Tristana Rework Idea

iPooUnicorns·10/8/2018, 12:42:19 AM·6 votes·25,247 views

Tristana's gameplay and identity don't match. She wants to get into the thick of the fight, but in practice, she uses her "getting into the thick of the fight" tools for safety instead.

I don't enjoy playing against her kit regardless of how strong she is in the current meta, she has a very low amount of skill expression and is either the most impactful champion in the match, or the least.


Currently her kit combines aspects that individually aren't very toxic on their own, but paired together make her kit incredibly toxic. These aspects are:

  • High range, albeit, scaling with levels.
  • Stat check damage / low amount of skill expression.
  • Mobility with resets.
  • Self peel.

Ability breakdown and their inherit problems:

  • Passive, gain attack range scaling with levels. This gives her the highest permanent attack range in the game at later levels, and it goes against her identity of getting into the thick of the fight.
  • Q is just outright bad design: push button, attack faster. It's definition stat check.
  • W is entirely too powerful for an ADC, it's essentially Kha'Zix's evolved E with an additional way to reset its cooldown.
  • E is the only ability that I have no real issues with.
  • R on its own is fine, but with her W already offering her a way to get out of a bad spot, it makes her too safe.

To put it simply, her kit is stat check damage with resetting mobility and a self peel ultimate. So long as her kit exists in this state, she will either be a top tier pick or bottom tier pick.


Rework idea:

  • Passive, largely the same with a new effect: Based on how close Tristana is to enemy champions, her auto attacks deal 120-80% damage. Damage scales as following: 200 units or less: 120% 200 - 300 units: 110% 400 - 500 units: 100% 500 - 550 units: 90% 550 units and above: 80%
  • Q, reworked entirely: Tristana channels and charges her cannon for up to 1.5 seconds, must charge for at least .5 seconds. At the end of the charge can then shoot a powerful projectile in a straight line, damaging the first unit hit, with a 1 second window to cast at the end of the charge, and can end the charge early to immediately cast it. If she charges her cannon for at least 1 second and the projectile hits a target currently affected by her E, it adds 1 stack.

Skill shot is narrow, shares the same range as her auto attack range Physical Damage: 100/125/150/175/200 + 1.0 Total AD * seconds spent charging The damage will likely need some tuning, as it needs to deal enough damage to be worth using instead of auto attacking, but not do too much damage to prevent her from becoming an assassin.

  • W, rework: Tristana channels for up to 1 second, she then leaps to a target area, the distance she can leap to increases with charge time. In addition, her W does not cancel her Q channel, and she can begin the Q channel during her W channel. No longer fully resets, reduces cooldown by 50% instead.
  • E & R remain unchanged.

The goal of these changes are to make her gameplay match her identity better, reduce the stat check nature of her kit, and reduce her inherit safety.

With the changes to her passive, she would keep her ability to play safe, but at the cost of dealing reduced damage. However she would be rewarded for getting into the thick of the fight by gaining increased damage.

The combination of her Q & W changes address multiple problems and synergize well together. With her Q no longer empowering her attack speed, and requiring her to successfully land the new ability to deal maximum damage, reduces the degree of stat check to her kit. Her Q paired with her W gives her a lot of room for skill expression and her W no longer gives her such a powerful safety net.

Thoughts & criticism welcome, and if you have a different direction for a rework, please feel free to share.

13 Comments

Glaricion10/9/2018, 5:12:49 PM6 votes

Not every champion should be reworked to have high 'skill expression'. There is a portion of the playerbase with issues such as low reaction times and being barred from using hotkeys. Having champions that focus more on the overall macro for the game rather than on micro helps to create champion variety and allows for a wider audience. Also "prevent her from becoming an assassin", rip AP Trist.

Early Trist is strong since her E and W allows for great amounts of damage to be put on the target and can be rather versatile. Mid-game Trist is rather weak as her Q and passive still are pretty much non-factors. Late-game Trist becomes a hypercarry as she's firing on all cylinders.

Gaining a linear skillshot presents several issues with Trist. She can now safely deal with stealthed champions and jukes into the brush. She can (possibly) avoid pushing the lane. Her mid-game issues are alleviated.

Love the passive idea though. The rest, they might create issues with her power curve, make her feel clunky, etc...

