What would make LoL amazing?

Talith PA·Jul 24, 2014·12 votes·1,436 views

Hmm, what would make this game the best? I took some time to think about my concerns with the game and what I'd love to see happen in Season 5.

Talith's Season 5 Wishlist:

Critical Hit (CH) in it's current RNG based implementation completely removed:

All items containing it altered.
Champions based around having CH are altered to reflect these changes (Marksmen, Light Fighters, etc.)
Reworked Critical Hit is focused entirely on enhancing auto-attacks, either on every attack or on conditional triggers.
AD / CDR is now the main purchase for ability focused Bruisers, Assassins, some Light Fighters, and Skirmishers (ability focused Marksmen such as Lucian, Jayce, and Ezreal)
AS / CH is the main purchase for auto-attack focused Marksmen (Vayne, Caitlyn, etc.) and Light Fighters (Tryn, Yasuo, Fiora, etc.). These champions could (should) also have AS / CH scaling in their abilities.

Overall game length averaging at 20 - 25 minutes, a handful of games pushing as far as 30-35 minutes depending on how even teams are and team compositions (this should be rare). This is similar to Dominion pacing but with SR laning, fighting over neutral objectives, and the eventual base destruction endgame instead of the back and forth point capture gameplay.

Support Champions re-branded as Tacticians:

Defined as having abilities geared towards manipulating the flow of combat to either enhance or protect allies, subvert enemies, provide map intelligence, or otherwise contribute to combat in ways that aren't just applying damage.
In lane these guys should be fighting even more than Marksmen are, and have more gold to work with in general.
To put it bluntly, just learn from Dawngate because Waygate has got Riot beat as far as providing an engaging support experience goes.

Make resource-less abilities the rule, not the exception:

All Champions are now primarily cool-down based. Some Champions are gated by energy, fury, heat, ferocity, arcane power, revamped mana, swag, etc. so that their abilities are not ridiculously overbearing during laning. Champion kits changed to reflect this.
Items containing mana and mana regeneration removed or redesigned. Blue buff changed.
Without the shackles of mana being the rule, laning attrition is primarily health based and should be more active as players are firing more skills. The goal is to make laning more aggressive and engaging.
Mages and Tacticians will both want AP and CDR, but Mages focus on more raw damage while Tacticians aim for more utility and some durability.

The primary concerns with the game are:

Games take way too long, with a laning phase that is too slow and boring. A lot of people just can't play or commit to ranked because they can't be married to their computer for 45 - 90 minutes.
Part of the reason why laning is slow and boring is because mana is suffocating and spending so much gold too remove the problem isn't very fun.
Critical Hit being RNG based is just awful. There is no way to justify some fights being determined entirely by who scored a critical hit first instead of being of by player skill or forcing favorable engagements.
AD itemization is poor in part because of Critical Hit, but also because you can't really target any changes for a single class of AD Champions. AD/CDR vs AS/CH being more cleanly separated should make balancing Bruisers vs Marksmen easier.
"Support" is just a poor, restrictive term. This affects the player conception of what the class is supposed to be doing as well as how they are balanced.

26 Comments

Sir ArmaMalumJul 24, 20145 votes

Removing crit has had some serious discussion as well as some awesome proposals, so you're not alone there.

I do have a big problem with the removal of mana however, Not only is it a staple mechanic for a lot of champs, but it also provides a unique form of gating that reinforces accuracy and punishes missed shots without completely screwing someone over. It allows for spammable low damage spells (Karthus Q, Ryze Q) to still have counterplay. Not to mention the item and ability interactions that benefit directly from mana, completely or partially disjointing them from AP/AD scaling and providing a different build path. That being said Riot has been moving towards this realm of thought (not removal but homogenizing of mana costs, i.e. 100 mana cost on ults) for what I believe is the same general thinking.

Supports re-named as tacticians is kinda unnecessary imho. I see your reasoning, but it's simply a name change and isn't really a gameplay change and because of that I don't really think it's needed. People would still call them supports for quite a while, prime example = ADC to Marksman.

Talith PAJul 24, 20144 votes

I can understand the reservations that people would have about removing mana completely.

If a champion absolutely needs to have a resource pool separate from just managing cooldowns (Swain, Annivia, Maokai ults, Karthus and Cassio spam, etc.) in order to gate ability spam, if it truly 100% needs to be there, then you can just as easily employ energy, D3 Wizard arcane power, or whatever resource feels appropriate so that 100% on cooldown spam forever doesn't quite happen but you are never left feeling like you're completely tapped for any significant amount of time.

