Boards›Live Gameplay Balance

Current Itemization Gaps in League of Legends

TiberiusAudley·7/15/2014, 5:40:03 AM·22 votes·1,104 views

You know those threads that sometimes pop up where players tell Riot what the game needs? This is one of those threads. My focus is on what's missing in terms of itemization paths in the game currently. It's a bit lengthy, but you can skim through the bolded headers to see if you want to actually read it. Please note that all of these itemization notes are related strictly to Summoner's Rift. I acknowledge that some of these item gaps do not exist on other maps.

Health+Armor versus Health+MR

Right now, the premium Health+Armor or MR items are pretty awkward to me in their builds.

For Armor, your best choices are Sunfire and Randuin's. Both build out of Belt and Chain Vest. The only other armor item that gives both health and armor is Spirit of the Ancient Golem, which gives 20 armor and is tailored specifically to junglers.

For MR, there are three primary choices: Locket of the Iron Solari, Banshee's Veil, or Spirit Visage. All three of these build out of (among other things) 2 Rubies and a Negatron. There are no Health+MR options that build out of Mantle, nor any MR options at all that build out of Giant's Belt.

I understand not wanting to cement a player who's already purchased a Chain Vest into getting a Sunfire Cape versus Randuin's should he wish to change his build path on the way there, and having two Cowl options, but there's a problem that arises from the gap mentioned from health+resist items that build out of ruby and the smaller resist choice.

Tanky supports, such as Alistar, Leona, Taric, (and the other less common ones such as Nunu, Nautilus, Maokai, etc.) suffer from a lack of cheap tank items. With SotAG being the only Cloth+Health item available, supports literally have no option to itemize for cheap armor and health. This forces their balance to be more reliant on having overloaded resists in their kit rather than available to build via items (and hurts those that rely on self-healing or shields to get their tankiness in lane.)

Meanwhile, the more mage-oriented supports have a different problem...

Forbidden Idol is everywhere!

Holy jesus, this item got forced down our throats hard. It has FOUR different upgrades, 3 of which are primarily support items, and the fourth being a situationalish AP item. The problem?

Forbidden Idol, the mana regen CDR item, was put onto Chalice, the already be-all, end-all of mana regen in order to buffer the cost of Mikael's against its game-changing active. It makes the item less attractive to tanky/Relic Shield supports who may have wanted the item for its active, and less attractive to mage supports with Frostfang who REALLY don't need THAT MUCH mana regeneration. (Oh, and if you aren't Relic or Frostfang, guess what... you have to buy ANOTHER Forbidden Idol to upgrade your support item.)

If Mikael's really needed a buffer of that sort while also granting 10% CDR, Glacial Shroud or Kindlegem are both available, even more expensive than Forbidden Idol, and offer more appealing stats for champions that aren't left spamming their skill buttons just to see if they can even make their mana bar move anymore.

Tier 3 Support Items have a really terrible sell-back price.

I understand Tier 1 and 2 having poor prices, since they are almost ENTIRELY geared toward gold generation. However, Tier 3 doesn't increase the gold generation from tier 2 (except in the case of the Relic Shield line). This means almost all of the gold used in upgrading from a Tier 2 Gold Generation item to a Tier 3 is going toward actual stats or active abilities...but the sellback price is treated as though it is SOLELY gold generation.

The tier 3 support items should sell back either at a standard item price, or somewhere in between Tier 2 and Standard in order to allow supports some leeway in late-game situations should they wish to exchange a Frost Queen's or FotM for Talisman (or vice-versa, in case of lobotomy.)

And before I leave the topic of supports, one last subject...

Sightstone upgrade?

Sightstone can be upgraded. To a Ruby Sightstone. You get 1 extra ward in your pool and some more health. Yippee...~

I feel this is an area where support itemization could be explored a little bit – Sightstone + Aether Wisp could be a safer alternative for the Ardent Censer in order to allow it to see play (face it, between Mikael's and Censer, it's a hard-sell for Censer...though you may have to rename it to Ardent Sensor if it places wards!)

