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Leblanc revert was a stupid idea

FeistyPoptart··58 votes·14,235 views

Honestly the rework felt a lot healthier to the game for me. She had delayed burst, aka counterplay, and a higher skill floor/ceiling than the old one with the way she had to put out combos and use her burst. Then they reverted her to the same qrw champion that instakills you with absolutely no delay which feels extremely shitty to play as and against. It literally only seems like people were complaining about her rework because it took more skill, but honestly that's what made her so much more fun. Trading in lane phase would have you to use your w to set up a q bounce and all ins REQUIRED you to land a chain(her only skillshot) but now all you have to do to trade is press q and w without moving your mouse, and bam, half of their hp bar is gone. I have played a lot of both of them and the rework felt like a very refreshing take on her kit that required you to actually land a skillshot and punished you for going in at the wrong time with the delay of her w recast.

63 Comments

Infernape28 votes

Then again, reworked Leblanc was not the most healthiest champion either. She was permabanned soon after she got reworked (even in pro play she had a near 100% pick/ban presence). Then Riot assblasted the scaling on her kit forcing her to either rely on a gimmick like double proccing Hextech Revolver and Sheen items or Hextech Gunblade to even have a chance of being useful. Not to mention, her kit was made incredibly clunky.

SugeMinPikk3 votes

{quoted}

her kit was made incredibly clunky.

I shared that opinion the first couple of times I played her.. But really, after getting used to how it works, it felt so much better. There were more inputs required, but your combo wasn't set in stone as soon as you cast your first ability. You could q-w-e, realize the jungler was coming up on your recall posiiton, and still w2-r-w out of there.

I much, much preferred the rework.

Häxel1 votes

yea, thats what it amde broken. you could jump in, cast your spells liek you wnat and still ahve ane scape jump. Prerework or reverted lb with the mikick fo last spell had/has to think how to engage cause r depends how you use your spells, now how you want it. What works kinda for heimer and karma (choosing what you want to empower) just didn't work good fo a hypermobile assassin. Also she got this free q waveclear.

Verxint5 votes

Still, there's no reason to put her back in her even worse pre-rework state. It seems to me like riot just catered to people crying about it. I found the reworked LB much more engaging and rewarding to play.

Häxel4 votes

its not 100% revert. It is actualy bewteen both pre and post rework, as dmg is still more to delayed burst shifted on e, er and qr (instead of passive just the secodn part fo each ability). E also remains not having a slow which prerwork lb had. And you hav now to use w for waveclear again, so she is punishable with either not waveclearing or no having ane scape tool/jumping into your spells.

ChaddyFantome1 votes

{quoted}

its not 100% revert. It is actualy bewteen both pre and post rework, as dmg is still more to delayed burst shifted on e, er and qr (instead of passive just the secodn part fo each ability). E also remains not having a slow which prerwork lb had. And you hav now to use w for waveclear again, so she is punishable with either not waveclearing or no having ane scape tool/jumping into your spells.

backloading the damage on revert leblanc doesn't mean anything because she still just mashes all her keys and deletes you in less than a second.

Häxel1 votes

{quoted}

backloading the damage on revert leblanc doesn't mean anything because she still just mashes all her keys and deletes you in less than a second.

she has no wavecleas beside w. Abuse it. She does not kill you till chain dmgs you. You have time to react. Even if chain hits you you can flash. the reworked lb would have jsut followed you with w or rw, reverted lb has to sue the w after the e. If she still ahs that AND maybe even r, how could she in the first palce hit you with e? jsut hide behidn enemies, don't walk into her face- She is literaly an under 50% winrate champ.

Khristophoros10 votes

I think both were equally unhealthy in different ways. The remake was really unhealthy because of how much it muddied counterplay with all its weird bullshit, yet at the same time players didn't enjoy playing her either. Now we're back to the original one that's just pure cancer to play against while giving the LB players their cheap instant kills all game.

