If Conqueror didn't give bonus AD it would be a contender for worst rune in the game.

Cute Vegan Boy·1/2/2019, 1:41:36 AM·25 votes·9,658 views

Seriously, if you actually look at the "true damage that would have been mitigated" stat, it rarely breaks 2,000 in a long game of frequent use. People just see true damage and let out a banshee-shriek squeal as their eyes bulge out of their sockets while they fall to the floor, foaming at the mouth and seizuring.

The same thing happened when they released Zoe and people read "The bonus true damage can doubles the damage that procs it," but ignored both the cap on the damage as well as the fact that, if it dealt magic damage, the MR of the target would essentially be worth more when protecting from the second trouble bubble proc.

So when people complain that Riot doesn't listen to Boards, just remember the absolute shenanigans that this forum contains.

55 Comments

GreenKnight1/2/2019, 2:07:01 AM16 votes

20% of the damage you deal is converted into true damage, which ignores armor. If you think that's underpowered, then i don't know what else i can tell you.

SuicidePlank1/2/2019, 1:56:44 AM12 votes

They simply don't get that if Damage gets converted, it is still there, it doesn't disappear.

MrFawknSunshine1/2/2019, 1:54:35 AM3 votes

im fine with conqueror giving bonus ad but it shouldnt give bonus ad and true damage.

old battle of fevor would grand bonus ad and i could at least deal with that with armor. but in the way conqueror gives true damage and bonus ad and then IGNITE being so strong it legit punishes you in lane if you dont go that set up or cant go that set up such as playing a tank.

AORVAL1/2/2019, 4:25:01 AM2 votes

Ever since conqueror has come to league, the only way of becoming tanky is by stacking tons of health.

Want a normal tank build like this? item 3068 item 3047 item 3075 item 3065 item 3193 item 3025

Well too bad, because youll just get lit up from the true damage in the game.

Now youre forced to build like this if you want to become "tanky" enough to play league: item 3110 item 3111 item 3053 item 3083 item 3065 item 3022

Von Brohenheim1/2/2019, 6:01:12 PM2 votes

Most of it is coming from those who can't do math. The rest is probably misattribution of failure to Conqueror, rather than a lack of skill or the character using it.

Conqueror is 6 AD, or a Stat Shard at Level 1. At Level 3, when junglers are showing up, it's at 9.41 bonus AD. It's giving roughly 12 AD at Levels 4 and 5, when experience starts to slow down, and if they're going to all in you at 6, it's 14.53 bonus AD. If your complaint is they get a free Longsword and a half at Level 6 in exchange for making their plays around keeping stacks up, that's silly. You would lose less farm backing off, giving up cs, and focusing on forcing them to drop their stacks or take harass, than you would to playing a melee into a Teemo. If you can't do that, it's not the rune's fault.

At Level 13 Conqueror gives a Pickaxe worth of AD. I haven't seen anyone complain about Conqueror's bonus AD in mid/late game, oddly, even though that's probably where Conqueror has the highest gold value in a vacuum, relative to other runes.

You're right about damage conversion. The problem is, nobody understands how armor works.

Armor is a damage multiplier that is, usually, less than 1.0. Specifically, if your armor is > 0, Physical Damage = Physical Damage * (100 / (100 + Armor)) If you learned how to work with fractions, you might notice that if Armor > 0, the expression 100 + Armor will always be greater than 100, and so the denominator will always be greater.

Now, recall what we've learned about multiplying by numbers such that 1 > x > 0

Base Armor ranges from 17 (Orianna) to 47 (Braum, Leona, Tahm Kench). Armor at Level 18 ranges from 68 (Orianna) to 130 (Pyke), not counting Thresh because he gets armor from souls, not levels. ADC itemization does not currently include Armor. Mages almost never buy Tabis because it gimps their damage mid/early, and usually buy Zhonya's Hourglass, so you can add 45 to any of their armor values to calculate in mid/late game. Supports typically buy Locket of the Iron Solari (30 Armor) or Zeke's Convergence (60 Armor), so add that as appropriate.