I won't dwell on this area too much for now, since otherwise there would be some overlap in the topics to come. Just... I really wish there were more Sightstone upgrade paths than Ruby, and that the upgrades actually felt meaningful. Ruby Sightstone is a really shitty upgrade in terms of how it feels to upgrade.

And on the topic of vision...

Quill Coat is the only tier-2 Jungle Item / Machete Upgrade that gives vision.

I'm not sure why this is. Granted, Wriggle's/Flare are the only other jungle item that give vision, it still doesn't seem “fair” that tanky junglers get access to a free ward much, much earlier in their build path. If this wasn't an accidental oversight, and is instead a means of tanky junglers to be safer from counter jungling...then my next two paragraphs are an alternative.

There is currently a gap in the vision abilities of trinkets in the early game (pre-level 9+upgrades) – where stealth junglers (Evelynn) have few means of being tracked, especially in solo queue situations.

Prior to the S4 vision changes going live, I'd recommended a potential active for Madred's Razors enabling the item to have charges like Sightstone that allowed a player to place “barbs” (like Nidalee traps) that would reveal a target for a few seconds. Quill Coat would actually be a great carrier for an active like this, while enabling Tanky junglers to still set up “safety nets” of their jungle in order to know if they are being invaded.

Phage

Phage is what actually sparked me wanting to make this thread (since I saw the Phage thread that was posted earlier today. In an Alistar feedback thread, I posted that Phage is an area that Riot could explore buffing him without directly touching him.

Phage on its own is an item that tanky champions and bruisers would love, even if they don't want or can't afford Trinity Force.

Some sort of item with small amounts of tanky stats that also brought Phage's ability to giddy-up and go would be a welcome addition to Phage's build path for champions who aren't looking to buy the item for its inevitable shift into Trinity Force. Of course, if they aren't looking for TONS OF DAMAGE, chances are they were looking for my next category...

Movement Speed

Ever since the removal of FoN and the real Shurelya's Reverie (may they rest in peace with HoG), there's been a sorely missing gap for tanks in the line of movement speed items.

MR+MS = Only Mercurial's active. Armor+MS = None. Zero. Zilch. Health+MS = Phage/TriForce (And Phage doesn't show up in shop category for those two stats.)

Now that Randuin's has lost its passive on-struck slow, this makes non-gap closing tanks even more problematic. If the issue is that such an item makes it even harder to counterplay tanks/bruisers that DO have gap closers, perhaps a passive could be added to it that uses a mechanic like Statikk Shiv or Yasuo's Flow to determine how far you've moved in a certain amount of time, and the item could “overload” if it generated too much in too short of a time and disable its passive for a duration. (Though, this would still enable the item to be abusable for those who use gap closers solely for initiating like Malphite or Zac.)

Cooldown Reduction

Okay, so seven thousand items build out of Fiendish Codex and now we have 4 that build out of Forbidden Idol. What are we missing in terms of CDR?

There is only one Armor+CDR item (SotAG) that does not include mana – so games where manaless characters want to stack armor against a physical-heavy team, they are forced to seek out CDR elsewhere. Though, this itemization gap isn't much better for MR, where your MR options are either of the two Chalice upgrades, Spirit Visage, or upgrading your Aegis to Locket with the purchase of a Kindlegem.

Attack Damage+CDR offers the two Brutalizer upgrade paths (Ghostblade + Cleaver), Elder Lizard, Zephyr, Zeke's Herald, and our new toy Essence Reaver. Essence Reaver's given stats scream it would love to be built with a Brutalizer. The mana regen passive seems like it would want to be a “prolonged laning phase power spike” item, so having it build out of a Brutalizer would enable champions like Ezreal or Varus to build it while making their Qs really pack a punch.

