ADCs feel way too bursty

vOmvbrawfU·2/2/2017, 1:16:12 PM·25 votes·2,159 views

It used to be that ADCs were sustained damage in fights. Mostly to smack away on the tanky champs on the enemy front line. Now they kind of feel like they burst people as quick as assassins (go ahead and get caught out by a shiv/ie Vayne). And I think the reason why is because they added damage onto everything.

See, there is supposed to be a cool balance thing where Assassins > ADC > Tanks > Assassins. But there was a point where tanks were weak and assassins were killing everything *cough zed cough*. I think we all remember where the team that got Zed one. It was annoying. So what did they do? Added damage to tanks. And when I say tanks, I'm included all those goofy words that you guys like to use, vanguard, diver, fighter, tank, etc. By way of items, etc. Well then ADCs couldn't as effectively kill those champions. So they added more damage to ADCs! Yay! Most recently, we went through a phase where assassins are useless, except a select few. Why? Because ADCs can just burst people.

Basically, what I'm trying to say is, stop throwing damage on everyfuckingthing. Just look at the whole knew masteries system. Basically damage, damage, and tankydamage. People say, "adc in 2k17 lul", but it has nothing to do with ADCs being weak. It has to do with tanky champs just being able to dive through your team and nuke your backline....because everything got damage added on. I mean seriously, release Ekko has more damage in his kit than Veigar does. Makes no sense considering how much other shit Ekko has built in. And then rito wondered why Ekko was batshit crazy.

Tl;dr: If you could stop throwing damage on everything, that'd be great.

38 Comments

dominusx2/2/2017, 1:24:28 PM6 votes

but adcs are meant to to burst per second without beeing gated by resources or cooldowns while also having enormous lifesteal and on top of that beeing able to 1v1 everything according to adc mains. But i'm immobile hurr durr yeh you are too bad everyone dies once they approach your killzone.

Twinity Ferce2/2/2017, 1:21:48 PM4 votes

Leblanc

Big Lincoln2/2/2017, 1:26:17 PM4 votes

we didn't add damage to tanks; in fact a handful of them have lost damage. Sejuani Nautilus for example

tanks got stronger defensive steroids as Riot went through and worked on them, Poppy Nautilus Sion so it seems like they do more damage because they're lasting a lot longer

GigglesO2/2/2017, 10:06:59 PM3 votes

[{quoted}](name=Sharkbait ohaha,realm=NA,application-id=cIfEodbz,discussion-id=EKJ4gAid,comment-id=,timestamp=2017-02-02T13:16:12.281+0000)

It used to be that ADCs were sustained damage in fights. Mostly to smack away on the tanky champs on the enemy front line. Now they kind of feel like they burst people as quick as assassins (go ahead and get caught out by a shiv/ie Vayne). And I think the reason why is because they added damage onto everything.

Tl;dr: If you could stop throwing damage on everything, that'd be great.

It isn't that they just keep throwing damage everywhere, they keep removing tank from everything too.

IA9hRfpP5q2/2/2017, 1:23:14 PM3 votes

Veigar at min 15:00 presses R

LUL

XeroKimo2/3/2017, 1:15:50 AM2 votes

ADCs with burst has always existed, at the moment, there's: Vayne, to early game got toned down, late game, her Q AA with statik burst is still alot. Caitlyn's burst is situational, needing her trap MF is also situational needing the crit Q bounce for Vayne level burst, else, it's pretty much a normal AA crit. Draven's burst hasn't really changed Corki is probably mostly due to TDL Quinn with E + AA burst Graves..... hasn't changed much either, it's just harder to get that burst down, but no one plays him adc anymore so meh.

Before, almost anyone who built statik was mainly the "burst" kind of adc, but usually sucks after that burst, with exceptions. Vayne back then didn't build 80% crit, but if she did crit with 50% chance on Q + AA, on squishies, it did slightly less damage late due to the fact statik was at a static (hue) 100 dmg all game. Quinn, pretty much, go valor form, E Q auto R in 1 second and any squishy would die, but no one ever used her ult to kill people often, but her E + AA was still deadly. MF's Q burst wasn't there because her passive wasn't like getting a free crit off her auto late game, and her Q didn't deal an extra 50% extra dmg if she killed her first target with Q. Draven..... hasn't changed much like I said, even back then, people would be like 3 BTs 1 IE and LW and say goodbye to 80% of your squishy HP while you can't dmg me with this 54% life steal. Corki was more like a worse ez before. Graves, same thing, E Q AA R in like 1 second, your hp is gone. Lucian, if you wanted to be absurd, build statik, IE, Bortk, TF, LW, E -> AA was pretty much 80% hp gone, I did this often so I know, but it was risky.

