active when the season ends are ineligible for this year’s rewards
    • Players banned for seven days or more in the three months prior to the end of the season (August 10) are ineligible for this year’s rewards.
    • Players banned for boosting during the 2015 season remain ineligible for rewards
    • Players who experienced fraud-related and erroneous bans will still be eligible All players will have another chance at future ranked season rewards.

You usually only get 2 week bans if you were extremely toxic in a short amount of time. they also don't think you are fully "reformed" for a few months after your 2 week ban

DJColdCutz10/7/2015, 11:06:50 PM1 votes

It's okay; the skin reward is just a shitty Sivir skin.

OhBoyItsaMegaman10/7/2015, 11:22:28 PM1 votes

A lot of people are dishonest about the circumstances surrounding their ban. We only have your word that you received a 2-week ban with no prior punishments of any kind.

Cut-offs are a fact of life. You can make the argument that someone who is one millimeter over the line doesn't deserve to be treated the same as someone who is exactly on the line, but you're not going to get any sympathy. Walk into class 60 seconds after it begins, and you're marked late. Are you really that much worse than someone who got there 60 seconds before you? Yes, because if you cared then you would make sure that you did not cross that line, even if it meant leaving 15 minutes early. Going close to the line means you don't respect the consequences of going over it, so you don't have any excuse when you go over it. People who toed the line and got away with it are no better than you, but they'll have no recourse when they find themselves crossing it.

Ah, but you can say that you didn't know that there would be a line, right? Riot did not announce beforehand that August 10th would be the cut-off date, so you had no way of knowing that punishments incurred even a single day after that date would result in a harsher punishment.

Consider a person who just had their drivers' license suspended for parking in a handicapped spot. He argues, "When I made the decision to park there, what I did was wrong. And I have no problem with being punished. But I thought that the punishment would be something like a fine, maybe a few hundred dollars. With that in mind, I broke the law, figuring that I might or might not get caught, and that it would not be so bad if I did get caught. That was wrong; I shouldn't have broken the law regardless. But I absolutely would not have done it if I knew that the punishment was so harsh. Now that I know, it's not like I will ever do it again, so do you really have to suspend my license? Whether I get a fine or a suspension, either way I'm never going to do it again, because my only reason for doing it was ignorance of the law and I'm not ignorant anymore. So there is no reason not to give me the lighter punishment since it will have exactly the same effect on my future behavior."

There is some merit to this argument. YOU don't get to use it.

And that's because you weren't thinking of the consequences at all at the time. You didn't say to yourself, "I'm being very toxic, and maybe I'll get caught, but even if I do I'm okay with the two-week ban I will receive." You didn't rationally plan that out. You acted with no regard for the possible consequences. So it doesn't matter that Riot didn't spell out exactly what was at stake and exactly what date those stakes increased. You would not have acted differently. You were not considering the consequences of your actions so you're not entitled to this argument.

thepay310/7/2015, 9:37:39 PM1 votes

agree

pass me the guac11/10/2015, 12:36:31 AM1 votes

what if i was banned on the 11th of august?

Live2LetDie10/7/2015, 9:59:21 PM1 votes

I like their decision since its the first time they are doing it. It really makes people who care about getting a sexy skin, which is a lot, think twice about being toxic. Its just said that people have to be motivated to respect each other.