Vexilus10/9/2018, 9:58:05 AM4 votes

The passive and Q sound fine. But having her charge her W is really bad. The only champion with a charging dash are VI and Zac who both have knock ups applied and are melee champions who are more durable than tristana.

Reducing the range would be fine, but not charging the jump

Carnicore10/10/2018, 7:58:43 PM4 votes

I think you're on to something, but I don't agree with the details.

  1. I would change the passive numbers to be a linear gradient, reaching its maximum damage at 300 range and minimum at 500. I think it's a neat idea to add some depth and decisionmaking to her kiting, although dealing 20% less damage is probably too harsh for simply kiting at maximum range.

  2. I'm not a fan of giving Tristana a skillshot when there's no pressing need to do so. You could definitely spice up the spell (it only grants attack speed), but it should at least stay a steroid.

  3. I wouldn't change W. Making it a channeled ability is a devastating nerf.

AuroraBorealis110/11/2018, 11:19:06 AM3 votes

So this is coming from a Tristana Main, who started playing in S6, so all of my experience is with the post-Marksman rework Tristana.

I don't think Tristana's identity is that of someone who wants to get into the fight - she's a siege machine who like's having long range and being able to stay untouchable by being at range from her opponents. I will admit that the power fantasy that comes with an E-W combo onto target in lane may be a little bit broken for someone who is supposed to have a weak early game but she still looses to most early lane bullies(Caitlyn, Lucian, Draven, etc), E-Wing onto these targets without a strong support or jungler backing you up will almost guarantee your death. I would rather give up the W resets or even the W entirely(although at that point I think she would be a little weak) then loose her passive.

Galiö10/9/2018, 12:29:39 AM2 votes

This seems to take her more into the direction of a caster rather than an AA champ which in theory can be ok.

But removing the AS Steroid in her kit would make her more of a Varus (in poke meta) without the lockdown he has.

However when I imagine tristana, I imagine her as a wave clear siege machine.

At that point I image she builds stacks slower on her e with the new Q: however maybe the stacks can become more meaningful?

It may also feel awkward to place an E and then charge a Q and then hit a skillshot to get a stack... which can be just as easy on a wave but harder to land on a player.

So overall is Trist still a wave clear God? Is the trade off of being a, probably, weaker dueler worth it? Since she would be a weaker dueler wouldnt her overall nerfed W make it harder for her to have a place in any meta?

Very rarely have we been in a marksmen meta that isnt built around Fast AA Bork (or more recently rageblade) champs or Crit champs and I dont see how this caster Trist wouldnt be harder to fit into a meta than she already is.

But I'm open to see how this would play out or be expanded on.

P.s I kinda like how the passive kinda fits more into her 'courageous theme'.

ModKnightsKemplar10/8/2018, 11:49:49 PM1 votes

Approved!

Gilgayu11/2/2018, 7:10:15 PM1 votes

This will likely make her more much more aggressive and go for more all-in fights, but since it's like all or nothing, she will be focused and hunt down (which is much easier now with less self-peel and long-range jump)

OtterlyLost10/12/2018, 5:54:54 PM1 votes

I like the passive idea but I abhor the changes to her W and Q. There would be no point to her W even being there as it's intended for getting in and out of fights; giving it a channel completely ruins the point of the ability. It can do damage but normally you wont be using it as such outside of lane. And her Q is part of what makes her a great siege champion on top of it synergizes with her E(which you didnt change) and it makes up for her lower AS per level growth and her lower base AS.

If you cant use her W for escaping because you're forced to channel for a full second, it's honestly a terrible ability. This is ignoring the fact that CC also stops it as is; if she gets CCd mid air, she does stop moving. Its the wind up animation that is the counter to CC and is where a lot of her skill expression as a champion lies.

Her Q is just awful though. As an ability, it has very clearly defined weakness; it's a decently long CD that she is forced to max second so she can have the damage of her bombs in lane. The counter play is literally let her activate it and then go in because she doesn't have that CD and her base AS is far lower than other ADCs.

