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Let's talk Top lane: Implications of the Grasp rework, fighters, and more

Ridley Prime·12/8/2017, 5:34:20 PM·2 votes·563 views

Riot's listened to the community's concerns that fighters were hurt too much by the removal of fervor. The winrate data on many fervor users seemed to support this concern, and have decided to take action based on their recent posts and changes on the PBE. (if I am incorrect on these assumptions, Riot, feel free to correct me)

In addition to buffing the particularly hurt users, and items common to these users, Riot has opted to make a more suitable 'bruiser' keystone. I believe this is absolutely the best course of action, but I think replacing grasp out of all the keystones that could be replaced is a mistake.

**TL;DR Keep grasp how it is, replace dark harvest with fervor **

A couple reasons.

  1. How many champions take grasp that aren't the target of these fighter changes? Are you not happy with the way grasp works now? Changing grasp will affect a lot of champions, and I think with changes this big you want to keep your variance to a minimum. Finding a keystone that hasn't been proven to be a well-designed and player loved one (grasp was good and healthy last season, and definitely not crazy strong this one) I think will overall result in a smoother change.

  2. Grasp becomes THE top lane keystone. Like, so little variance. Only a handful of champions would think about taking anything else, and the champions that don't are just down 130 health from everyone else. I don't think Riot or the players want this.

  3. Changing grasp leaves a lot of other champions without a good keystone or feeling bad about their keystone choices. Champs that don't have super reliably triggerable cc in lane, don't scale well with damage stats or need that extra HP (Mundo and Tahm Kench immediately come to mind). If the purpose is to give a branch of the fighter class a keystone, why take that away from others?

  4. The new grasp seems like it does too much from what I've seen on PBE. And apparently is introducing a ton of bugs, from what I could tell.

  5. And finally, the bruisers that took fervor don't always follow the grasp play pattern, and can abuse the new play pattern better than many champs. Fiora or anyone with an easy quick gapclose can keep it up and go for an auto every 4 seconds indefinitely. The flexibility of fervor being a building keystone that capped out pretty quick meant it encouraged the scraps fighters are known for, but also kept all-ins as an option. All-in's only keystone right now is Press the Attack, but not many of the champions value the attack speed - they want the AD.

And now I'd like to talk about another rune that doesn't make sense to me: Dark Harvest. We've done this dance a few times about infinite stacking damage and mad jungle farming. Feral Flare, devourer, sword of the occult. They all got removed because they were no fun, and didn't take the game in a direction you liked. I think you knew this when making Dark Harvest, but kept it kind of lackluster to avoid this problem. However, I think this just serves to make any Dark Harvest user just favor either predator or electrocute or press the attack more.

With no clear users, a bit of an unhealthy mechanic, and problems with alternative game modes, I think Dark Harvest's slot should be the 'Bruiser/Fighter' rune. Heck, I think you could just slap in the 7.22 fervor and call it a day.

This gives the champs hungry for AD a much more compelling reason to go into domination rather than the very long cooldown of electrocute. It gives them more tactical freedom to go for quick trades or for all ins, since you need to be in combat with champions to keep it up. Press the attack and lethal tempo are just more valuable for ADCs anyway, and would an AP fervor even be good on any mages with the ranged restriction?

**TL;DR Keep grasp how it is, replace dark harvest with fervor **

Side note: Glacial augment I also think falls into the dark harvest category of 'no clear users' and 'frustrating to play against if ahead'. Another utility keystone that would be good on anyone that can't figure a keystone for themselves could be: "You get a seventh item slot for your boots."

Anyway I'd love some clarification from a Rioter if this is truly the direction they want to go with grasp, and refutes to my points if anyone (even you, dear reader) disagree.

2 Comments

Godking Yuuumie12/8/2017, 6:13:06 PM1 votes

Idk why rito hates top lane but there's a sooooo many players offering solutions but they just don't seem to care. This would be fantastic but we also need more.

redniwediS12/8/2017, 7:44:48 PM1 votes

My main problem with the new Grasp is that it supports a long trade/fighting style that isn't really supported by the current play environment. Right now it's all about dealing a lot of damage and backing off, and the time it takes Grasp to scale up makes it so you'll be unlikely to break 5 stacks, even in a situation where both junglers gank at the same time in a prolonged fight.

It's like the Juggernaut update in my opinion, it's a good change, but it's a good change for an older version of the game, not the current one.

Honestly I'm worried the new Grasp will just make tank Teemo and Gnar stronger, and any other champ that has a lot of speed and likes Frozen Mallet. Have a tower fall up top to extend the lane and then freeze it as close to your tower as possible, and when the enemy laner shows up run them down. You'll be doing most of your damage with autos, and so Grasp will be proccing, and they can't get away if they try because of the slows and your seed.

I could end up being completely wrong, but it seems like yet another good idea to help melee champs that is ruined by the raw power of kiting/chasing.