The real problem is they didn't gut her numbers after her revert. This champ should not be viable tbh.

hi im mimic2 votes

They did gut her numbers actually. Not huge, but she is weaker early in the game than she was before

Khristophoros3 votes

Electrocute

aezens10 votes

I don´t care wheter it´s original or reworked Leblanc the only thing that bothers me about this champion is the range of etherial chains. Asssassins shouldn´t have cc anyway. They have mobility and damage that´s enought for there purpose.

However I think the main reason they reverted the change is that assassins who can´t oneshot someone fast are worthless in a game with high sustain, healing, shielding, etc.

Marothennan3 votes

Maybe they should make Assassins a cleanup class. A class that picks off supports and low health targets one by one like Assassins do in other games.

LTK KoRo2 votes

Picking off supports without picking off adcs isn't possible now, average support have more effective hp than an average adc due to redemption hp and locket mr/armor.

Marothennan1 votes

Well ofc, for assassins to become different we must change how their targets operate too.

LTK KoRo1 votes

We could start with removing tankiness from enchanters items, there's no need for bonus hp in redemption, shurelia, sightstone versions of frostfang and coin, also there's no need for magic resist in mikaels. Weren't enchanters supposed to be squishy? Their kits can self-peel really well, they don't need more safety layers with this bonus random tankiness

YumaS2Astral1 votes

{quoted}

Maybe they should make Assassins a cleanup class. A class that picks off supports and low health targets one by one like Assassins do in other games.

On my opinion assassins should be in LoL what wallbreakers are in Pokémon. Do the most damage possible to everything (tanks and squishies) before dying.

BLIGHTBRINGER1 votes

[deleted]

Automated Riven12 votes

If she hit you with chains without using w, you fucked up my dude.

BLIGHTBRINGER1 votes

[deleted]

hi im mimic3 votes

I dont think you've ever played LeBlanc.

Blåbæret9 votes

LB is ten times more fair than Zed, Talon, Kha, Rengo or Kat. The champion takes actual risk and skill to play and has to combo, unlike the duskblade auto oneshot + one ability all AD assasins are using. Frustrating to face? Sure, but still better than any of the other cancer assassins. LB basically doesn't have wave clear either.

charge attack9 votes

What the actual fuck is this comment.

“Actual risk”

Compared to Rengar.

I don’t even wanna waste my time explaining here if you’re that delusional...

LTK KoRo5 votes

Welcome to the boards, magical place where people believe assassins should lose 1 vs 1 against immobile mages

NineTailedMystic6 votes

They certainly shouldn't auto win either.

LTK KoRo4 votes

They should have a advantage if both players are equally skilled, mages and assassins shouldn't be equal in dueling power.

Assassins misses his skillshots, while mage hits theirs? Mage wins Assassin hits his skillshots while mage hits theirs? Assassin should win in 80% of the cases.

Hyquiem6 votes

Reworked Leblanc sucked to play after the nerfs. First you could abuse the waveclear mechanic but they even made that trash. Revert is nice and not broken. The fact she has low range gives you a lot of counter play

Ghazter5 votes

"low range"

Yeah the double hop smashing your face and then blinking back half the map away is 'low range'. Her W doesn't seem to have a range limit and it's near impossible to get out of once it's on you short of flashing TWICE.

SEKAI6 votes

{quoted}

Reworked Leblanc sucked to play after the nerfs. First you could abuse the waveclear mechanic but they even made that trash. Revert is nice and not broken. The fact she has low range gives you a lot of counter play

"The fact she has low range"

You have never seen her chain's range.

Also, range is irrelevant anyway, seeing her just fly across the screen back and forth constantly.

Witch of Babylon6 votes

The chain range is smaller than the tether tho

TheKingOfBiches3 votes

Better for a champion to feel bad playing AS than AGAINST. Reverted lebroken is cancer

Marothennan6 votes

Ofc it was, she was reworked for a reason after all. Reverting her was just a lazy way of "fixing" her problems.

hi im mimic6 votes

There are a couple things about your comment that confuse me. For reference, I call the current state of LeBlanc "original" and the clunky version I call "rework".

First, the skill ceiling between the two versions of LeBlanc. You mention that the rework had I higher skill ceiling or was more complicated to play. I have to whole heartedly disagree with you on this point.