Black Cleaver and Zeke's Herald fill very similar niches. Zeke's gives lifesteal and 10% more CDR, while Cleaver gives more selfish stats and potentially a much clearer impact in a late game team fight thanks to the armor shred. Zeke's almost feels superfluous, and though I loved Stark's Fervor, I don't love the Kindlevamp Zeke's. (Also, Zeke's is only 50 more HP than Cleaver, despite its HP being the closest it has to a lure for supports to buy it.)

The only other item in the CDR category that is a bit weird to me is Banner of Command – it's outshone by both the other AP + 20% CDR items, which both include mana regen. Banner of Command's minion aura is a bit wonky, but I think it and Morellonomicon should actually have their recipes swapped. No minion-based champion is manaless, but some champions who want Morellonomicon's passive are. This might push Morellonomicon out of the way of being built, but it would make more sense for the two items.

I want armor, and I want attack damage.

There is only one item that gives -either- attack speed -or- damage while also giving armor in League of Legends: Atma's Impaler.

Any time you want armor and damage, you have to get them from two separate sources or get Atma's Impaler. (Don't get me wrong, I like Atma's Impaler and I think it's one of the most underrated items in the game right now by players, especially given the reliance on Health runes these days).

...but Armor + actual damage = Atma's only.

The only issue with Atma's holding that niche is that it dissuades AD Casters from buying it with its build path containing critical chance (wtf Avarice Blade). Speaking of Avarice Blade...

Executioner's Calling

My final topic for this thread...

Executioner's Calling is an item that is not meant to be slot efficient, but purchased for its passive. I do not understand why the item contains critical chance.

Unlike Morellonomicon, which has been buffed to be a viable build option for mages, EC continues to be overlooked. The “basic attacks” portion could be changed to operate like Cleaver's “on physical damage” or Morello with magic while triggering when a target is below a threshold, and have its stats either shifted or outright retooled toward an attack damage focus.

If the item's stats are fine, but it is ever decided it needs to become slot efficient, rather than touching the stats, it could instead be given an on-hit that deals additional damage based on missing HP in order to help the wielder finish off that pesky regenerating Mundo or potential heal-spammed target. This would increase its late game potential as a “finisher” item once a target has narrowly survived an initial burst. It would also have the item live up to its name “Executioner” quite a bit better.

Still, crit chance on EC doesn't make much sense to me and the item could use some iterating upon.

Welp...That about covers the bases I wanted to cover in my thread! Hope you enjoyed the segues.

12 Comments

Pyro7/15/2014, 6:52:08 AM2 votes

Health+Armor versus Health+MR

You raise fair points from a support perspective, but efficient health+armor items warp the toplane itemization.

Forbidden Idol is everywhere!

It has its place in some recipes, but you're right in Mikael's being an overkill. This should have been Glacial Shroud.

Tier 3 Support Items have a really terrible sell-back price.

GP10 and GA have lower sellback price for a reason. It's part of the item's cost.

Sightstone upgrade?

Making Sightstone upgrades too efficient is dangerous for the jungle balance.

Quill Coat is the only tier-2 Jungle Item / Machete Upgrade that gives vision.

Rightfully so. It's meant for vulnerable tank junglers who can't 1v1 the enemy to ward jungle entrance and farm safely. I would actually claim that Wriggle's Lantern should not have the free ward (and get buffed), it's a relic of thee old times.

Phage

Yeah, this one is lackluster. I'd gladly see it build into an armor item with Glacial Shroud, or Entropy, or Zeke's Herald.

Movement Speed

There's a reason we don't throw mobility left and right. % MS on armor/MR items is a very dangerous idea. I'm all for al ternative Phage upgrade, though.

Cooldown Reduction

This is where you miss the point the most. Manaless champions are not supposed to have easy access to CDR, period. They are balanced around their cooldowns. This is why we had SV's CDR nerfed to 10%.

It's a valid concern about supports having too much CDR. You'll start with 10 from runes/masteries, then get 10 from first support item and 10-20 from the second one - and you're maxed. Zeke's Herald, for example, should be reworked without CDR. Same goes for Twin Shadows and Ardent Canser, which are quite meh in their current state.