But having free abilities with just a cooldown to manage be the rule and then certain abilities being the exception and having an additional resource to gate it while in lane (and be meaningless by group up stage) feels like it opens up a lot more interesting ability creation and use.

Sir ArmaMalumJul 24, 20145 votes

I honestly think you have the right idea, and one that I see Riot doing now, but you're tackling it at the opposite direction. Changes like the removal of mana cost on Kog'maw W, Tristana Q, Lucian E and others are (from what I interpret) made with the thinking of play-making and simple cooldown gating over additional mana gating that was deemed kind of unnecessary. However, linking a resource solely to an ability is something of a slippery slope. Largely because mana gates exactly like what I believe you're looking for, charges. You have a certain amount of uses before you're oom and a slow recovery time. This differs mana gating from other forms of pre-determined resources like Energy (extremely limited use, gates combos, high recovery time) and Rage (Slow constant recovery, one large dump use).

Effectively what I'm trying to say is that mana is claiming a mechanic and playstyle on its own and instead of removing it Riot is just exploring options that don't use it or use another way.

Talith PAJul 24, 20144 votes

You're right, but I feel like they are merely temporary measures that they can throw onto live now without completely shaking up the entire season right as it is approaching its end. Those kinds of mana cost changes are what they can do without a full overhaul, but it doesn't address the problem with the resource itself and the current kind of itemization it has in place just to alleviate it.

If it was only a matter of being able to spam abilities more often then I'd just ask for a super chalice effect built into the map like Dominion and TT have. Those maps let you spam more freely while still having the threat of going OOM. But they don't touch on the itemization problem mana itself causes, the large suite of items specifically made to circumvent mana concerns.

In my mind I'm picturing mana itself becoming a sometimes resource used by champions, like energy is. It's differentiated from energy in that the point of energy is a constant, steady recovery that gates how much you can combo at once. Mana would recover faster the closer to empty it is, meaning even when low you can trickle in abilities or you can wait to fill up so you can fire abilities off more rapidly. But just like energy and all other resources, you wouldn't be able to purchase items specifically to circumvent the resource. By endgame either the regen or the manapool itself scales to the point where it basically doesn't matter anymore.

Sir ArmaMalumJul 24, 20144 votes

But wouldn't the removal of mana itemization actually remove a lot of different interactions within the game? Itemizing would then be a mater of damage, CDR, health and mitigation only, with a few item actives thrown in as well. Imho, I still like having the decision of building for mana sustain an therefore laning staying power, or for damage if I think I can secure the kill. Mana as a resource limits the amount of true engages a mage can have before having to go back and leaving their team at a numers disadvantage. That being said I do also think that the current mana regen prevalence with chalice and Athene's has muddled that counterplay a bit and it's significance is still being turned back around since then.

Talith PAJul 24, 20144 votes

So mana itemization is removed because it is no longer needed thanks to champion abilities being either free or the champions that need mana gating during laning have an altered, faster regenerating mana pool that scales into a point where it doesn't really gate them during team fights or medium length sieges anymore or an appropriate resource to gate them.

What interaction is being threatened by this that doesn't pointlessly extend the duration of laning phase and therefore the game?

Q: What's the difference between these two purchasing paths:?

items that help mana sustain for continued laning so you can then farm endgame items
mid-tier items used for either fighting champions or taking objectives that build into endgame items

About 5-15 minutes added to the duration of a game.

Also, I'm not seeing how having to shore up mana issues is a more engaging experience than purchasing items with actives on them. One is spending gold to fix a gameplay problem a champion has and the other is offering new gameplay options.

CaptainWednesdayJul 24, 20143 votes

What you're saying is, it should become a completely different game.

Talith PAJul 24, 20143 votes

What you're saying is, it should become a completely different game.

The game is always changing, systems get reworked and upgraded as time goes on. It's an advantage the game has.

Beta LoL vs release LoL vs Season 2 LoL vs Season 4 LoL... you could just as easily call each and every version a completely different game.

CaptainWednesdayJul 24, 20142 votes

The removal of critical chance is understandable. I can get behind that.

But when you talk about removing mana from the game... That's not on the table. League would become a totally different game.

Talith PAJul 24, 20142 votes

Would it really? Take a look at Dominion, Twisted Treeline, or even Urf mode. The first two have global mana amps so that you are never 100% tapped for very long and URF mode completely removes costs and yet they are all very clearly League of Legends.

