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An Idea to rework crit to be healthy

Xavanic·10/12/2018, 7:50:20 PM·2 votes·28,078 views

So, over the years, many things have been changed, while some baseline stats remain the same, crit remains....the most problematic one, an early level 1 critical strike can ruin anyone's day, but here's my idea... Critical strike >>>> Impact Impact increases the base damage of your auto attacks while additionally ignoring a portion of the targets armor, IE let's say now gives 10% impact, this means your auto attacks (and enhanced auto attacks) now do 10% more damage then normal and ignore 5% of their armor...additionally, impact would cap at 50%, but this would be possible to exceed with the use of certain items (also certain champs could exceed it aswell) but the armor ignorance would cap at 25% examples are as follows: can give 25% impact, which exceeds the impact cap, increasing dmg by another 25%, or tryndamere could achieve an extra 35% impact with his passive, allowing a total 110% impact, now these are just examples but it would be far easier to balance then crit current is, as the ability to just randomly get 200% dmg on an AA isn't exactly what I call healthy gameplay Give me your thoughts on this change

48 Comments

TomiMan710/13/2018, 5:12:04 PM6 votes

You basically described the current system, but this would ramp up eeeeeeven slower than the current one. The armor ignorance is the current true dmg part. Horrible idea. This would kill adc even more.

Galiö10/13/2018, 1:51:58 AM4 votes

Honestly I though crits should work in a level system other than more armor pen in the game.

Like items can give you +1 critical up to a max of idk... 8.

Lvl 1 crit: every 5th attack deals 180% damage Lvl 2 crit: every 5th attack deals 200% damage Lvl 3 crit: every 4th attac deals 200% damage Level 4 crit: every 4th attack deals 210% damage. Level 5: every 3rd attack deals 210% damage Level 6: every 3rd attack deals 215% damage Level 7: every 3rd attack deals 220% damage Level 8: every 2nd attack deals 220% damage.

Then your infinity edge it can double your crit and each crit item gives 1 or 2 crit.

Yasuo gets double crit like normal with reduced damage

Tryndamere can get a free 1 through 4 crit based on rage.

Everything will function slightly similar but without RNG.

Numbers can all be adjusted just an example.

Edit: oh and you can limit crit abuse with unique passives and half benefits similar to mages CDR items off of lost chapter.

Like zeal gives a crit but the enhanced crit items have a unique passive for crit. Semi forcing infinitly edge more.

ModKnightsKemplar10/16/2018, 3:21:46 PM3 votes

I'll be honest, I hate the idea of giving autos scaling damage. To me, TomiMan7 has it exactly wrong. Scaling autos still give marksmen too much power to kill squishy targets, something that assassins and burst mages are supposed to do better than marksmen.

Tying crit to % armor pen is something that has been independently suggested often, and that's something I think Riot should seriously consider. Marksmen exist to tank bust. So to me, it's an obvious choice to make their main stat helpful in that regard.

DerMangoJoghurt10/13/2018, 12:05:02 PM2 votes

I have a few problems with this. First of all, it removes the entire thematic of critical strikes. They are meant to be single high impact attacks in exchange for weaker regular damage. When you build for critical strikes you want those "Look at that crit!" moment in fights. Impact would completely remove any variation in damage output during a fight. (I don't like 100% crit chance for similar reasons)

Second, it provides armor penetration. This will make it naturally more effective against tanks and less effective against squishies, shifting the gameplay focus of critical strikes. It wouldn't be worth it to build impact early, since nobody had time to amass large quantities of armor yet. A possible scenario would be that no marksmen would build impact early, but nearly everyone would build it late. How much impact you'd build would mostly be decided by the amount of armor the enemy team is building, making itemisation for lower elo players difficult.

Similarly, building against impact is not gold efficient. In the extreme case, building Lord Dominiks together with Impact items would let you ignore up to 72.5% of an opponents armor, while still giving you a 175% damage amplifier. Even after some number tuning, impact items would essentially become variations of Lord Dominiks, which isn't a bad thing (I'd like some more armor pen itemization options), but not fit to replace crit as build path.

I think the most accurate replacement of critical strike chance would be a static damage amplifier, without the armor penetration. Another popular option is a guaranteed crit every x-th auto attack. However, the first option would remove the thematic appeal of crits, while the second one would overly complicate trading windows by giving everyone Jhin passives.

Shahamut11/11/2018, 1:53:51 AM2 votes

Personally, I like the idea of removing crit from items, and just making it a part of Kits desigined for crit.

Tryndamere could have a critical strike passive that allows him to crit as long as he has at least SOME rage. He would crit every 5/4/3 auto attacks based on how much rage he had.

The damage could be scaled appropriately, and it would never feel like a crap shoot because you could always count his autos to try and avoid the crit. You could also then divide his rage bar into 3 sections so you know how many attacks its going to be: 5, 4, or 3.

Yasuo could have his critical strike moved to his Q ranks, Criting on every 5/4/3/2/1 hit, since 100% crit is kind of his thing. It means you KNOW when he will have 100% crit (level 9) and he can be balanced accordingly.

Ashe/Fiora already have their own crit mechanics, as well as Cait (headshot). They would only need minor tweaks. Ashe would need a small rethinking, but its doable.

Having items that then modify critical strikes allows for a niche set of items you could create that would only get used by champions with a critical strike component.

There are so many options for how to fix critical strike, but the biggest thing needs to be getting rid of the RNG, especially for early game. It sucks getting owned by Tryndamere one match, and then losing AS Tryndamere in the same matchup the next game because RNG just decided it hated you that day XD

5050BS10/16/2018, 9:08:49 PM1 votes

Iv always felt that Crit and LifeSteal needs a soft cap.

