[4.7] Live Gameplay Patch Forecast

RiotJag·4/24/2014, 1:50:02 AM·22 votes·33,032 views

Hi guys, the Live Gameplay team is back with the Patch Forecast for 4.7. Here are the major issues we’re looking at. Keep in mind that since we just released patch 4.6, we’re still collecting data and analyzing how the latest changes we’ve done have affected prominent in-game issues.

1) Reworks Follow-up (continued)

Gragas may still have a few flaws holding him back from fully transitioning into his new role as a fighter/bruiser. Even after the recent changes in 4.6, we are still unsure if Gragas is in a good spot. Specifically, we want to ensure he can compete in the early game, and also ensure he has the ability to make big plays with his Barrel Roll and Explosive Cask. We’re looking for ways to continue buffing him as a disruptive team fighter, so look for more utility adds to his kit.

Kassadin recently received a few buffs, particularly when fighting against other magic damage dealers. We’re keeping a careful eye on Kassadin to make sure that he isn’t completely removing aspects of counterplay with his new damage/shield model. Rest assured if he gets picked in ranked games we’ll nerf him again (kidding).

Skarner is still being worked on carefully. We feel that stickiness is a significant part of his character fantasy, and that aspect is somewhat lacking, so we’re continuing to explore solutions!

2) Top Lane and the “Renekton Bar” (continued)

As Statikk stated in his last forecast (http://community.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/live-gameplay/BdiOr6zf-46-patch-forecast), we’re continuing to look at champions that we think have interesting top lane gameplay and giving them stronger tools to survive in that environment. We feel like we’re seeing a little more diversity lately (Jax and Ryze have seen a resurgence lately), so we'll be slowing our approach, but look for Jarvan the 4th and Malphite to get a few minor adjustments to better equip them at fighting in the top lane.

3) Jungle

We continue to see Junglers taking over games. In particular, damage focused junglers frequently outlevel, outfarm, and outdamage their laning teammates without the level of risk that their counterparts are forced to endure. We are looking into to altering the total gold/experience output that the jungle can provide. Additionally, we mentioned that Spirit Stone might be weighted a little too heavily in favor of DPS-focused junglers (especially health vamp), so we're taking that into consideration with our changes.

4) Kha’zix

True to his lore, when we change Kha’zix, he evolves and finds a different gameplay pattern to continue to be effective. The live version of Kha’zix does not have the same need to be opportunistic as the other assassins in League of Legends, and opponents tend to feel like there are very few windows available to fight him. We are looking into some changes that make him a little more vulnerable to fighting back against him, particularly when he is under the effects of his ultimate.

5) Watch list

Feral Flare - The vision we had for Feral Flare does not currently reflect the reality of the item on live. While we were hoping this item would add diversity in terms of class selection in the jungle, its effect has been the opposite, as this item is almost dictating jungler picks (as in who can or cannot use Feral Flare effectively) at an extremely high rate.

League of Legends team dynamics in general lead to this item having distinctly anti-teamwork and anti-play patterns, as junglers will feel compelled to ignore their lanes for 10-15 minutes so they can farm up their stacks, while their laners will pay the price for his less team-oriented choices. While we created Feral Flare to be a more 'selfish' jungle item, its current optimal use is to be completely noninteractive on the map. The future of this item may reduce some of the combat stats it gives or reduce the value of the Maim proc at all evolutions. In exchange, we're hoping to buff teamfight-oriented stacks that contribute to the progress of Feral Flare.

Soraka – Solo lane Soraka has started to exhibit a lot of the frustrating laning patterns that Solo lane Lulu did before her recent changes (although the patterns differ mechanically). In other words, Soraka has a virtually unending supply of easy wave clear and ranged harass, while having very few windows for opponents to fight back without significant jungle help. Champions need to have clearly defined weaknesses as solo laners, or they end up bullying out a large portion of choices in that lane, and we want to do some analysis into if those currently exist for Soraka's solo lane play.