CaptainWednesdayJul 24, 20143 votes

There is still mana (and mana regeneration) items available though. Just because you make mana management easier in those game modes does not mean we can just flush the entire system away.

There are 17 mana items and 25 mana regeneration items (With Tear of the Goddess being in both categories), not mention champions with mana scaling, mana costs over time, buffs, etc. That's a huge chunk of the game that would need massive overhaul. A change many players would not enjoy. Also, most champions use mana. Why make the minority the majority?

Usually Seasonal changes are to improve the game and/or fix gameplay issues (Warding issues became Trinkets in S4). Removing mana from the game is neither an issue nor an improvement to the game.

I can understand your frustration with long lasting games. Mana is not the reason why the games last so long.

Talith PAJul 24, 20141 votes

As I mentioned in the original post the mana items would have to either be altered or removed. Just as there are no items that improve energy or any other resource regeneration, so to will champions that continue to use systems similar to mana lose those items in their current iteration. Those items would have to change by offering either more damage, utility, resistances, actives, or whatever gaps are left to fill.

This game is far from perfect, as it is an ever evolving product. A look at the combined changes of each season are enough proof of that. It wouldn't be the first time Riot has made large sweeping changes, and I very much doubt it would be the last.

My proposed list of changes are overhauls, yes, but thinking about the health of the game moving forward I'd say they are something they have to eventually address.

As for why I think mana is one of the biggest problems in the game:

Currently games, even completely one-sided ones, constantly push to 40 minutes or more. That is just miserable as no one wants to actually sit in a one-sided game they are losing for 40 minutes, and there are a lot of people that just can't dedicate 40 minutes to a single game on a single session to begin with; evenly matched games can push well into 90 minutes!

Games have gotten entirely too long, and one of the biggest factors I would say is how slow laning is and the direct impact mana management in lane has on slowing it down.

So one avenue to reduce that game length is removing mana as the rule, and make it the exception. That means players don't go back to base and spend gold on items just to alleviate their mana dependency in order to not tap out while laning, and it also fixes the problem where champions that can really leverage items like Athene's are at an advantage over champions that can't. Instead they spend gold more directly on items immediately related to killing champions and taking objectives instead of providing lasting power in lane.

If a champion is unbearable if he fires his abilities non-stop on cooldown forever (skittles, mystic shots, whatever) then just the problem abilities should be gated by whatever resource makes it feel right in lane.

CaptainWednesdayJul 24, 20141 votes

I'm just still not biting on removing mana entirely from the game when it's such a core factor in League. I think the problem with a long game is the lack of aggression early on. People play very safe, almost to the point of the game becoming boring. I have been witness to those games. It can be excruciatingly painful to just sit back and farm for hours. Try playing more aggressive lane bullies to see if you can get a change in your paradigm.

Talith PAJul 24, 20141 votes

OK, we say that it's not completely 100% removed, but it is no longer the default resource option for champions. Instead, just like energy, fury, etc. it is a resource option that is used to gate champions like Urgot, Karthus, Cassio, etc. that would be just plain silly in lane if they had nothing else to gate them. These champions would use mana, but not as you know it currently. Mana would serve as it currently does, as a reservoir you tap to fire spells, but it will regenerate more similarly to how it does on Dominion, with an empowered chalice effect for free. You still run the risk of running completely dry, but you still have enough regen to continue trickling spells in, and should you wait you will start building up your reserve again. This scales with level so that by the time mid-late game comes around, mana is no longer a concern during teamfights or short sieges, and by endgame it isn't a concern in medium length sieges either.

This is to feed the goal of increasing the pace of the game so it stops pushing into 40+ minute territory while also making laning much more active and interesting. Without having to buy mana and mana regeneration items you are then able to purchase items with more direct power or interesting effects as well.

CaptainWednesdayJul 25, 20141 votes

I could see that working much better, and I'm all ears for changes to the resource system. I question why a lot of champions use mana when others don't. For example, Garen does not need mana to call a giant thunderbolt sword-thingy to execute people, but Darius needs a mana to jump in the air and sever heads off? I'm not buying it.

Throwing away the entire mana system for resourceless cooldowns seems like a giant step over the real issue of long games. I like the idea of changing some champions resource systems, but we can't just throw it all away.

Also, it's made fairly clear that a League match should and usually takes upwards of 30-40 minutes (provided you don't S@20). The matchmaker makes that obvious. However, games such as Curse VS Complexity should not take that long. I think the real issue is people become very conservative in their playstyle during high-risk matches (Ranked Solo Queue, LCS Matches, etc.) and play very passively as to not make mistakes. Riot has tried to steer clear of snowball meta, so players pick champions that can survive to late game (farm, farm, farm early) and then destroy later in the game.

