Think about it what is the point of the other tier runes,i understand to give you a boost when yuo cant afford them but then you waste hard earnd ip on things that are outmatched in a couple more games time.I feel they are next to useless at this point and only confuse the rune and masteries system further for new players.
Id love to hear your thoughts on this.
Tier 1s cost entirely insignificant amount of ip and offer a solid half of the bonus of tier 3s, so as someone who doesn't have more than a couple full pages of tier 3s they help a lot. Don't remove tier 1 runes.
I agree. Additionally, rune pages should be free / editable in champion select, and rune prices should be dramatically cut. The current system is very alienating to new players.
I think the best solution is to allow you to upgrade runes.
Take the cost of a Tier 1 or 2 and subtract it from the total of the next tier you are buying.
Buy a Tier 1 for 200IP
Then Tier 2 costs 400IP
So when you already own Tier 1 then buy Tier 2 you only have to spend 200IP.
Probably easier way of explaining this, but it allows the early game ruins without making a wasted purchase.
Almost every single person in this thread in favor of removing tier 1 & 2 runes seems to have missed the update to them where their prices were drastically reduced and most of the rarely used ones were removed. Even many people who think they're fine how they are right now don't actually realize how cheap they are. One person who thought they're fine said "A full tier 1 runepage costs like 1500 IP and tier 2 isn't much more expensive."
Buying 3x every quint and 9x every non quint of tier 1s right now costs 1035 IP. ALL OF THEM. Not one rune pages worth. ALL! Just 1035 IP. Quints are 15 IP and non quints are 5 IP at tier 1. That's dirt cheap. A single full rune page of tier 1s (at lvl 30 with all slots unlocked) costs a mere 180 IP.
Tier 2s are 100 IP per quint and 35 IP per non quint. AKA 7080 for 3x every quint and 9x every non quint tier 2. One full rune page (again, at lvl 30 with all slots unlocked) costs a mere 1245 IP. Note that that's less than one person in favor of not removing them thought an entire tier 1 page costs.
Compare these to tier 3s. A single tier 1 full rune page costs less than the cheapest single tier 3 runes (205 IP). A single tier 2 full rune page costs less than the most expensive single tier 3 rune (2050 IP).
Meanwhile just 9 tier 3 glyphs of flat CDR costs 7380 IP. Tier 3s are the problem. Tiers 1 & 2 are now fine.
P.S. Some fun math I decided to do: If you only buy tier 1s from lvl 1 to lvl 9 you'll have spent 90 IP on tier 1s (assuming 2 completely unique rune pages, never replacing runes once bought). From lvl 10 to lvl 19 you'll spend an additional 830 IP (again, same 2 completely unique pages, no replacements assumptions including of the tier 1s). If you start a new account, get the free IP boost from securing your e-mail thing, and play 1 game that day vs bots and win, then do the same the next day and the one after, those 3 games alone will pay for your entire reasonable tier 1 & 2 rune purchases and more.
The two biggest power gaps in the leveling process are the levels right around the Flash unlock and the levels right around 20, where tier 3 runes become available. There's no point in buying Tier 1 or 2, as you'll just replace them later and they are really just not worth the IP (especially the tier 2).
I feel like removing the tier 1 and 2 runes would definitely increase this gap, but would also be generally positive, saving new players IP, and giving them less to micromanage outside of matches in a game they're still learning.
This discussion could have been worthwhile a year ago... but the new rune price is actually really really cool compared to what it does give. It is easier for a player to jump in a fair combat with other players in most roles, maybe only junglers being affected by it.
For example ability power tier 2 runes grant 0.92 ap, while tier 3 grant 1.19 , a 30% increase sorta from t2 to t3, that is really an hefty amount that however gets lost between masteries, items aaand, most of all, skill play: even a step can make insignificant this change. The price for t2 in this case is 35, t3 is 410 ( more than 10 times more).