She theoretically had a more combos than ever before because of toggle ultimate, however, since her W did next to nothing in terms of damage it was used as primarily a gap closer or passive application. This limited what combos were viable, making her much easier imo.

Second is the age old excuse that I always see. Original leblanc just one shots everything! It's so easy!

Yes, when fed she can one shot any carry who has built 0 MR. But the same can be said for any assassin. I've seen Zed, Talon, Katarina all one shot people when they are fed out of their minds and the enemies fail to build any MR or Armour. Hell, I've even seen Wukong do the same thing and hes not even classified as an assassin.

But the other thing you mention is that she can just QRW people. She can...if people are that stupid to walk up in range of the combo. The only people I pull that off on are people who dont respect the damage or dont have vision of me. If someone is constantly dying to QRW then they dont understand how to play safely. You would also have to be pretty fed and killing someone with 0 MR as well. That's their problem, not a problem with the champion.

La Bello5 votes

its funny because Riots entire reasoning was that new R provided too much mobility in options specifically the fact that she had double dashes available as a get out of jail free card made her too frustrating to play against.

so why not REVERT THE ULTIMATE but keep everything else, delayed burst and all? it honestly made no sense to me and felt like a kneejerk attempt to satisfy /rLeblanc mains or some crap.

the most frustrating part is for me is that since LeBlanc already got attention is EXTREMELY likely that she wont be getting any more mini-reworks/VGU's until a 4 years from now same

ChaddyFantome1 votes

{quoted}

its funny because Riots entire reasoning was that new R provided too much mobility in options specifically the fact that she had double dashes available as a get out of jail free card made her too frustrating to play against.

so why not REVERT THE ULTIMATE but keep everything else, delayed burst and all? it honestly made no sense to me and felt like a kneejerk attempt to satisfy /rLeblanc mains or some crap.

the most frustrating part is for me is that since LeBlanc already got attention is EXTREMELY likely that she wont be getting any more mini-reworks/VGU's until a 4 years from now same

this

FilDaFunk5 votes

Delays are not counterplay. The new one felt like shit to play.

DepressedTomoko4 votes

It's like you don't understand how to play back, shove, count cooldowns, or anything. If she really was like this, she'd been picked and banned 100% in every pro game already. Old LeBlanc was extremely unhealthy with gank immunity due to a free RW when as this LeBlanc has to have W up to use her ulti to W. You wonder why the reworked LeBlanc got gutted on her W damage while the original LeBlanc never did? Because she was broken and unbalanced. Riot didn't want to remove an assassin tribute from a champion, nor live with an overloaded reworked champ, so they reverted her.

Glory973 votes

The reworked lb is healthy on paper, but it can never work in a game where every range character, including the dps-champs can burst squishies in 0.5 sec. And when reworked lb was viable (right after the rework release), she was only viable because she had such an oppressive early game so that any somewhat decent lb player could easily snowball and be 10/0 at 15 mins. At that time as a midlaner you'd be dead instantly once she lands her e onto you, even if you have flash up.

ChaddyFantome1 votes

{quoted}

The reworked lb is healthy on paper, but it can never work in a game where every range character, including the dps-champs can burst squishies in 0.5 sec. And when reworked lb was viable (right after the rework release), she was only viable because she had such an oppressive early game so that any somewhat decent lb player could easily snowball and be 10/0 at 15 mins. At that time as a midlaner you'd be dead instantly once she lands her e onto you, even if you have flash up.

then the problem wasn't Leb. it was that DPS champions were bursting people.

KingBlackthorn13 votes

I don't think so. I literally never saw her played ever and still never see her ever.