I want armor, and I want attack damage.

Then go buy them in t wo separate slots, Renekton.

Seriously though, armor+AD cannot happen, it would, again: warp toplane.

Executioner's Calling

This should be a bruiser item. If it was gold and slot efficient, carries would shut down enemy carries too much with it.

Phage + Avarice Blade, maybe?

Goumindong7/15/2014, 8:57:33 AM1 votes

I talk a bit about this in my post about item efficiency (with a focus on support itemization) and will expand on some of those concepts when replying to your post.

The short of it is that just because two different base item, or base stat types exist does not mean that there should exist items which combine them. The two most obvious are AD and armor/health. These items are super efficient on a class of champions which are already designed to be strong with a low amount of itemization. Creating that item would really mess up a lot of balance decisions with regards to which champion types are strong at which points in the game. Specifically, bruisers would become much stronger at all points, and carries would likely lose their ability to be lategame powerhouses.

The long of it is that tank itemization, including tank itemization for supports, is in a pretty good spot (its one of the reasons that the most popular supports are those which can or tend to build tanky). The reason its in a pretty good spot has to do with overall itemization efficiency and the time frame in which tank based champions are supposed to be strong.

Specifically, early tank itemization items are really strong. They're much more efficient than their utility or damage counterparts. Completed item slot efficiency and gold efficiency is relatively low. Compared to offensive items the components are very powerful and the completed items less so. So the statement "tanky supports suffer from a lack of cheap tank items" is absolutely wrong. Tanky supports have a bevy of amazingly cheap tank items from Kindlegem (and its upgrades) to Glacial shroud, to Chain vests. What they don't have is a good ability to start purchasing those until the slightly less efficient sight/gold items are done, but that is a support issue in general and is actually worse for supports who don't scale hard from the health they get in Sight Stone.

When looking for suggestions in the future, it might be valuable to think about what specifically the role of each type of stat is in the greater picture this will help you understand some of the systematic differences between the different types of items.

For instance, tank items have very good components, but average gold and poor slot efficiency. This is because the power spike of tanky champions is meant to be early, and then fall off later as damage champions complete their items. Similarly AD items have pretty bad components, but decent gold efficiency, and really amazing slot efficiency. This is because AD's are meant to have more power in the end game, and high slot efficiency means that when that rolls around, they can simply carry more gold in their item slots. AP's are right in the middle, with very high gold efficiency, but only average-good slot efficiency

ProfDrDeath7/15/2014, 2:49:32 PM1 votes

item 3222

This item is supposed to be inefficient on tank supports, which was one of the points of the recent changes and the incorporation of Idol into its recipe.

item 3044 and item 3022

As you might know by this point, Riot's item team is looking at FM and questioning its purpose and negative effect on overall game health if it is ever a good item to buy. So, they are removing either the complete item or at least its on-hit slow passive.

My take on a possible replacement passive, one that retained the items purpose as a chasing and light escape tool, would be this, something akin to Vayne's passive:

Unique Passive - Rage: When moving directly towards an enemy champion, grants X (Y for ranged) MS. Hitting an enemy retains the MS boost for 1-2 seconds, even when not facing an enemy champion anymore. Directly means, max. 30° left/right of the imaginary straight line between the champions.

Toggle:
Displays a fine line connecting your champion and the enemy one if the passive move-towards effect is active. Can be switched on or off by toggling (learning purpose, and off-switchable to reduce visual clutter).

As you can guess from the passive's name, this version of the Mallet would build from Phage again, with possibly a Giant's Belt thrown in for high HP. Another stat variant would be to lower the HP granted and switch the Giant's Belt for a Dagger and a Ruby Crystal. AS would also fit the purpose of a chasing item, as it allows you to cycle through your AA animation faster and therefore keep up better.