As a side note, we do think that her current rise to dominance may be due to some of the larger systems changes we've made to the game lately such as the changes to the Summoner Spell Heal. We'll have to take these into considerations as we move forward as well.

Leblanc – Similar to previous cases like Zed and Kassadin, skilled Leblanc players have the ability to snowball games while not providing a lot of counterplay for her opponents. She has very high mobility, high burst damage, consistent wave clear, and a large array of crowd control to deal with. We’re exploring finding a vision for a Leblanc that has more healthy gameplay.

On that note, we’re aware that her win rate is on the lower side compared to many problematic champions, but win rate is a data point that must be weighed in with other considerations. In this case, the pattern in which Leblanc engages champions is frustrating and significantly lacking options for the enemy player; when she is ahead in the game this is particularly debilitating for the side lanes she will roam to.

6) On the horizon

We are keeping our eyes on various champions that may become a problem, but many of them are tied into system level issues. Two of the major ones are ADC Itemization and Competitive lane swaps, and the systems team will also be doing a patch forecast soon for their take on these topics.

313 Comments

AnxiusFelis4/24/2014, 2:16:12 AM34 votes

Increasing the stacks needed to get flare really didn't do it any justice, as junglers will now ignore lanes for another 5 stacks. So that was kinda counterproductive to what your statement above dictates.

Ratastok4/24/2014, 3:45:49 AM22 votes

Any plans to nerf Nidalee and her Anti-fun-toxic-nocounterplay spears-heal-scape-free LW/VS with waveclear?

Remlap12234/24/2014, 4:39:58 AM18 votes

Your forgetting about Nidalee. Her overpowered Q and bloated kit offer very little counterplay late game. The fact that her Q can insta kill an adc is ridiculous, especially on that low of a cooldown. Last game I played she damn near one shotted Alistar, for heaven's sake. She needs a Kassadin esque rework, because she is probably the most unbalanced champion right now.

Ban Lebroken4/24/2014, 6:57:47 AM9 votes

Riot.. can we PLEASE change Nidalee already? she arguably has the most toxic kit in the game. She's the defenition of "low risk high reward"Nidalee

C9 Vamp134/24/2014, 5:04:39 AM9 votes

you guys forgot to fix nidalee :(

DennyBraids4/24/2014, 7:36:40 AM7 votes

The problem with feral flare jungle is, I think, simple one. When you get 25 stack (30 now) it improves into item that then stacks not only with monster kills but also with kills and assist. I think it is understandable that FF junglers therefore want to get FF asap, because any successful gank pre FF still feels like wasted time and only delays your power spike...

The nerf of the item in last patch, only shows that nobody in riot gave it enough thought. It was viable on about 20 junglers that have not been seen in jungle this season yet, and yes, made like 5 of them overpowered. But everyone of them was still trying to answer the question: "Is this item viable if I dont afk farm for first 15 minutes?", and with the change riot gave us absolute answer: "Hell NO!".

My proposed change would be this, if anyone is interested. Let the stacking start with the purchase of Madreds razor, but let he madreds razer already show you the stack count and most importantly give you a stack also for kill or assist. Then you can tweak the numbers what amount of stacks is right for FF transformation, but one fact would remain: You can now farm first five camps, go back, heal, buy madreds and start ganking. There are a lot of junglers: Nautilus, Sejuani, Xin Zhao, Lee Sin, Jax to mention just a few, that would perfectly fit this playstyle. And item would be perfect for them, as it gives them better clear speed during whole game, and keeps them viable to late game.

There would still be junglers who prefer to afk farm, but that I think is balanced trade off, as you are risking that all of your lanes would lose, which is usually situation that not even most farmed carry can save.

