4.11 and the jungle

Earl Eulrich·Jul 1, 2014·2 votes·480 views

I didn´t really see a reason for the 4.10 adc-buffs either, but this just takes injustifyable changes to the next lvl.

** The Problem of tanky/supportive junglers right now: **

-insufficient xp/goldgain, due to goldgeneration in the jungle being very dependent on clearing fast, especially early on (faster 1st round->faster t1 jungle item->faster gold-item->more gold)

-poor midgame itemisation, as they need to defend themselves against all sources of dmg with very little ressources

-incredible weak dueling, especially early on -> very vulnerable to being counterjungled

And I don´t see how the new items can fix any of those issues:

Ancient Golem will now need time to scale with his new unique-passive, so the already weak midgame will be even weaker (while 4.10 made clear that tanks don´t have a lategame to scale into at all if the opponent adc isn´t braindead).

The tenacity had been taken away from the item - leaving the only source of tenacity (one of the major stats for a guy who wants to soak as much cc as possible for his teammates) for a tank being mercs all over again.

Ther´s still no proper possibilty for not getting bullied around in the jungle if the main bullies don´t get a proper rework(mostly to their powercurves, not so much to the skillset as a whole): Lee and Elise (and Vii to some degree).

But I admit with the new passive they might at least be able to afk farm the jungle rather fast now while they hide from the opponent team, due to not being able to fullfill their role (tanking) in a teamfight in any stage of the game if their team isn´t already snowballing like mad).

5 Comments

Penguin EclipseJul 2, 20141 votes

I have mixed feelings on the jungler changes. But I don't think it addresses the key reason I so rarely play my favorite jungler, Sejuani. She is so easily counter jungled in the early game and there really isn't much she can do about it. The new item changes may make her potentially tankier in the mid-late game, but she would already be plenty tanky if she didn't get starved for gold/exp from being bullied out of her own jungle. And in reality, I don't think it will make much of a difference because she often times is behind in gold.

NinjaFiferJul 2, 20141 votes

I like the direction they went with giving a ward to Golem/Quill, but all the vision in the world doesn't do much if you can't kick them out of your jungle. Sure, you can get a lane to come help catch them, but, if you're playing in a high enough elo game where lanes care about the jungle, the enemy lane that is now freefarming will punish your team hard for it.

I'm not saying that I have a solution. I do feel, though, that this may be a step in the right direction, but it's really not enough. There have been other really good ideas posted on the forums for possible fixes. Maybe one of these days I'll collect a compendium of good ideas for Riot to peruse.

Sneak DogJul 2, 20141 votes

You are however, a tanky jungler, meaning you have cc to lock up the enemy jungler and let your lane kill him to return the investment the laner makes (giving up minions). Another point is that if you know where the enemy jungler is with your free ward, you can go farm the opposite side of the map. Considering the enemy jungler only has a trinket ward you can pull this off with a red trinket to clear the river crossing.

NinjaFiferJul 3, 20141 votes

That's a pretty big 'maybe' on your lanes coming to help you kick the enemy out of your jungle. Also, so many of the big junglers now can wall jump, making it MUCH easier for them to escape, hence wasting your lane's time and setting them back without having to gank at all. As for seeing them and running away, you are forced to let them counter jungle you. Meanwhile, it's risky to counter jungle them, since they can clear so much faster than you, they might catch you in their jungle, meaning you die.

Angry MonsterJul 2, 20141 votes

I agree with you that it does not come close to solving the issue. How does one force out Lee when you are still pure D stats? The answer is you do not. So riot expects tank jungler to live by the grace of the solo laners... this is does not sound fun to me.

Tank jungle is still not going to viable. Riot refuses to deal with the issue that CC jungler do not have the early game stats necessary to live. Tank junglers do not have to have more damage, they can have free higher base health and defensive stats so they can get away or make the fights prolonged enough for help to actually arrive.

Right now and after the patch the second the enemy finds you you will die.