Funster7/15/2014, 3:51:19 PM1 votes

Not sure why you have a problem with the tankier jungle item path having access to additional utility. I figure that's kind of the reason you take these guys in the jungle in the first place. You could also complain, for the same reason, that the SotAG build path doesn't offer any additional offense against champions. You take SotEL for damage, you take SotAG for utility, and you take SotSW... if you're Elise, I guess. Whether or not it's a good idea to give them a ward, specifically, I don't know, but the extra utility totally makes sense to me.

I'm still waiting for an AD+spellvamp item as well. Very niche, but we still have items like Nashor's Tooth and Runaan's that's a viable option for one single champion, so I don't see why we can't throw an altered version of the old Van Damm's Pillager in the mix.

Caoil7/15/2014, 5:16:05 PM1 votes

This is a great article. I really like your idea to make Sightstone build into different items. I think more junglers (other than Lee Sin) should have a reason to buy Sightstone, but in its current state it just takes up an item slot that is better used for another stat late game. Maybe if Sightstone itself only granted 2 wards and then built into 3-4 late game items? Sometimes even as support I opt to sell Sightstone in favour of late game stats since tanky supports can't get tanky enough for the late game, and AP utility supports can only provide so much utility in a teamfight. I also find myself being the only one warding late in the game as support as well because everyone else runs out of item slots for wards.

I really hope a Rioter sees your post. You have some great points.

Gavran7/15/2014, 6:06:24 PM1 votes

I would really love to see more sightstone upgrades. I far too often find myself build capped on supports because there's this fantastic plethora of great actives for AP/mana supports, and it makes me want to sell my sightstone instead of my FQC because the thing offers so damn little in stats. I don't, of course, because even though I could afford to buy wards for the rest of the game they take an item slot, but...

It's frustrating.

Would it be going too far to have sightstone be the last component in the three support gold generation items? Most supports already build it right before/after their tier 2. It's almost completely necessary and support is already the role that's expected to pick it up.

KSHarrison7/15/2014, 6:30:28 PM1 votes

Hey Tiberius, you always have well thought-out posts :) #Resists and Health I always felt the defensive options had pretty forgiving build paths. For 1400 gold on a Spectre's Cowl, you have 200 health and 45 MR, as well as significant regen. On the armor side, for 1720 gold you have 350 health and 45 Armor. Unlike any other stat, resists are actually quite efficient early as LW and Void haven't been bought yet, and 350 health in the case of armor (as well as on the MR route if you add in the Ruby Crystal for a Banshee's for a similar price) is nearly as much as top tier items offer.

What kind of mid-range tanky item did you have in mind, or were you looking in particular for options less than 1k gold? What about Ninja Tabi? Otherwise, you have fairly gold efficient stepping stones on the way to the top tier defensive items. I mean, a Negatron provides nearly top tier amounts of MR for comparatively little gold. #Sightstone I really like the idea for sightstone upgrades. That would potentially constitute embracing sightstone as a staple jungler item, beyond Lee Sin or "that one Elise build." I'm almost afraid it would promote too much free vision. How do you feel about that? #Quill Coat As you talked about the disparity between ward availability on jungler items, it made a lot of sense. The idea of a "trap" would be great, considering tanky junglers often have a problem with early game invasions from top junglers. #Phage I'm not sure of Phage buffs. It'd depend on how the stats are reallocated, but some very powerful bruisers use Trinity Force who don't need buffs. Jax immediately comes to mind, but next to BotRK, Trinity Force is often the go to sole offensive item for bruisers.

Just how necessary is an Armor/MR option with %MS? How many tanks in the game don't have a gap closer? The closest I could find were Chogath and Galio, both of whom have awkward forms of closing a gap. The only definitive tank without one was Alistar, unless I overlooked the list. So, really, how many tanks would we be helping with an armor %MS item? #CDR I actually also considered Essence Reaver with a Brutalizer. I haven't used the item; we just have to be careful any new iteration is different than BC.

