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Giving a second part to Trundles passive

Villepoika·10/17/2018, 2:30:35 PM·2 votes·25,013 views

DISCLAIMER: I have no background as an game designer or understanding League of Legends in a deepest levels, I base my opinions in my own experiences, different analyses and professional players thoughts.

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THE IDEA

In short, Trundle would deal extra damage with his auto attack based on enemies max health, either as AD or AP. The values I use in these examples are similar with his current passives heal, in-between 2% and 6%. I have two ideas how the new passive should work, with some reasoning to back them up:

  • 1st Idea: Stacking Passive

Similar how Press the Attack or Irelias passive work, Trundle would have a max stack system which resolves him dealing the extra damage by every auto attack while having the passive full stacked. His playstyle is already based on running on top of the enemy, disrupting the escape with the pillar and AAing them to death, and this would be in synergy with that game plan.

The damage would of course be on the lower side (2%-4%) and it would be manageable in early game, since in early levels it would deal 10 extra damage to enemy Champion with 500 health pool. This would be useful in early game/pre-level 6 against tanky Champions who builds Cinderhulk, Black Cleaver or Relic Shield build path while still being manageable against champions with less defensive stats (f. ex. ADCs and Mages).

  • 2nd Idea: Restrained Passive

His auto attack would work like Grasp of the Undying or Conqueror, having an single extra damage AA on cooldown. This would make his have a better burst damage and possibly scare enemies off in duels. It will help Trundle in toplane matchups where trades are pretty short (Renekton and Fiora), and the enemy needs to be clever is it possible to get Trundle low enough if he has passive and Grasp ready.

I believe having 4%-6% max health damage to be decent in this passive. It would help him to shred tanks (dealing 180 damage minimum to 3000 HP Champion with one auto attack) and being a bit more dangerous to squishy Champions. If the damage would work against jungle monsters it would be wise to scale the damage a bit down, dealing 500 min. damage to Baron without any offensive items would be toxic...

JUSTIFICATIONS AND ARGUMENTS

Why new part to his passive? By giving him some new mechanic to auto attacks he would be stronger at dueling outside of his W, and his tank-killer role isn't going to depend on his ultimate only.

If he needs new dueling power would it be better to just revert the Q nerf? I guess, but I understand that Riot can't just unvalidate the nerfs they gave and waste their resources to bring the old Q/E values back, so the new passive idea would help everyone: Trundle might get better at fighting without the million dollar bite.

Doesn't it make Trundle a bit too OP that he makes mini-Subjugates with his AA? In the worst scenario, yes. But this passive would be familiar among other Fighters: Aatrox has already similar passive with mini-ignite, Warwick deals extra AP and heals/ boosts AS when low health, Xin deals extra attack damage by every 3rd AA with a heal etc. I'd argue that since he has only 2 damage-dealing skills, Q and R, he would benefit from these changes without becoming too overwhelming.

He already is decent tank-killer. Let's not give him more power to ruin tank players games! I am aware that this would be really obnoxious to deal as a tank, especially when comboing the new passive with his ultimate: sipping enemy Champions health while slamming max HP damage might be too strong, I agree. That might actually become a massive problem and Riot would need to change how they work together, either by decreasing the passive damage while ulting or just nerf the ultimate, which I don't favor at all. We really would need to see this in action, but this is really good point to keep in mind.

CLOSING THOUGHTS

I am aware that this post might come as implying that Trundle is weak. My main goal here is not to "buff Trundle" for the sake of making him stronger, but giving him some new mechanic that would benefit his skirmishing and make him more interesting to play. I'll try to be as neutral with this post as possible, even when being Troll King fanboy most of my time playing this game.

That's why I want to hear your thoughts! How do you feel about this change and would it actually benefit Trundle? Your own thoughts for other kinds of changes? Do you feel that this is unnecessary? Let the know!

9 Comments

Seenan10/25/2018, 9:52:01 PM2 votes

I don't think Trundle realistically needs a buff to his damage. Considering the nature of his passive and ult, people like to build bruiser damage (adds damage and defenses) and HP/some other tank stats with him anyway...