Another issue for the item is, how much baron/dragon control it gives over spirit stone item. I think dmg to baron and dragon could be the same as to champions - 33%. Those two monsters should be team fight objectives. Doing solo baron at 21st minute might feel good, but totally doesnt feel right...

wapster4/24/2014, 3:17:17 AM5 votes

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The Bardic Gay4/24/2014, 5:21:35 AM5 votes

No Nidalee changes? A pity. Her playstyle promotes a poor game environment where a singular skills dictate a game. I could understand if said skill was an ultimate, and it had an associated risk (or at least was a long CD utility-only a la crystalize or wind wall) but it's a low-ish CD long range skillshot, which bugs me. The less risk Nidalee applies to the skill, the more reward it gives, which just seems so backwards. I could understand riot's hesitance to nerf the spear since it's nid's big ticket, but for a champion who supposedly sacrifices having an ult so she can have 3 additional skills, it's kinda lame that one of her skills can effect the game just as much if not more than some ultimates.

Gixia4/24/2014, 2:24:48 AM4 votes

In regards to Feral Flare, I feel that one of the reasons why it promotes selfish farming to a possibly unhealthy degree is the fact that kills and assists only contribute stacks to the item AFTER it has transformed into Feral Flare. I imagine that changing it so that kills and assists also add stacks to Wriggle's would encourage more teamplay by making it less punishing to gank a sideline, as a successful gank would no longer hinder your ability to transform the item as needed and assist your team at the same time, while maintaining at least some level of risk as a failed gank will still set you back on your farm and slow down the item completion. Of course, doing so would ultimately make it easier to make the transition from Wriggle's to FF and would likely require some stat nerfs in order to offset this, but at the very least it would steer the item towards more interactive/healthy play patterns, would it not?

Jack Rendar4/24/2014, 3:43:00 AM4 votes

Any news regarding Gangplank ?

Tycosnh4/24/2014, 2:37:10 AM4 votes

I really hope you guys don't make support junglers the new thing. No one liked them, including me. I will personally stop playing the game if I'm forced to play Nautilus or Maokai again.

I understand that the jungle might be a bit dumb with feral flare, but please don't nerf the shit out of the jungle.

Timjin4/24/2014, 3:09:07 AM3 votes

@RiotPwyff It's good to hear that you are looking at making Skarner more "Sticky".

If I am reading this right, does that mean that we may be seeing buffs in 4.7?

Or are you saying that it may still be a while before we see anything on the PBE because you are still experimenting with concepts.

Please clarify for us, so that we don't get our hopes up too early, and have a repeat of some people feeling ignored.

I'm super pumped at the thought of being able to play him as a peeler again.

PaintedFox4/24/2014, 2:28:46 AM3 votes

Man, Riot just can't seem to make up their minds on jungling :/ it seems they're either "supposed to have gold and be able to carry" or "supposed to assist lanes and not be selfish".

Carrying=selfish play. Not trying to bash Riot's design team or process, but I dunno how both of those ideals can be fulfilled at the same time. Like Tabzz said recently, carrying can't be in the hands of all 5 players; in that case, it's not carrying anyway.

I love that you're trying to make every position seem impactful, but this isn't working very well in my opinion. Which isn't really your fault Pwyff or Morello or anyone, it's just something you'll have to spend some more time on.

4dmiral4/24/2014, 2:20:53 AM2 votes

Feeling good about Rengar, then? Not sure I am yet, but just wondered why he isn't discussed on the forecast.

Hugify Your Tlts4/24/2014, 2:27:03 AM1 votes

I'm very happy to see that LeBlanc is getting looked at. Honestly, I'm okay with her having the strong burst she has, but not with that strong waveclear too. I'd be happy with these three changes:

  1. Make W no longer damage minions. This maintains her strong burst but gives her the weakness of poor waveclear
  2. Make LeBlanc have to wait at least 1s when using W before she can jump back to her original location. The QW combo in lane has no counterplay besides staying out of her range. If she has to stick around at that location, she at least has a window of vulnerability.
  3. Remove the slow on E. Whenever I play against LeBlanc, it feels absolutely impossible to get away when she lands that E, which is very easy for her to land because she can waveclear with W and silence with Q, leaving little counterplay.
Thales4/24/2014, 2:00:30 AM1 votes

Will the changes to LeBlanc try to remedy that extremely low win-rate overall? Or is making her power more accessible itself problematic, even if that power is reduced?