I also disagree she is a low skill expression champion as wasting your CDs can be a huge detriment. They're long and wasting them means you're a sitting duck because your build doesn't allow for CDR. Namely her jump, which is maxed last, is a 22 second CD. It isnt like Ezreal who, at least used to, max his second and would get excess CDR based on landing his abilities or Lucian who maxes his second as well and also gets reduced CD by using his abilities and passive well; both of these champions also build decent amounts of CDR, making their mobility skill be up more often than hers ever will.

Her E is an AA reset and she has all the pitfalls of other ADCs; squishy and prone to CC. Her early laning phase makes her easy to bully and mid game she needs to have a good knowledge of positioning because her damage is negligible. She has plenty of things for her to provide skill expression.

Bârd10/15/2018, 3:25:41 AM1 votes

I think a better passive would be something like: If Tristana is moving towards her target, basic attacks will not interrupt her movement.

Something that helps her press the attack, rather than something that rewards her for sitting on top of the enemy team.

ShadowtehGreat10/21/2018, 12:32:12 AM1 votes

Actually I think the charge on the Q is very interesting, maybe giving it some time to charge (1 second) would allow Tristana to hit even harder (more damage) throughout the duration of her Q while having more impact on fights initially but giving the enemy an indicator and time to react and play around it. This wouldn't add to much more skill expression to the kit than necessary and might make for an great feel good change as she is supposed to be a character with massive cannon that might need to charge up a bit for a lot of impact in fights.

Gilgayu11/2/2018, 7:04:45 PM1 votes

(Too bad no one is discussing this one any more :( )

The current w shouldnt have a charge time, for it becomes easily interrupted and makes it weird to use

The new q you suggested is interesting, but since after all trist is an adc, I suggest :

  1. increase the range, it is pointless if it has the same range of trist's auto and has basicly the same dmg(the time it takes to cast the ability can allow trist to fit in 2+ autos late game)
  2. if it lands, give trist a attack speed boost, not as op as it is now, but still useful enough for trist to attempt land its q
  3. If it lands on a object with her e, then maybe double the exploding range of e, therefore still punishing the enemy backline even if their peel blocked q for them

As for passive, I think close range (200 and less) should be more rewarding at the same time risky, So maybe trist can deal 80% bonus damage from any source (abilities, on-hit effects, autos), but take 60% increased damage


Personally, I always imagined trist as being an extremly aggressive yordle, but her abilities and range just make her way too safe

Therefore her ult should be changed too

R: (cd 200sec)

Tristana's cannon overheats, causing Tristana to take damage equal to 30/40/50% of her own hp as physical damage over the next 7/10/15 seconds. Tristana's passive will be disabled for 7/10/15 seconds Tristana also gain a new skill set for 5/8/15 seconds

Tristana loses 100 range on her auto attacks She gains 60% attack speed (not restricted by the attack speed ceiling 2.5), and her autos deals bonus damage equal to 6/8/10% of enemy hp, ignoring 30% armor.

q (cd 7sec) Her q changes her burning cannon and gives her 150 extra range for autoes, allowing her autoes to pierce through the enemy until it reaches the maximum range(kinda like how twitch's ult works), slowing all enemy hit by 3/5/7% and deals bonus magic damage equal to 30/50/90% of her bonus ad her attack speed is also halved. its duration is 6 secs

w (no cd since after used ult goes on cd) Her w ends the ult duration as well as the self damage(the 30/40/50% of her own hp thing) by throwing her burning cannon with a range of 150, stunning the first enemy hit(can be minions) and slows the enemies in the area by 5%(roughly the size of anivia's ult before it starts charging) and dealing damage equal to her ad every second. The "pool" disappers after 7 seconds, then tristana can use her abilities and auto again (during the duration she can only ran or use summoner spells... yea)

e (cd 5/8/15 secs) Her e grants her 10/20/30% damage reduction while its not on cd(but only when her ult is active), when active, she slows enemy in a radius of 220, centered on herself, by 70/50/30%(20% if the enemy has more than 120/150/180 armor). Her autos apply the normal e(the expolsive one) to everyone she autos, but can't be applied to the same enemy in 5/7/9 seconds. The bomb deals only half the damage e would do, but its explosion radius will be increased to 150.

r does nothing lol.


after her r ends (if wasn't already ended by her w), she will be slowed by 99% for 2 sec, and she won't be able to auto or use any abilities for 3 sec.