I'm personally against the switch between Morellonomicon and Banner of Command. I think it's a potential short-term solution to look at, but long-term there may be a manaless champion with minions released. What champions are we helping with Morello changes? I'm leery of balancing items around the current meta, as I am not convinced that item changes, with their sweeping influence, are the right way to go about helping a small subset of champions in a specific meta. #Armor + AD I've felt this a long time. I agree both EC and Atma's feel awkward. Crit itself is such a polarizing stat, and it feels awkward and inconsistent in small amounts. I don't like it on almost any of the items outside of PD/Shiv/IE.

I also don't believe in slot inefficient items. I haven't worked enough with items to have gone down the list of all items with my philosophy, but I can't recall any slot inefficient item that was considered viable. I think such an item would need to be well-rounded so it can appeal to a variety of champions (bye bye %crit chance). There's no point in having an item designed for early game appeal to only half of the early game champions, for if the item ever becomes viable, then the early game champs who can't use it become by default unviable. The other thing with items that have a fluctuating power curve between early and late game is that their usefulness tends to depend on the meta, making them probably impossible to balance long-term. Champions are like this, too. Jax was unusable in an early game meta but unstoppable in a late game one, and if we ever want to make him balanced in a late game meta, he'll be even more susceptible to shifts to earlier-game metas. I don't think items should have this kind of performance pattern, since entire groups of champions rely on their consistency (balance design does too).

Skias7/15/2014, 7:30:54 PM1 votes

I think Executioner's Calling could use a little thematic fluffing up. Its a cool item for combating massive hp regen effects and lifesteal stacking.

If it had some sort of effect like... everytime it reduces a champions' healing effect, it gives the user some sort of buff. Perhaps every three charges you can activate it to fire a small blade beam forward? Something interative and cool.

I would hate to see it become a stat stick and anti BT.

So its like... "Each time executioners calling reduces a targets healing effect, it gains a charge. Charges cannot be generated faster then every 2 seconds or so. At 3 charges, you can release the calling, a wave of energy that deals ----- damage with a (.--) ad ratio."

Make it sort of shortish range.

oddeyeoval7/15/2014, 10:43:52 PM1 votes

DISCLAIMER: Sort of off-topic A Speed Item for Tanks

What would be nice for tanks that want a phage item but do not want triforce would be an item similar to Blink Dagger in DotA, but without the blink. I'm thinking something along the lines of either an incredibly short burst of a large amount of MS, or even a fairly medium-range dash (which would add some mechanical complexity to champions like Mundo). I know by this point one of the disadvantages of this item seems to be that it offers champs like Shyvana and Jax too much mobility, but it can be balanced by being either extremely expensive, like in the range of 2000-3000 gold, or by having extremely low stats, for example maybe a bit of ad, a bit of health, and maybe a different version of phage passive. Tanks would therefore be forced to choose between buying this item and keeping it for initiations or buying that one last health item that makes them practically a walking raid boss, offering diversity and choice in item builds. This would have the added side-effect of making tanks less tanky overall, one of my not-so-little gripes with Season 4 coming to bear.

This is just an idea, and I also see many ways this item could be incredibly overpowered, but in League I think it would sit in a good place for champs that already have enough base stats to get by.item 3184

bryjow1237/15/2014, 6:04:22 AM1 votes

Upvote for well thought out and well-written thread. :D

Frikgeek7/16/2014, 2:18:46 AM1 votes

We could really use a good item for AD stackers to replace the old Bloodthirster. Hydra is really nice for splitpushing which is why most AD toplaners always preferred it over BT, but for assassinating a single target it simply doesn't give you enough AD per gold. It's much more efficient to just stack B.F. swords if you want AD(34.5ish gold for AD on B.F. vs 42.66 on hydra). I realise that good AD caster itemisation would suddenly make AD casters broken, but it would be nice if you could play AD casters as CASTERS, not just abuse Yomuu's/Botrk like every other autoattacker. Then just nerf AD casters to compensate or something. And you could give it spellvamp instead of lifesteal to make sure it won't be OP on regular autoattackers.