Burst back then was like dealing 80% of your hp in 1 second or killing you in 1 second, so getting critted like 3 times by jinx auto, or getting your hp melted by twitch in 2 seconds today, was not considered burst before, and I don't consider it burst still

Skorch2/2/2017, 4:13:02 PM2 votes

Arent ADCs sustain damage? At the levels of burst... kek.

I dont actually think ADCs are that OP right now, at least most of them anyway

LankPants2/3/2017, 4:22:21 AM2 votes

ADCs are actually disgusting right now. I don't understand where this idea that ADCs are somehow weak comes from, probably self entitled ADC mains who are so used to them being the absolute top class that they bitch and whine when anything else gets anywhere near them. The simple dact is, as long as Caitlyn is doing 3000 damage to a 300 armour tank in 2 seconds, they're not weak, they're disgustingly broken.

Bottom Laner2/3/2017, 2:05:40 AM1 votes

TFW you confuse "Miscellaneous" for "Gameplay", but then again you also confused "won" and "one", and "knew" and "new" so I'd imagine you struggle with certain concepts

Stephenizgod2/3/2017, 8:54:32 PM1 votes

Assassins kill ADC's or Mages (although with Mages its whoever strikes first), Supports try to stop Assassins, Tanks are either Peel or Engage with low damage but high CC and survive-ability, ADC's (this used to include melee ad champs such as Fighters and Divers) lay down a sustained damage to kill Tanks and Objectives, Mages deal a lot of damage to one person or moderate damage to a lot of people they also generally have CC but its not as reliable as Tanks and Supports plus their damage is Magic to help counter any Armor built.

This is a pretty good balance of things, in my opinion. Everything has a purpose, one or two roles they must fulfill depending on their champion (one Support may protect through absorbing damage and CCing enemies, while another may protect through pure sustain).

Now we have damage everywhere, Poppy and Maokai deal a surprising amount of damage just by themselves add on that they also take forever to kill and their damage is usually up there with the ADC's at the end of the game. Assassins either completely obliterate anything and everything with very little you can do (like Kha or LeBlanc) or they struggle against the burst of ADC's after a certain period of time has passed (like Talon). ADC's are burst drain tanks, massive instant damage with a ton of lifesteal, makes them incredibly difficult to face once late game hits. Fighter and Divers are either useless or build Bruiser builds making them incredibly difficult to deal with as well, while retaining their damage (since their items are generally cheaper they tend to be stronger early game and snowball, thus games "end" quicker and ADC's don't have time to get strong).

Like you said a big issue is A) items getting random damage (plus tank items getting less tank for some reason) and B) certain champs being designed with too many tools available to them to deal damage (Ekko is a prime example of this, I mean wth did you think would happen with him? look at his kit its disgusting...)

If anyone doubts there is more damage nowadays, just look at the Support Role. Brand Zyra Malzahar these 3 dominate it and their damage is absolutely ridiculous, especially Zyra. This should be a huge red flag to the balance team, when the best option for a Support is just more damage, you know something is wrong. Why peel for ADC when they are just going to get blown up instantly anyways? Might as well just blow up whoever killed them or better yet kill the enemy before your ADC gets blown up. I am not saying the other Supports are garbage, just look at Janna's winrate, but there is a reason why those 3 mages are so popular in the Support role. They deal a massive amount of damage for cheap and are incredibly hard to deal with.

Skelenth2/3/2017, 2:35:16 PM1 votes

Similar with DPS mages like Ryze and Cassiopeia.

Duke Dryfocker2/3/2017, 8:28:37 PM1 votes

Unfortunately this is not a RIOT problem so much as a TenCent problem. Since the Asian company now owns it 100%, they have done what RIOT had the integrity not to. But now RIOT has CEO's to answer to, that aren't their own.

This company knows one thing, and you can bet the game will keep sliding in this direction-----> The more shit you are able to blow up with burst damage, the more shit you will buy!

It's that simple folks. Time to sell the account? Between game balance and BOTS, maybe. But I don't see it changing back to the best years.

Duke Dryfocker2/3/2017, 8:30:11 PM1 votes

Bet: The next new champ will have so much burst, you'll wish you were playing against the old Talon.

GankedFromBehind2/3/2017, 1:11:33 AM1 votes

What ADC bursts?

Especially compared to Mages?

Zac bursts harder than any ADC, while also CCimg you for a good 3 seconds.