Talith PAJul 25, 20141 votes

I don't see why it should but it most certainly does average 30-40 minutes and up. My question is: Why does it have to?

Once again I will bring up Dominion. In Dominion you get the full experience of the champion power curve in a condensed period of time, with the games all having a soft cap on how long they can last. Champions hit 4-5 item builds at 20~ minutes (some mid tier items involved) and many games end at that point, and that is fine as 4-5 items is usually enough to explore whatever power options you needed for that game. 6 item builds with legendary items come in at 30 minutes, and games very rarely ever last longer than that.

It's only when the teams are very evenly matched and playing with few mistakes that you'll start seeing longer games, exactly what you would expect from two coordinated teams going at it. But solo queue? Why does solo queue, with all the mistakes that come from random players suddenly working together, have to drag on so long? Why is it even desirable to have games of 30-40 minutes in length when they can easily be 20-30 minutes and still providing the same set of experiences for laning, fighting over objectives, hitting endgame builds, and destroying the nexus? The difference being that with shorter games you get to do so in an amount of time you can more easily fit into a player's daily life and by their nature afford you the chance to play more games per day.

CaptainWednesdayJul 25, 20141 votes

There's a problem with comparing Summoner's Rift to Dominion. In Dominion, the game is always progressing. One team is always winning at some point in time. On SR, if no team goes for objectives, then a game can drag on.

For the most part, League is a game of communication. You have to take command and focus objectives instead of wasting time.

Talith PAJul 25, 20141 votes

The game always progressing because one team is always winning is very much true as far as why Dominion games have a soft cap on their game duration.

SR is always progressing as well; if left to their own devices minions will eventually push and destroy a Nexus, it's just that it's really trivial for champions to completely stop their advance and delay a game.

No one is questioning that League is a game of communication, and I'd say that compared to season 2 or even 3, players on the whole are banding together more quickly and naturally to take objectives... but games aren't getting any shorter despite it. Why is that? If players are better at communicating and working together to take objectives... then why aren't games any shorter than before?

CaptainWednesdayJul 25, 20141 votes

Summoner's Rift, in my honest opinion, is just a more complex game mode than Dominion. The stakes are much higher, so players play much more passively than in Dominion.

I enjoy the long pacing of the game though. It may feel like a waste of time if you lose, but winning a long, evenly matched game makes me feel even more proud than having someone surrender or the game ending quickly because of a stomp.

Talith PAJul 25, 20141 votes

The only reason the stakes are much higher is because you have the option of playing for visible ELO and seasonal prizes. Outside of ranked, both games have equal stakes as you can only end with a win or loss.

The reason people play more passively in SR as well is because thanks to how long they've played it they better understand the implications of death on SR, what a team is capable of once someone is no longer a threat on the field.

Likewise, death on Dominion (once you are good enough at the mode) is in no way less brutal for your team. One person getting picked can just as easily end the game, so you do get very careful play you aren't going to see in the lower ELO games. But people don't play much Dominion and there aren't exactly many advertised resources to learn how to play it... but that is neither here nor there.

PillowTalkPrinceJul 25, 20141 votes

Sounds like you just want to be playing Dominion.

xWildflowerJul 24, 20142 votes

The only thing I like about this is reworking criticals.

Talith PAJul 25, 20141 votes

What about the duration of games being too long? Do people really enjoy sitting down and saying "Alright, for the next 20-90 minutes, with no way of knowing ahead of time, I want to play only one match without moving from this computer."

xWildflowerJul 25, 20142 votes

What about the duration of games being too long? Do people really enjoy sitting down and saying "Alright, for the next 20-90 minutes, with no way of knowing ahead of time, I want to play only one match without moving from this computer."

I personally like the pace of laning and longer games, but it's probably just me.

Talith PAJul 25, 20141 votes

That's certainly fine, everyone has their own preferences right? There are people out there that play entire Risk or Monopoly games in one sitting after all. But those games enable players to take breaks as needed, and can be divided into 20-30 minute sessions played over the course of however long it takes to play them out.

In a league game you never know if you're getting into a fun 30 minute game, a 20 minute surrender, dragging out a 40 minute loss that was determined 10 minutes into a game, or whether you are held prisoner at your own computer for a 90 minute ranked game because no one wants to lose after being invested in it for so long but no one wants to really continue staying in the game either.