The amount of times I've won lane but lost game due to Trundle's kit eating my defenses and throwing his disruptive pillar everywhere is ridiculous. Not to mention, he runs fast enough without the pillar slowing you.

ModKnightsKemplar10/21/2018, 12:38:37 AM1 votes

Approved!

Popperofski10/21/2018, 10:24:03 AM1 votes

He's honestly better off being underdogged. I play enough top against people who don't have to win lane to win games and trundle personifies that. His passive allows him a lot of sustain that doesn't cost or require anything and encourages him to be both a splitpusher and a disruptor, from range by the way.

I've played trundle to mostly good success and find myself winning trades with the likes of meta bruisers easily. Historically tough matchups are still the same, and in jungle he can still find success.

The only change I would like to anything about him is adding auto range to his Q on activation. Maybe increase the healing on passive but don't try to make it anything besides that.

AttackOnTeemos10/28/2018, 6:56:58 PM1 votes

He reduces the ad damage of someone and also increasing his, I personally think he is at a sweet spot. I like him simply because he has not only multiple build paths, but he literally is your anti-tank...(tank)

Gilgayu11/18/2018, 3:25:57 PM1 votes

In terms of adding a new passive, I have a different idea.

~~ His auto can steal the enemy's movement speed and armor/mr by 1/3/5/9%, stacking up to 3 times, at level 1/4/9/18 This will enables his mobility and allow him to chase his oppnents, rather than being kited to death.

The armor/mr shred, however, will lead to a need for change of his ult, so... ~~ His ult will double/double/triple his passive's affectiveness, granting him 100/140/190 movement speed, but at the same time shred his own armor/mr (not including the bonus from his passive) by 50/45/35%, and instead grant him 20/27/35% damage reduction. His ult will last 4 seconds, its duration will be increased by 1/2/3 seconds upon takedowns.

The numbers are likely to be broken, but i think these changes goes with his theme as a troll king (lol) in Frejlord.

SanKakU11/20/2018, 7:04:37 PM1 votes

In this modern era of League of Legends, his passive seems a wee bit lacking and so I agree that he could use a second part to his passive. Should it be that? Maybe. Some damage certainly makes sense, whatever it would be.

Kerrigan 4 Prez11/21/2018, 4:10:37 AM1 votes

My problem with your idea is that it doesn't incentivize anything, just makes him better at what he already does. He gets up in your face, steals your stats, and beats you up, it's simple but brilliant in that way. Giving him more damage when he gets in your face is like giving money to rich beggars, they already have enough, why give them more. Perhaps make it reward him for staying in combat beyond the first few hits, maybe the stacks give him more passive healing when the champion dies and they decay rapidly. This gives him a greater ability to tank damage, at the cost that he has to risk himself more to capitalize on it.

Lovelle II10/18/2018, 7:05:13 PM1 votes

I agree Trundle needs some kind of help damage-wise, because outside of his ultimate he doesn't kill tanks faster than anyone anymore. He's always been on the lower end of the totem pole when it comes to damage dealt in games, so I don't understand why they hit his damage and utility, when his utility and map control are the only reasons he's picked. Real tanks deal more damage to other tanks than Trundle now, which makes absolutely no sense, as his damage to squishies has always been the worst of any other melee champion in the game (because that's the price he paid for having a tank buster ult).

I would suggest changing his Q to deal %max HP damage instead of messing with his passive. This would allow his damage to remain relevant to tanks/bruisers when his ult is down and would make it so he no longer needs botrk or last whisper to kill tanks himself late game. He's supposed to counter tanky targets, but right now nearly anyone with %hp damage or penetration does it far faster and easier. After the base damage nerf to his Q, he no longer wins any duels against other bruisers until everyone is around full build, which is not okay since his late game damage is already incredibly low.

Alternatively, they could revert the CDR nerfs to his ultimate and his Q, but Riot rarely reverts changes they make to champions, much less ones as unpopular as Trundle.

TLF brubie12/5/2018, 2:57:34 PM1 votes

The problem with trundle isn't that he's weak as a champions, it's that the meta is bad for him. He is just inherently much much stronger when there are other tanks in the game. If he gets buffed to much then people start playing tanks, he will become super overpowered.