Teridax682 votes

I think we're judging the rework by the wrong criteria here. Of course reverting LeBlanc wasn't going to turn her into an unhealthy champion, Old LB was notorious for having an incredibly unhealthy play pattern. The problem was that New LeBlanc wasn't meaningfully better: not only did she feel worse to play to the near-totality of LeBlanc players, she was also unhealthy in many different ways. In the early stages of the game, her chain could deal an obscene amount of damage and was excessively difficult to escape from, and later on, her ability to duplicate any ability at will, regardless of her previous spell order, meant she could play a kite mage without any real drawbacks, giving herself far too many escapes without impeding the major part of her damage output. Because this rework did not significantly improve LeBlanc, or really improve her that much at all, a revert was warranted. Does this mean that we'll stick with this version of LeBlanc forever? Likely not, she still has gameplay issues that her rework had set to fix. However, whichever form she'll take will likely be different from that of her rework, and in the meantime, her current state is what satisfies the greater number of players.

HZB2 votes

lel https://i.imgur.com/ARjHwtP.png

UF Dan2 votes

Old Leblanc was the clunkiest shit in the world. Using ult was so hard and the weird 180 second passive was completely out of place and at best was a little gimmicky. Old Leblanc also relied only on landing E for her passive damage. I get what her passive change was aimed at doing, but it had no place in her kit it did not synergize with her W or Q at all. Overall Reworked Leblanc was a extremely unhealthy for that champ in regards to gameplay. Leblanc right now, just like before rework leblanc, has always had the same exact solution in terms of counterplay. Build MR. Building Maw against this champ is the equivalent of deleting her off the game.

AR URF2 votes

I'll say this about reworked leblanc. Her passive made it so fun to clear minion waves and push lanes. Now it's just go to the person who's squishy or almost dead behind a tower and kill them.

Cunning Enigmah2 votes

"It literally only seems like people were complaining about her rework because it took more skill"

the 2.5 second proc was ruining her class as an assassin mage (which wasn't the point of the rework), 2.5 seconds is long enough to have her killed before being able to proc her passive, they didn't revert her for no reason at all, the rework turned her into a moving ward that doesn't do much in team fights even, she had no W damage and had to solemnly relay on a passive that's just not healthy for her class's kit, while I do miss her ult that can spawn a clone of hers, the problem was you cannot even control the mirror, which is 50% of how to play old leblanc, and players quickly began to catch up on who was the real leblanc

Leblanc has one of the hardest kits while being one of the mushiest champions in league, if she lands one wrong W she's dead, if she misses one E she'd lose over 50% of her kit's overall damage, which were her weaknesses, adding more skill for nothing that counterbalances her weaknesses (which was a hard thing to do for riot since she becomes completely overpowered if they buff her) only was a mistake that riot realized the hard way and reverted her back

OgSc1 votes

Some champs have a kit that is hella volatile. If they have the damage numbers, the kits actually work, but by doing so, the kits end up hella strong. On the flipside, if these volatile kits dont have the damage numbers, then they fall flat. Imo, LeBlanc is one of those volatile champs that needs the damage numbers to even work right. At this point, I honestly feel Riot would need to completely change every single ability of hers or change some key abilities that would completly change how the champ acts (like aatrox), for the sake of actually making her kit less volatile. Cuz holy shit its either she gets the damage and everybody and their granny plays her, or she don't get shit and she gets the ryze treatment.

DuskDaUmbreon1 votes

Pre-revert LB had her own set of issues, but I agree that it was probably healthier for the game overall.

There has to be some kind of balance between the two - Pre-revert's clunky delay and live's instaburst.

Velasan1 votes

Neither one works that well. If it makes you feel better current LB gets a headache from either Zed, Fizz, or anyone who can tank her combo and burst her back like Vlad or Swain.

I play Swain and you just E on top of her when she teleports and then she either has to eat your E when she jumps back or stay where she is and take Q's to the face. It's not pretty.

i cant move wtf1 votes

Nope. The rework was clunky, uninspired garbage that no one asked for. Most LB players were open to a rework but not some half-assed junk put together by a silver 2 player. How are you even talking about LB when new Akali has just been revealed?

PaffWasTaken1 votes

Pre-revert Leblanc was by far in her more balanced/manageable state that she ever was. Why they brought her back to the state that caused her to be changed at the first place is beyond me.

LegitBusinessman1 votes

If you can Q W someone you can win lane as LB. Her damage is ridiculous.

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