If you have something against that is because the rune system as whole is... well i might be favoring a side but to me is a pile of shit where you have to sink IP instead of buying cool stuff like champions ( heck even rune pages would be intresting if runes were free) , since there are loads of them and almost all with 6k IP price, even with the discount efforts.
Remove tear 2 runes, keep tier 1 (they cost nothing and the jump from nothing to something is better than something so something a bit better). And make it possible to refund runes for 33% of the original cost or something.
These runes don't have to go away. It'd be cool if you could upgrade them to their tier 3 counterparts.
As NotDevan says though, rune customization (runes+pages) is too expensive. That should be addressed first, before everything else
i mean if you're just playing for fun and want to unlock every champion first. T1 runes are your best bet. even more so with it's price deduction.
T2 on the other hand is NOT WORTH it tho.
It's an IP sink. They won't remove them. It's in Riot's favor for people to spend IP on things they don't necessarily need. That way they spend more time playing to save IP for the things they do, or they become impatient and spend RP on characters or boosts.
Label secondary runes while we're at it, IP grind is fucking real when I keep buying secondaries.
We should at least be able to get a small amount of IP back by refunding lower Tier Runes for Tier 3's, im tired of having them all over my Rune inv and constantly grinding IP for Runes for my MULTIPLE champ builds.
They massively dropped the prices on T1/2 runes, so T2 isn't nearly as bad as they used to be (I think they're around 100 ip now). But yeah, the LvL 20 gap is pretty big.
Tier 1 runes are cost effective for new players, I always recommend to buy them, one tier 3 rune is equal to 9 tier 1, fill pages with ease and no effort.
Reasons: -Tier 3 runes cost 10x the price of Tier 1 -Tier 3 runes doesn't even give 2x stats of Tier 1.
Remove Tier 2, these are a waste.
Rune Pages should cost about 3150-4800 or so IP so it's not instant buy, but not extreme to get. Tier 1 and 2 runes should be removed and the current Tier 3 runes available at all levels. Cut rune costs to about 125-150% of the current cost of Tier 2 runes. Boom.
In my opinion, they serve two purposes:
On that second part, that means a level 5 character who just started will have some fewer boosts than a level 15, but those boosts will be held back a fairly heavy amount. This can be the difference between a landslide loss, and a hardfought victory if played right.
I would like if #1 wasn't necessary, but I feel that a couple hard stomps on new players would probably drain the fun out of the game without something to keep them coming back.
That said, I keep coming back, and I haven't had progression in years. Maybe the whole leveling system can go? I'm on the fence.
Think about it what is the point of the other tier runes,i understand to give you a boost when yuo cant afford them but then you waste hard earnd ip on things that are outmatched in a couple more games time.I feel they are next to useless at this point and only confuse the rune and masteries system further for new players.
Id love to hear your thoughts on this.
T2 quints are a fine alternative until one can grind the IP for the extremely over priced t3 quints.
You don't lose much in stats and it's better than nothing until you can put down thousands of IP for quints
Rune/mastery system should be completely removed.
word dog bumpy bumpertons
I don't think giving yourself cheap stats is a waste of money in any way. Especially with how dirt cheap t1 t2 runes are. That being said I don't think t3 runes should cost 2000+ for ONE quint
True, they're outclassed, but for people just turning 30 those tier 1 and 2's can carry them into ranked well while allowing them to build a decent champion pool. While they aren't efficient in the long run, they can easily subsidize your stat disadvantage for people looking to speedrun to Challenjour
Keep Tier 1, don't care about Tier 2. Not gonna play 30 or 40 games to get a rune page complete when I can spend 10 or less games of ip on Tier 1 runes to complete the same page.
I remember a looong time ago someone asked Riot if they could make T1 runes completely free and remove t2 runes. Would be amazing to be honest, but not very realistic.
Remove runes in general, make masteries more complex (and rise the max level) that's how I would do it.
Thank you very much for all your feedback i love the community input hope to hear from a riot employee 
I didn't bother with runes until I was able to start using tier 3s.
My take is that tier 2 runes are useless. Tier 1 runes should be cheaper than they are.