TL;DR In other words, unless you're attacking another Fighter or a Tank, you will never be dealing with more than 200 Armor.

So let's go back to our Armor formula.

At 51.6 armor, or that Level 9 Caitlyn staring at your bot tower licking her lips, we're looking at Physical Damage * (100 / (151.6)) or Physical Damage * .66 Caitlyn's reducing 1/3 of your damage. That's a lot! Hold off on those ADC in 2019 memes!

Let's head mid instead. Kill that OP Cheese Leblanc while Hourglass is on cooldown. Level 10 Leblanc has 49 + 45 Armor with that Hourglass. Let's use the formula; Physical Damage * (100 / (194)) or Physical Damage * .52 Wait, so Leblanc can ignore just under HALF your damage? WTF silver balance team how is she even in the game???

Level 10 Maokai is pretty braindead, let's go ruin his day. He's got his Sunfire Cape (60 Armor), Stat Shards (6 Armor), Aftershock (96 Armor) and he gets armor just for being Maokai and Level 10 (70). That's a whopping 232 Armor. Physical Damage * (100 / (332)) or Physical Damage * 30 and I don't need to explain why 70% damage reduction is a big deal.

OK! So now we know how Armor works. Let's take our 3 realistic targets and see how Conqueror affects all of them.

We can represent this by modifying our formula. For brevity's sake, let X = Physical Damage. This way, we can mathematically represent True Damage as Physical while still accurately showing what happens to their health bar. Let's call our 20% True Damage .2 * X, OK? Armor's only going to apply to the other 80% of X.

Damage = (.2 * X) + (X * .8 * (100 / (100 + Armor))

See, all we've done is use math properties to apply the armor formula only to part of X. Now let's test those old numbers and compare the difference in damage reduction. (We won't be able to factor in the bonus AD, because that matters differently based on AD ratios and specific kits. But Conqueror is giving 21.35 AD right now, at Level 10)

vs 51.6 Armor: Damage = (.2 * X) + (X * .8 * (100 / (151.6)) = .73, previously .66 vs 94 Armor: Damage = (.2 * X) + (X * .8 * (100 / (194)) = .61, previously .52 vs 232 Armor: Damage = (.2 * X) + (X * .8 * (100 / (332)) = .44, previously .30

So you're getting 7% more damage against the ADC target, 9% more damage against the mid laner with hourglass target, and 14% more damage against the top lane tank with Sunfire and defensive runes. Compare with Press the Attack which is giving 10.12% increased damage at Level 10 to the same bruiser taking Conqueror. Press the Attack is also giving that bonus to your teammates.

I cannot stress this enough. We just used math and realistic examples of stuff you'll see in game to show that without factoring in the bonus AD, Conqueror is strictly worse than Press the Attack EXCEPT against targets with over ~200 armor.

The thigh guy1/3/2019, 1:22:32 AM1 votes

Conquerer is a 20% damage conversion. If you are only doing 10k damage in a game as a offensive class you are playing wrong af.

Sire Hippington1/2/2019, 7:31:24 PM1 votes

it wouldn't, it just would actually be niche for when you face multiple opponents that likely are going to get some defense, if you face 2-3 opponents that get 200 or more armor, it would still be good.

SS19861/2/2019, 2:08:39 AM1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Cute Vegan Boy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=wEJNiW4r,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-01-02T01:41:36.760+0000)

Seriously, if you actually look at the "true damage that would have been mitigated" stat, it rarely breaks 2,000 in a long game of frequent use. People just see true damage and let out a banshee-shriek squeal as their eyes bulge out of their sockets while they fall to the floor, foaming at the mouth and seizuring.

The same thing happened when they released Zoe and people read "The bonus true damage can doubles the damage that procs it," but ignored both the cap on the damage as well as the fact that, if it dealt magic damage, the MR of the target would essentially be worth more when protecting from the second trouble bubble proc.

So when people complain that Riot doesn't listen to Boards, just remember the absolute shenanigans that this forum contains.

Or maybe its just press the attack sucks lethal tempo sucks electro is worthless vs anything tanky