Spellvamp has a cap at 33% but LifeSteal can go all the way to 100% does not make since.

I would make LifeSteal cap at +30% from items and 20% from champs innate abilities for a cap of 50% This would not affect healing from abilities tho just auto attack LifeSteal.

Also Lifesteal should be based off of non-crit damage.

Crit I would put a soft cap of 60% and a hard cap of 75% (Yasuo would hit this but would not break over it)

This would make people do different builds. It would also fix the issue of some champs healing for 20-40% of their health bar in one auto attack.

aezens10/17/2018, 1:54:51 AM1 votes

That´s essentially the same thing someone posted here before (crit multiplier instead of crit chance) with the addition of the current item 3031 true damage mechanic on all adc items.

The general concept isn´t bad but the main problem remains. Bruser, assassins, juggernauts, etc would abuse a % damage increase. I think changes on ad utilisation for autoattacks needs to be done first. Essentially they should be treated like a 5th ability with separate scalings (ad and ap).

This way a pure multiplicator can´t be abused and is most useful for champions that are supposed to buy these items.

Some imaginary examples for clarification how this could work:

Caitlyn/Ashe 110% ad Kog`Maw/Kai´Sa 75% ad 20% ap Tryndamare/Yasuo 105% ad Darius/Garen 85% ad Zed/Talon 75% ad Ekko/Diana 70% ad 15% ap Ahri/Anni 10% ap

Jetboost10/18/2018, 11:14:39 AM1 votes

I will put forth another option. When having more than 0% crit give the champion 10 small(er)blocks (like those of jhin) above the health bar showing which AA will crit.

The issue in my oppinion is that the crit proc is not predictable and can't be relied upon. By making it vissible ahead of time people can therefore play around it.

At 100% crit chance you could put a symbol somewhere around the HP bar indicating he has reached 100% crit.

JeaneGreene10/28/2018, 9:28:38 PM1 votes

The whole point of Crit is to have that “Woah!!! Super lucky!!!” Moment

Searington11/1/2018, 12:55:39 PM1 votes

Anything that would take the rng aspect of it would be fine to me, but it should still sinergize greatly with attack speed, since that's the whole point. Simply increasing autoattack damage wouldn't do it. Making them crit every N number of autoattacks, increasing frequency as the stat rises, would be the most obvious answer, and would allow you to play around them, with or against. I would be totally fine with that.

But if they're feeling creative they could just remove it completely and add non-unique passives: -One that may increase your autoattack damage everytime you hit a champion (without actually increasing you AD). Similar to Fervor of Battle, but strong enough to be as impactful as crit chance for an autoattack-based champion. -Or an item passive that acts similarly to Vayne's (Or Gnar, Kaisa, etc) on-hit stacks that procs crit strikes. -Or one that gives you stacks of Critical Strike over time, making you crit on your next aa, increasing the ammount of maximum charges and reload speed the more items with this passive you have. Or with your attack speed.

Or even an active effect that makes all your autoattacks crit for 1 to ¿6? seconds depending on your crit strike chance, or something.

I don't know, possibilities are endless.

[slayer-pantheon-thumbs]

ModKnightsKemplar10/13/2018, 1:23:13 AM1 votes

Approved!

Asobi Spirit11/14/2018, 8:44:56 PM1 votes

Making this... Impact effect sound like it's not armor pen kinda failed. I'm confused if you want crits to be an extra 50(25 for armored opponents)% damage rather than a double damage hit or something else.

It does look like you want Armor Pen to be a factor in it, to which I say proudly: "There are enough ways to kill a tank! We dont need more!" Lethality already hurts us tanks plenty, that and regular armor pen. Now Crit should still exist as it is, but Stormrazor and IE should be looked at because in my opinion they give far too much opportunity for a critical hit to happen. I saw someone here say "Make a box above the health bar showing when the Crit is gonna happen" now that could be an idea but it takes away the randomness factor of a crit.

Ultimately I dont use crit much, but making it all woogity isnt necessary.

Flashes10/14/2018, 3:29:47 AM1 votes

So you're saying...

AD% steroid + Lethality?

PandaNator4310/15/2018, 3:33:47 PM1 votes

Its a fine suggestion, likely would need number tweaks.

Giving marksmen items armor penetration furthers entrenches marksmen as a requirement to kill tanks.

I've never liked that marksmen are so required for killing tanks. Thematically/Fantasy wise, it doesn't fit. I understand why systematically they have become tank killers: AD + AS = high dps -> high dps kills tanks.

But fantasy wise, it makes more sense to see Juggernauts and Fighters (Darius) killing tanks than marksmen.

Or, diversify marksmen so that some are really good at killing tanks (Jinx) and others have different strengths: dueling (Lucian), sniping (Cait), AOE, utility etc.

Carnicore10/15/2018, 8:59:29 PM1 votes

Looks similar to my idea but you added armor penetration. I should reiterate that 50% crit chance is no different from having all your attacks deal 150% damage, so point-for-point your "impact" would be stronger than crit is now thanks to the addition of penetration.

DeathBurst10/16/2018, 5:05:06 PM1 votes

All the various suggestions here try to remove the variance from Crits. But y'all are ignoring the fact that Riot WANT variance. Crit being somewhat RNG adds unpredictability to fights, and this is something Riot want, because otherwise you perfectly know in advance who will win a fight, so the losing side just doesn't fight at all.

Riot is open to tuning HOW this variance happens exactly, as exemplified by the move from true uniform RNG to pseudo-random distributions that feel better to us humans, but any suggestion that removes variance entirely is misunderstanding the constraints of the problem they're trying to solve.